Noob Daytona vs ARF Daytona

[Hinclimincli]

Trust me, I would set the chrono every day. Just because I know I can.

 

[goldman555]

It's an interesting situation I have a number of Gen Rolex's as I've mentioned before in other posts the sub- mariner is already as good as the original.

The problem with the Daytona was the really easy tell that it was a fake with the Krone graph and the movement.

In my opinion the the noob is light years ahead of the ARF. You can immediately tell in hand maybe not on wrist that the three and nine dials are not right.

with the noob the only tell is when it is IN HAND and that is to do with the oyster bracelet and or the SEL the watch head itself is near on perfect I wouldn't say it is a NEWBIG. But considering the ceramic version of this watch on the grey second user market is going for anywhere upwards of $24,000 you would have to be mad to buy that watch and not buy noob. I have had the back off my watch and it is beautiful. It really does look like the genuine article it's also scary accurate. I have only had it for about a week but as long as it keeps ticking the mythical Daytona looks like it's going to fall into the territorial of the submariner

Hands down the Noob Daytona with 4130 movement is by far the best rep I have ever seen. It's that good. And considering the original version, it's worth every penny.

 

[lcsrep11]

It is not setting the chrono, it is knowing that you can. It is not seeing the fake 2d engraving of a column wheel, it is knowing it's there.
It is not diving to 200m. It is knowing that I am never under any circumstances ever going to do that, whatever watch I am wearing.

Knowing your not going dive with a replica sub doesn't excuse the fact that its form and function is a dive watch so same applies its not going diving wearing it, or even swimming for that matter, its knowing you cant.

No matter which watch I was wearing to time something I would use an iPhone / mobile phone i'm guessing so would most. Its all the same none of these reps can actually do what the gens can so its just down to personal preference as to what feature you don't mind sacrificing for me I would choose the best looking over working chrono all day long. Mainly for the reasons I stated early...I very rarely use the chrono. Also i've never ever been asked to start the chrono on my gen daytona not once.

I guess a 200m dive is an extreme example. I really feel they should put more emphasis on water resistance of these watches, its definitely very important to me anyway. I want to be able to wear a watch to swim in a pool or in the sea on holiday as I do with my gens. If you can buy a £50 watch thats water resistant to 200m I don't see why they cant do it with these reps.

 

[lcsrep11]

It's an interesting situation I have a number of Gen Rolex's as I've mentioned before in other posts the sub- mariner is already as good as the original.

The problem with the Daytona was the really easy tell that it was a fake with the Krone graph and the movement.

In my opinion the the noob is light years ahead of the ARF. You can immediately tell in hand maybe not on wrist that the three and nine dials are not right.

with the noob the only tell is when it is IN HAND and that is to do with the oyster bracelet and or the SEL the watch head itself is near on perfect I wouldn't say it is a NEWBIG. But considering the ceramic version of this watch on the grey second user market is going for anywhere upwards of $24,000 you would have to be mad to buy that watch and not buy noob. I have had the back off my watch and it is beautiful. It really does look like the genuine article it's also scary accurate. I have only had it for about a week but as long as it keeps ticking the mythical Daytona looks like it's going to fall into the territorial of the submariner

Hands down the Noob Daytona with 4130 movement is by far the best rep I have ever seen. It's that good. And considering the original version, it's worth every penny.

Guess everyones eye is different and like I said before its down to personal preference. The ceramic versions of the noob look better than the stainless. The stainless is bad bezel and sub dials on all ive seen look wrong. I still think the sub dials on the ceramic are too fat and fake looking.

You should come to the UK ive seen ceramic daytona's for £13k (16900$) you could make a killing if you can get $24k for them!!!

 

[guru]

I guess a 200m dive is an extreme example. I really feel they should put more emphasis on water resistance of these watches, its definitely very important to me anyway. I want to be able to wear a watch to swim in a pool or in the sea on holiday as I do with my gens. If you can buy a £50 watch thats water resistant to 200m I don't see why they cant do it with these reps.

I do not understand, I had almost all Sub versions and all of them are waterproofed to a min of 50 m. I checked both of mine noob Daytonas and when the pushers are scrued in, they are good for 20 m. But I wouldn‘t take them in the ocean but always shower with them.



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[gpvecchi]

I have a Franken Daytona on an ARF base and I love it. I agree the rep bracelet and clasp is better than the noob - the clasp click feels like my gen bracelet clicks.

How hard would it be to mod the pushers to be shorter - is this a relatively standard mod? guru do you know?



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+1 on this

 

[goldman555]

Guess everyones eye is different and like I said before its down to personal preference. The ceramic versions of the noob look better than the stainless. The stainless is bad bezel and sub dials on all ive seen look wrong. I still think the sub dials on the ceramic are too fat and fake looking.

You should come to the UK ive seen ceramic daytona's for £13k (16900$) you could make a killing if you can get $24k for them!!!

Seriously where can you get them for $16,900? I am in the UK but I also travel to New York on a regular basis which is the cheapest place to buy grey market Rolex's there are no ceramics on 47th St for less than $20,000 dealers are buying them for $19,000 I'll buy as many as I can for $17,000...

Are you sure they are not standard Daytona's that a dealer has added the ceramic bezel to? There's a lot of that going on. The cheapest one I can see on the Internet is $19,000 ... How much is the list price?

 

[lcsrep11]

I do not understand, I had almost all Sub versions and all of them are waterproofed to a min of 50 m. I checked both of mine noob Daytonas and when the pushers are scrued in, they are good for 20 m. But I wouldn‘t take them in the ocean but always shower with them.



