i dont know if there is a ....

[ahw676]

2) I'm surprise this thread has lasted this long. I thought religion and politics were a no no on forums.

You're certainly correct that this is not the sort of thread that we would normally solicit. And you're also right that I'm a little deeper into this discussion than I probably should be. We do try not to censor information more than we have to, and when Pec asked a question, I couldn't help answering.

And probably the reason for this is the very one that you mentioned--it's exciting to hear Pec ask the questions that he is. Although he is obviously not particularly inclined to agree with me at this point, the fact that he's asking implies that there's a chance that there's more than one possible answer, even the ones that he finds ludicrous at the moment.

 

[ThinkBachs]

My definition of God: The energy that holds everything together and it's ability to interact with everything around it. With that said, it's laughable that any human could possibly begin to understand or reasonably contemplate that man-made deity most commonly referred to as God. We don't even understand ourselves- how can we possibly begin to grasp the concept of something larger than ourselves?

 

[ThinkBachs]

there is 1 thing that i do think is true ,
we do have some kind of energy inside , it can be called soul or whatever u want , i dont really know what happens when we die , but i think the energy is with us

At least we know one thing, energy cannot be destroyed, but simply transformed.

 

[ThinkBachs]

You're certainly correct that this is not the sort of thread that we would normally solicit.....

The way I look at it, we have a community that shares a common interest, and much more. We often know when someone isn't doing well, what other interests people have, how pretty another member's girlfriend or wife is (and wonder where we went wrong), the kind of cars we drive, dogs we have, and so many other things....

It's nice to have a thread where we can share something a little different. When done with careful consideration and thoughtfulness, a conversation such as this is something that adds value to each one of us. It challenges what we know (or think we know) and provides our brains with an opportunity to expand our consciousness beyond the daily superficial.

 

[waterluver]

Man always says show me and i will trust You...God says trust me and I will show you....FAITH

 

[trailboss99]

Many moons ago I was an admin on a forum called atomicmpc.com.au
Upon said forum someone began a thread called " Jesus: Just a man?"
It ran for 500 pages or more (I'm too lazy to go and look, someone else can).

Wonder about the life of this one.


Tranman: Why would we even think of closing reasoned debate on any subject? Unlike some fora we do not dictate what you may and may not discuss.

 

[tommy_boy]

Since I know absolutely nothing about anthropology, I won't argue those issues. I can only say that regardless of whether organized religion tends to result in power shifts, I don't feel that individual people are all necessarily motivated that way.

Believe me, it doesn't make me feel powerful whatsoever.

My point here was poorly made. My bad.

Better stated, "Missions organized by the church are..."

Individuals who are passionate abut anything are naturally going to, at some point, be on a mission of sorts. Their motivations are simpler and personal. I would never presume to make a sweeping statement about personal missions.

For example: My wife now wears several watches in rotation. I converted her from seeing a watch as a timekeeping device to seeing it as a fashion accessory! :lol:

 

[avenger007]

The is a pretty cool discussion. My father has pastored a small church for 30+ years, and I grew up going to church at least twice a week. I've seen some really cool and amazing things and met some great folks. I've also seen pettiness, greed, strife, and quite a few other undesirable examples of human behavior. People are people and life happens.

Jesus talked about two builders desiring to build a house. One guy wanted to live on the beach, so he built his house on the sand. He built it fast and cheap which left him plenty of time for beach BBQ's and volleyball. Then the storm came. It completely wiped out what he had built. The other guy built his house on a stone foundation. He made sure his structure was attached to something solid. It took longer and cost him more, but when the storm came, all that he had labored to build was still standing. Being a Christian doesn't stop the storms of life from coming, but having our lives anchored to Christ Jesus sure does a lot to minimize the damage.

 

[RWIGWH]

What if I don't believe what you believe? If you don't believe in my God, the way my faith has commanded you too, you will be punished. If you don't believe in my God, you are going to hell. If you don't believe in my God, I will kill you in Gods name.
Why do I need your approval? Why must I follow your beliefs? What makes you think God's law is based on fear and suffering. Why must I be punished? What have I done wrong? What gives you the right to kill in the name of God? What gives you the right to to use God as a weapon?
Now, Define free will.

 

[R2D4]

I like to believe that there was, once upon a time, a man who was followed, admired, chastised, loved, ridiculed... ect. (You know the rest, or you have heard.) It seems to me his life could have been embellished in writing just as much as it could have been down played. It is a book after all.. this Holly Bibble (Holly like the tree and bibble that sounds like bib-le). That is up to you decide what to believe.

Did he exist? I think he did and does still exist through writing and spirit with us. It doesn't matter if you are in a tribe in Africa or a Mud Hut in Afghanistan the same animal instincts are there. There is still love, hate, theft... ect. These "temptations" are hardwired in all of man from day one. There are just different degrees of sin, but still sin.

