ANDREW (TRUSTY) -- YOU NEED TO RESPOND HERE (Admin request)

[WAFU Man]

But that's my point - who's to say that they do?

That they do what?

Know best.

 

[seanf]

This is fun! But I do have years of experience dealing with Chinese and other SE Asian businessmen, and I have an open mind.

WAFU-- I understand what you're saying, and I don't necessarily disagree with it. But I've made this point before, and I'll make it again. We may not have the leverage to control Jandrew or force them to do anything they don't want to do, but that's fine. I'm sure Jandrew will find lots of other people to be purchasers. But that's not the point, and that's not why we're having this debate. The issue--the ONLY issue-- is whether someone with those business practices should be endorsed by RWI and given a place to be a "trusted dealer." It's about protecting the members from abusive business practices. That's it.

 

[WAFU Man]

But that's my point - who's to say that they do?

That they do what?

Oh, you didn't get it.... WAFU Man has been here for less than 45 days and 13 posts.... but he's got the whole thing figured out... what the F were we thinking...

I am going to immediately resign and promote him to master of the world....

Much appreciated - recognition is always appreciated - you have exceeded my expectations! :wink:

 

[supermanx]

Me, I took my own action to resolve the "cartel pricing issue"..... I dont buy new reps from dealers anymore and I just wait for reps that simpletons bought for full price to come in our sales section as USED AND/OR ALMOST NEW and save me a chunk of money.

I've always bought alot of watches in the used section, and you know what the prices are so inflated because they bought at $600 that even the used prices are more then a reasonable markup of the dealer's actual cost.

 

[sub4me]

This is F u c k e d up.

 

[doctorron]

Guys - I'm afraid that if I was a dealer reading this thread, particulary one from SE Asia, I would be having a good chuckle at the 'round eyes' willingness to lose huge amounts of face over something that is, culturally to them, business as usual.

I do appreciate that we are going about this like white (or black or Asian American) middle class guys. I guess this is what we are. Although now well established in the middle class, I am from a culture where people are bullied, intimidated and ultimately expected to respect the boss. Also, one keeps his mouth shut and just stirs clear of the boss; or, if you want the boss' product, you suck it up and pay the piper. Of coarse, the cartel may not be the "boss" I think they are... maybe the factory. At any rate, thanks for putting in your two cents, I appreciate your point.

 

[LegendofSpeed]

Much appreciated - recognition is always appreciated - you have exceeded my expectations! :wink:

you know wafu man... i get this feeling in the future i am either going to love you or hate you.... i hoping for love my friend...

we accept all constructive criticism... believe me, we don't think we're perfect... we appreciate and consider every member's opinion....

to be fair though, you have come into this thread challenging our abilities without knowing anything... you have made assumptions that can not be proven...

 

[WAFU Man]

This is fun! But I do have years of experience dealing with Chinese and other SE Asian businessmen, and I have an open mind.

WAFU-- I understand what you're saying, and I don't necessarily disagree with it. But I've made this point before, and I'll make it again. We may not have the leverage to control Jandrew or force them to do anything they don't want to do, but that's fine. I'm sure Jandrew will find lots of other people to be purchasers. But that's not the point, and that's not why we're having this debate. The issue--the ONLY issue-- is whether someone with those business practices should be endorsed by RWI and given a place to be a "trusted dealer." It's about protecting the members from abusive business practices. That's it.

With my serious head back on (which I admit did go missing for a while) - that's truly a worthy cause, it's just the way of going about it that I believe is flawed. If the members believe in the power of RWI and wish to protect themselves from 'gouging', then it should be a straight forward case of presenting the evidence as it stands (for and against), allowing the members to act as the jury (a poll perhaps?) and, if found guilty, the administrators to act as the judiciary and pass sentence (removal of Trusted Dealer status?).

 

[LegendofSpeed]

we have presented the evidence in numerous threads.... and there is even a poll in existence already....

 

[WAFU Man]

we have presented the evidence in numerous threads.... and there is even a poll in existence already....

Point taken, perhaps it just needs pulling together now?

 

[caravaggio]

Me, I took my own action to resolve the "cartel pricing issue"..... I dont buy new reps from dealers anymore and I just wait for reps that simpletons bought for full price to come in our sales section as USED AND/OR ALMOST NEW and save me a chunk of money.

I've always bought alot of watches in the used section, and you know what the prices are so inflated because they bought at $600 that even the used prices are more then a reasonable markup of the dealer's actual cost.

