[RESOLVED]Enough is enough. I want my money back.

[markdevon35]

Ok - thanks i understand that im not at risk (if there is indeed any risk) nor other new members. I have done some research and think I know who it is now - that is I think I know? Anyway I hope you guys get it sorted out and a good conclusion is reached.

Just before I go though - Rooster - I agree one offs etc take time (I do know) but a strange business model for the customer to take all the risk - wouldnt you agree? Im sure when I did my MBA they would have thrown me out suggesting this model would get funding (standfast VC's)

 

[I am Sam]

I wonder why not Admin stop further sale for this dealer till all the issues older than 45 days are resolved. That will protect new members too...??? Throwing money to a problem is not the solution to it at all?

 

[rooster133]

Just before I go though - Rooster - I agree one offs etc take time (I do know) but a strange business model for the customer to take all the risk - wouldnt you agree? Im sure when I did my MBA they would have thrown me out suggesting this model would get funding (standfast VC's)

I think that if your business plan involved manufacturing and exporting counterfeit items your lecturer probably wouldn't have started by asking you "how do you plan to get funding?"

 

[ahw676]

I wonder why not Admin stop further sale for this dealer till all the issues older than 45 days are resolved. That will protect new members too...??? Throwing money to a problem is not the solution to it at all?

This is a different situation altogether from what any of the other dealers are doing. This dealer is not taking new orders, he's trying to complete the orders which have been placed previously. But rest assured that the admin will not allow him to initiate any new deals. As everyone else has stated, we just want to see the original orders get fulfilled.

And I understand what everyone else is saying on this being a queer business model to follow. But if anyone has gone to a bank to ask about a loan for an illegal/counterfeit enterprise and gotten it, I would love to hear about it. So what's the alternative? A loan from the Chinese mafia?

 

[markdevon35]

I think that if your business plan involved manufacturing and exporting counterfeit items your lecturer probably wouldn't have started by asking you "how do you plan to get funding?"

You would probably be very suprised by the amount of business plans that got presented to banks for funding when it was bloody obvoius that somebody was going to take a fall - all that mattered to them was instant profits were taken/made!

Im sure however that this is NOT the case we are dealing with though? As you said one offs etc take time - 1 year is it? What else does this watch do?

 

[hooligan]

Alright, alright, everyone settle down.

There have been regular updates that were widely discussed with regards to delays and changes of delivery dates. No one is or has been forced to participate. carnut wants out now, and that shouldn't be a problem. If it becomes a problem, the staff will step in and do all we can.

Please everyone, keep in mind that this isn't the first time this dealer as run a project with the EXACT SAME payment details/schedule. So far, no one has been scammed that I'm aware of.

Again, if carnut can't get his refund, the staff will take action. At this point, we really have no reason to believe that people won't get their watches. We just don't know how soon that will be and the dealer has been very transparent about that.

EDIT -- If you can't figure out who/what is being discussed here, you're just not trying, so please stop screaming for people to post a name.

 

[rooster133]

You would probably be very suprised by the amount of business plans that got presented to banks for funding when it was bloody obvoius that somebody was going to take a fall - all that mattered to them was instant profits were taken/made!

Why would I be surprised?

Im sure however that this is NOT the case we are dealing with though? As you said one offs etc take time - 1 year is it? What else does this watch do?

Don't know. I'm sure looking forward to finding out though.

 

[markdevon35]

Why would you be suprised?

Because we are in the hobby of using trusted dealers? All im saying is that not everybody is trustworthy..... Then again maybe you won't be supprised.. Maybe you have first hand experience of dealing with less than honest individuals.

 

[ThreadLocker]

Out of control and off-target

It seems that this topic has blown very far off course....posts questioning business models? asking for bank funding?

Bottom line: A valued mmber here has already lost his deposit.....he is trying not to lose th rest of his money....he has mailed the dealer with no response.....without a response from the dealer (who should not be left nameless, at this point), he should do whatever it takes to get his money back....if you wish to blame someone for potential PayPal issues, turn your attention to the dealer! The reason this forum exists is to assist in keeping members from being scammed....seems like the scam is on here.....if not, why is the dealer not responding?

Sometimes deals and dealers go bad...our goal should be to limit the damage...carnut is attempting to do that and I support him.

Remember Tim? or TWP? Is this the next big scam here? Several more of these and we will be ranked with the likes of IdealReplicas, et al.

Either carnut gets his watches, his money, or at least a response from the dealer....barring a response, the PayPal disspute should be unquestioned and mandated!!!

Just my opinion...lets not follow the path of RG, and protect dealers even when they are wrong

 

[markdevon35]

Hooligan - you are spot on - so I won't carry on. Sorry old chap :notworthy:

 

[hooligan]

I'm going to say it again, slowly, given the past performance of this dealer, using the exact same payment plan, we have no reason to think people will not get their watches.

Again, if carnut can't get his refund, the staff will step in and do all we can. He has NOT lost his deposit, yet. And it's only been a short time (24hrs? Slightly more?) since carnut requested his refund, so let's not jump the gun there, either.