It doesn't matter what religion you are does it? Are you a "member" of said church if you don't pay? All that is between you and the big man. I grew up Methodist, my parents were Catholic and Lutheran. My wife is Catholic and I go to a Catholic Church now. (Not as often as I should) In my mind, I am at peace knowing he did exist and he will forgive me for my sins if I acknowledge and ask for forgiveness. He cannot grant me wishes like a genie, you(we) have to make good things happen on your own. The good things you do come back to you in some form. I am with Cybee on this one on the literal interpretation and where to apply it.

Anyhoo that is what I think. Good thread Pec.

 

[trksh-bzr]

hm, I don't believe in anything.

some will think that is sad, but really, where I live, hardly anyone that is less than 65 believes in religion.
some will answer that they do believe when asked. if you stall for a second, they will continue " at least some of it", and if you ask about details from the bible, they will say" well I think the bible has some nice methaphors in it", to which I agree. I just don't believe anything at all. nothing. I think that when my old 1 cylindar pump stops running, that will be it. the end.
you know what, that is the most calming thought fo me to think.

I always imagine to be somehow religious. imagineing that I would feel bad or incomplete that I had failed to acomplish certain things that would do me good in my lifelong quest to become a good religious person.
there are always things that could have been done, more things than one can ever accomplish.

In denmark, the church is funded by tax money, 1 % of your annual income infact.
You become a member automatically if your parents have you name given in church.
You can always choose not to be a member of the church.

-I got married in a church, because it is a traditional place to get married, and as I was a member of the church at the time, I decided to get married there.
some might think of that as being cynical, but if the church in your country is a public federal institution payed by tax money, you as a paying member also have th priviledge to get married in the fantastic place that the church is. (yes, I appreciate the church for historical value and amazing beauty)

I am nolonger a member of the church here. I had a very unpleasent conversation with the priest in the church, and it made me think more about my thoughts about the church. I then learned that the church in a cultural and historical sense is preserved by other funds than the church tax, and since I was only paying it to help saving old beautiful churches, I might aswell not be a member, and here after support the churches by my normal income tax, which keeps all our 200, 400, 800 year old churches around and in good shape.

it's so interessting to hear about other peoples thoughts on these things. I am actually surprised that so many people still believe in god. I mean really really believe.
I think it's a good thing that many do. for most people religion ( no matter which) provides good life content.
I am not gonna mention the obvious things where religion is causing problems, because it would be too much writing, and because 99% of the problems are caused by 0,1 % of the people.


I am glad for the people that find peace and happiness in religion.
I always think that if something makes you happy, than it is amazing when you can find the power and focus to practise it. I think religion serves to create a lot of comfort for a lot of people, kids and familys all over the world. fantastic, that is wonderfull.

I only get a little sad when religion is discussed like a science. some voices will make it sound like there is a well documented science behind their views, which automatically then disregards other believs.
remember that there are always other people that have totally different believes, or none at all. all views are equal and must be respected

find pleasure in listening to what individuals think or believe.
accept that we are born in different corners of this planet, and with different premises, learning what causes others to believe more or less can only make you become the owner of a larger life understanding, and make you more sure of why you believe or don't.





I only posted this to shed some light on the thoughts of a non believer.

And great to see how we can have a thread on such a sensitive suvbject running 5 pages with a great tone.

 

[ThinkBachs]

Man always says show me and i will trust You...God says trust me and I will show you....FAITH

Man always says show me and i will trust You...[ religious man says that ] God says trust me and I will show you....FAITH

Fixed, all better now. :lol:

 

[PecMan]

guys, good comments , opinions , points of view , it is interesting to read what u guys think and some expiriences.

i will be clear here .
when it comes about religion , catolic , christian , baptist .......... ....
that is a big jocke for me ! lots of people talking shit about why this guys are bad and we are good and bla bla , i am 100% against what religion is the best .

now, i have allways believed in god and many times i went to church
i can tell u that 80% of the time , it made me sick ! why? all the time u find the worst people there , they even think they are saints! everyone will burn in hell but them ! i know i know! it is only people but it bothers me a lot , that and many other reasons
hey! if u go to a place where u get together with nice people and u share stuff and u grow as a better person ... well amazing!!!! that is good , i am not against that

have u seen how the world works? have u seen a tiger killing a cute bambi? have u seen how hard life is ?
im from a country were u can c a lot of pain
I DO UNDERSTAND! THAT PAIN IS NOT GOD'S WORK !
BUT ! IF PAIN AND BAD STUFF DOESNT HAVE TO DO WITH GOD , THEN ANYTING GOOD HAS TO DO WITH HIM AS WELL !
u cant just say , thanks god becouse i woke up today and im feeling good!
couse if u say that , he would become responsable for all the people that woke up sick and innocent children dying ...