GOOD POINT

i agree

 

[LegendofSpeed]

well... after 12 pages... i think it is time to lock it up....

i will reopen this should Andrew wish to add to the discussion....

 

[LegendofSpeed]

actually.... let's let this run a little longer....

 

[seanf]

Agree. Andrew (or Josh)-- this really is your last chance. Don't squander it.

 

[WAFU Man]

we have presented the evidence in numerous threads.... and there is even a poll in existence already....

Point taken, perhaps it just needs pulling together now?

Just looking at the Poll, wouldn't it be better to have a straight Guilty/Not Guilty question to the Members and leave it up to the Administrators to decide punishment (if found guilty of course!)?

 

[RobbieG]

Wow I'm floored by all this. The seriousness that some take this stuff just baffles me. So now purchasers of illegal products are trying to control what happens between the competition of the suppliers of these goods? You have got to be kidding me. I have bought maybe two watches in the last five years from Andrew and so I'm not defending him, but I hope he does have a so called monopoly on some products. It is called good business to me. If I move the most product in my business and as a result of that I get preferential treatment from my suppliers good for me. I hope he did do everything he is accused of if that is the case. All it means is the factory knows he has the most juice and moves the most product. Again just good biz. Small guys are going to finish last in all walks of life and they are going to have to learn to live with it. The funny thing is that the flip side of the coin here is that the small dealers accusing him of these things are now in turn trying to use it as a weapon to get him banned here for what? Surprise, to gain an edge for themselves and more business. Good for them too. This is just good ole' corporate warfare and I love it. But you guys are really going too far when you are trying to control the supply chain of something you know nothing about and are not connected too in any way. Give it a rest. The factories are going to grant juice to those in power and there is nothing anyone here can do about it. Cartel. That still makes me laugh. I love it. You guys think this is like the blow biz from the 80's or something. Get over yourselves. Maybe it is time to just buy gens from now on as you are setting up for many more disappoinments if you are trying to "moralize" this of all industries. LOL. One way or another, the FACTORY will get your money so what difference does it make? All dealers are just what Andrew said they are - salesmen. This is really just laughable. I mean do you really expect to be able to regulate the whole damn watch industry from here if all dealers don't have equal product and prices now? This isn't Wall Street and these aren't publicly traded entities the last I checked. I also might add that even if they were what difference would that make? Right now Breitling is buying ETA stuff at deep discounts not available to Chronoswiss because they are small and ETA is exploiting that and Breitling is in on it. Do you call out Breitling and ETA now for causing financial hardship to Chronoswiss who can't get the same price or the same quantity because they are being bullied into paying higher prices by a giant competitor? This is just standard stuff in any industry here guys and I am baffled at how many seem somehow "entitled" to be a part of this. Competition between suppliers is no concern to you. Can you tell I am a defender of free marktes? LOL. Mind your own business - in Switzerland and in China.

 

[koster88]

If this *was* a fact..... ....and Andrew did contact these small dealers for being a few bucks cheaper... ....and they were so upset about it, that they would just start mentioning it.... ...wouldn't they *post* the email? You know, I dont know andrew, have never delt with him. I say that if we can put this rummor out into the air. Then we can also put the facts into the air too. Who are the 3 small dealers who feel that they are bullied? Lets see the E-mails they got from Andrew.

The rest is Gossip. Good for Soap Opra, not much else.........

Koster, I'm not sure I see where you're coming from at all. There have been allegations made by three dealers directly to the RWI admin about Andrew's conduct. They came to the RWI admin precisely because they wanted us to know about this and, if necessary, take appropriate action. Before we take any action whatsoever, we wanted to allow Andrew an opportunity to respond to the allegations. And my concern is that Andrew has not yet done that. So, with respect, are you saying that it would be better for the RWI Admin to simply ignore this, not inform members, and not allow Andrew the opportunity to respond? Because that is not in keeping with the RWI philosophy.

Again....... I think we all Want to know *WHO*, and see proof of these E-mails that have been sent from andrew. Is there any proof what so ever of any of this? Like maybe even a little bit?!

 

[LegendofSpeed]

Already posted....

 

[LegendofSpeed]

More proof here:

 

[koster88]

and Koster? Well, he calls it as he sees it..

he does not perhaps have seven years experience and memory on forums..

Thats true. I dont. Just my opinion. Thats what a forum is for right?