@mark - no need for an apology, my friend. I think we can all agree that this situation for carnut (and everyone else with a deposit paid) is not how anyone would want it, including the dealer. So, now it's just time to get to work and get carnut sorted. I'm confident that is the way this will all play out, honestly.

 

[rooster133]

 

[ahw676]

Bottom line: A valued mmber here has already lost his deposit.....he is trying not to lose th rest of his money....he has mailed the dealer with no response.

He has NOT lost his deposit though. He has not been delivered the item yet, but then, no one has. We anticipate that everyone WILL eventually get their orders fulfilled. Unfortunately, we don't know when that will be.

 

[markdevon35]

How did you tie that knot with those fingers?

 

[ThreadLocker]

He has NOT lost his deposit though. He has not been delivered the item yet, but then, no one has. We anticipate that everyone WILL eventually get their orders fulfilled. Unfortunately, we don't know when that will be.

If he drops his PayPal dispute, will you guarantee that he will receive the product? Or refund his money yourself? Do not make a claim that he has not lost anything unless you can back it up.....I do not think that you were here when the issues with Tim and Troy (TWP).......everything seems on the level, until it is not....when that happens, it is too late and those invested with the dealer lose.

If all is well, and the dealer can be trusted, why no response to messages? If I had someones money for over a year, I would give them the respect of a response.....a trusted dealer should as well.....a dealeror admin that is on the run, like TWP or Tim, fails to respond....seems that this situation is turning bad and until carnut gets a response, I shall hold that belief.

I HATE when admin takes the dealer's side when they have dropped the ball.....failing to respond to customers while you hold their cash is unacceptable.

 

[hooligan]

Uh, Threadlocker you're missing the point. She said he *hasn't* lost his deposit. You said he has. He has not lost his deposit yet, because he hasn't heard back from the dealer. You and I don't know what will happen, so all we can do is try to keep making contact. Again - IT'S ONLY BEEN ABOUT 24 HRS.

Yes, I would have expected a response to his PM, too, but that's not what happened. Does that guarantee that carnut won't get a refund? Not by a mile.

And to have the balls to accuse the staff of protecting a dealer, after this site more than any other has demonstrated that we put the members first, is beyond ridiculous. However, what we will not do is break out the torches and pitchforks for no reason.

This dealer has been open about the delays and has been active here on the site in the past day or two. There is no reason to go flying off the handle yet. Be assured that if action is warranted, we will not hesitate -- and I, for one, am more than a little angry that you implied otherwise.

 

[ThreadLocker]

You just admitted that the dealer has been active here for the past few days....why no response for carnut then? Let's hold the dealers accountable for the their actions as well as their lack there of. Carnut had to act or the deadline would have passed...after the deadline, a sorry from amin will do nothing for him. Will you gethis back if this goes south? If so, I am sure he will retract his PayPal dispute. If not, then he is gonna do what is necessary to recoup his cash minus the deposit. You are now mad at me? Upset with carnut, the paranoid jerk? Where are those feelings for the dealer whose failed response started this? Misplaced anger?

BTW----taking action after the deadline will do nothing to help carnut, that is what I am saying.....not that I think admin will do nothing......Tim and TWP are gone, but with oher people's money

 

[KBH]

I personally think it will all work out for Carnut. It is the weekend, by the way. Not everyone sits home on their computers to answer messages and PMs.

What I would like answered is a clear and concise schedule of when we can see some of these orders being shipped. If it looks like its going to be another 6 months, then tell us and let us decide on whether or not we want to wait that long. And assure us that the money is available for the refunds. Nice and simple.

 

[hooligan]

So we're now to hold every dealer to a <48 hr response time to PMs? Is that it?

You're being unreasonable, quite honestly. The fact is that no one knows why he hasn't responded, yet. However, not enough time has past to justify any sort of punishment from the staff. We've reached out to he dealer in question on carnut's behalf. Let's wait and see what happens.

To lump him in with Tim and TWP is a gross exaggeration at this point and you know it.

I'm done debating with you on this, as it has zero bearing on carnut's issue - which is the point of this thread.

 

[ThreadLocker]

So we're now to hold every dealer to a <48 hr response time to PMs? Is that it?

You're being unreasonable, quite honestly. The fact is that no one knows why he hasn't responded, yet. However, not enough time has past to justify any sort of punishment from the staff. We've reached out to he dealer in question on carnut's behalf. Let's wait and see what happens.

To lump him in with Tim and TWP is a gross exaggeration at this point and you know it.

I'm done debating with you on this, as it has zero bearing on carnut's issue - which is the point of this thread.

Did I say that? Who is being unreasonable here?

The dealer has his money, has logged in here and been active, has read carnut's message and failed to respond.....is this acceptable? If it is, maybe we should re-evaluate the "trusted-dealer" standard. Obviously, you and I look at this situation differently......I hope this works out for carnut.....I shall watch and see