i understand that life with out problems become boring and pain is necessary , and u can not realize whats beautifull if u dont c the uglynest , i do understand everything but
my point it , IF THERE IS A GOD!! he already did his job and he doesnt have anything !! to do with us and our planet

 

[mike 8]

hm, I don't believe in anything.

some will think that is sad, but really, where I live, hardly anyone that is less than 65 believes in religion.
some will answer that they do believe when asked. if you stall for a second, they will continue " at least some of it", and if you ask about details from the bible, they will say" well I think the bible has some nice methaphors in it", to which I agree. I just don't believe anything at all. nothing. I think that when my old 1 cylindar pump stops running, that will be it. the end.
you know what, that is the most calming thought fo me to think.

I always imagine to be somehow religious. imagineing that I would feel bad or incomplete that I had failed to acomplish certain things that would do me good in my lifelong quest to become a good religious person.
there are always things that could have been done, more things than one can ever accomplish.

In denmark, the church is funded by tax money, 1 % of your annual income infact.
You become a member automatically if your parents have you name given in church.
You can always choose not to be a member of the church.

-I got married in a church, because it is a traditional place to get married, and as I was a member of the church at the time, I decided to get married there.
some might think of that as being cynical, but if the church in your country is a public federal institution payed by tax money, you as a paying member also have th priviledge to get married in the fantastic place that the church is. (yes, I appreciate the church for historical value and amazing beauty)

I am nolonger a member of the church here. I had a very unpleasent conversation with the priest in the church, and it made me think more about my thoughts about the church. I then learned that the church in a cultural and historical sense is preserved by other funds than the church tax, and since I was only paying it to help saving old beautiful churches, I might aswell not be a member, and here after support the churches by my normal income tax, which keeps all our 200, 400, 800 year old churches around and in good shape.

it's so interessting to hear about other peoples thoughts on these things. I am actually surprised that so many people still believe in god. I mean really really believe.
I think it's a good thing that many do. for most people religion ( no matter which) provides good life content.
I am not gonna mention the obvious things where religion is causing problems, because it would be too much writing, and because 99% of the problems are caused by 0,1 % of the people.


I am glad for the people that find peace and happiness in religion.
I always think that if something makes you happy, than it is amazing when you can find the power and focus to practise it. I think religion serves to create a lot of comfort for a lot of people, kids and familys all over the world. fantastic, that is wonderfull.

I only get a little sad when religion is discussed like a science. some voices will make it sound like there is a well documented science behind their views, which automatically then disregards other believs.
remember that there are always other people that have totally different believes, or none at all. all views are equal and must be respected

find pleasure in listening to what individuals think or believe.
accept that we are born in different corners of this planet, and with different premises, learning what causes others to believe more or less can only make you become the owner of a larger life understanding, and make you more sure of why you believe or don't.





I only posted this to shed some light on the thoughts of a non believer.

And great to see how we can have a thread on such a sensitive suvbject running 5 pages with a great tone.

We have very similar beleifs(or non)
As I originally posted, I truley admire those with faith.
I don't want people to be sad for me.
I do think this is can become a dangerous thread.
That is why I tried to inject some humor in my original post.
I meant no disrespect to anybody
Can we all just agree to disagree

 

[PecMan]

ha! dont worry bro , u wont change anyone , and no one will change u .

all my life ive have been a positive person , i just think that my braking point is really close
maybe that is why i started this thread
with god or with out him i will survive

 

[Tranman]

Many moons ago I was an admin on a forum called atomicmpc.com.au
Upon said forum someone began a thread called " Jesus: Just a man?"
It ran for 500 pages or more (I'm too lazy to go and look, someone else can).

Wonder about the life of this one.


Tranman: Why would we even think of closing reasoned debate on any subject? Unlike some fora we do not dictate what you may and may not discuss.

Not saying you should at all. I enjoy reading the reasoned debate. I was just surprise to see it b/c I have seen politics and religion debates get diluted into name calling and hurt feelings in other forums. Glad to see it discussed in a mature and reasonable manner actually. Carry on...

Chau

 

[tommy_boy]

Hey pec, have you looked at Buddhism at all?

It's as much a way of thinking as it is a religion, depending on who you ask.

I messed around with it while in college. It's very interesting.

 

[trailboss99]

I was just surprise to see it b/c I have seen politics and religion debates get diluted into name calling and hurt feelings in other forums.

Ah but this one is in our house and here people know when it's time to behave.
If anyone was stupid enough to derail this thread they would be sorry.

 

[RWIGWH]

I was wondering what the smite key was used for.

 

[tommy_boy]

I was wondering what the smite key was used for.

Do you have Smite key? I don't.

I want one.