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I think thats the luck of the draw how well they have been put together. Regarding waterproofing I wouldn't jump straight in a pool with a rep watch. If you look at the official water resistance ratings for watches 30m / 3ATM is not advisable to swim with its splash proof. 50m your good to go. What I mean is I wish they came from the factory all at least min 50m water resistance / swim proof. The watches we are talking about are anywhere from $400/$600 dollars after all.

 

[lcsrep11]

Seriously where can you get them for $16,900? I am in the UK but I also travel to New York on a regular basis which is the cheapest place to buy grey market Rolex's there are no ceramics on 47th St for less than $20,000 dealers are buying them for $19,000 I'll buy as many as I can for $17,000...

Are you sure they are not standard Daytona's that a dealer has added the ceramic bezel to? There's a lot of that going on. The cheapest one I can see on the Internet is $19,000 ... How much is the list price?

Go to Hatton Garden in London there are loads of diamond / watch shops there I spoke with a jeweller yesterday about potentially buying the new root beer and he told me he sold a ceramic last week for £13500. Build up some rapport with the guys and they will look after you. Due to the fall in the pound its far cheaper to by from the UK right now than most places.

Also have a look on chrono24 ive just found 2 black face ceramics for £14350 / $18500 and a white face for £14681 /$19k dollars yea its little more than Ive seen but still far less than $24000!!! Plus its on your home soil. I see a well know jeweller in Miami called CRM regularly advertise them he has a black one now for $18500. Have a look on his instagram story right now crmejewlers

The list in the UK is £9100 and no they are not SS with aftermarket ceramic bezels they are genuine Rolex Daytona 116500

 

[goldman555]

Hmmm I will take your word for it. But most of the people I know can't even get hold of one hence the price is going through the roof.

the tell-tale on Chrono24 if the dealer is saying something like delivery 2 to 3 weeks or available on demand it means they haven't actually got one they are just trying to wind you in.​

But back to the point in hand has a steel Rolex ever gone this high before it's insane. The difference between a steel one and the precious metal one is negligible. The reality is the precious metal version is actually worth something even for scrap.

The reps are getting so good now it's unbelievable I certainly wouldn't be investing in a ceramic stainless steel Daytona right now. I would for $16,000.

Like the pictures earlier on in this post look at the insides of the ARF it's got Cartier inscribed on it...

Inside the noob is completely indistinguishable from the real thing. Albeit it is not as solid and I doubt it will last as long.

Stick an Everest strap on it so you don't have to suffer the crappy rattle of the strap and for around £600 you've got something that only someone really really clued up would be able to tell on wrist

 

[PgrPgrPG]

I have been asked by some members which is the better Daytona.
I got my first Daytona in 2002 which was a MBW with a 15 mm case and a working 7750. That was a great watch 16 years ago. Nobody talked about flaws etc. In the meantime I used to have the first JF with Asian J23 movement, then I got the ARF with A4130 ( modded 7750 with bridges ) and the latest are the noob 4130 .
I also own a franken 16520 with a zenith movemnent. So you know
now that Daytonas are the holy grail for me. Also to a lot of other people, the waiting line for the latest 116500 is about 8 years. You can get one if you are willing to pay about 5-6 K euro s over the list price. Now to the comparison.....

Let‘s start with the ARF
Out of the box it is a nice watch. It feels good, the bracelet feels nice but light and cheap, but so is the gen. Watch is made out of 904. SEL is good, Clasp is good. Dials are also good. What I do not like are the pushers, they are too long. They have upgraded in V2 the size but they are still incorrect. Also the angle is incorrect. I did not receive one with correct rehaut engraving. Way off. The case incl crystal is 13.1 mm vs 12.3 mm on the gen. Most of our TD say correct thickness, but that is not true. Now the worst part of the watch is the movement. It is a a7750 with deco bridges. The 3 and 9 o‘clock subdials are frozen and you cannot use the watch as a chronograph. Also, the rotor is very loud and doesn‘t wind well to give the watch enough power reserve. You can modd this with a gen eta rotor and shave the caseback down so that you reach about 12.8 mm. More is not possible, then the caseback will be too thin. This modd is about 100 euro and in my opinion a must on this watch.

Now to the noob
The noob is about 100 USD more but is 12.6 mm when is leaves the factory. The bracelet feels ok, I would say same as ARF but the SEL are not as good. I have changed the SEL from 6 to 12 on several watches and do not have any gaps. Clasp is also not my favorite, ARF is better. You can change the ARF clasp and put it on the noob which is 316 and you do not see the difference in color.
The SEL from ARF will not fit on the noob. Pushers on noob are excellent. Rehaut engraving is excellent. Some people say the rehaut is too high compare to gen, I cannot agree. The dials on version 1 were terrible, now they have upgraded the dials on v2 and they are much better. They still have some flaws, but they do not count for me. The case is the same as ARF, I do not see any big difference, except for the pushers which are gen like and have the same angle. I personally like the ceramic bezel on the noob better, it is more crisp and people without knowledge agreed. Now to the movement, it is a complete 98 % clone of the original Rolex 4130 movement. I had 4 watches in my hand, all of them have an Amp over 300, 3 of them gain 2 sec per day, one 5 sec in a week. Best is the power reserve, all over 72 h and the best is 82h. And the best part, winding and time setting is gen like. No jumping hour hand when you set the time. You get a fully functional chronograph with one of the best movements ever made in China. You can use this watch for a Franken build. It will take gen dial, gen hands with light modds, gen movement parts, gen crown. Gen dials are available starting from 600 euro to 900 euro, depending on lume color.

Conclusions, the ARF is a nice watch but I cannot wear a watch when the chronos do not work. I normally do not use them but looking in the past, my ARFs didn‘t get so much wrist time as the Noobs get. For 100 USD more you get a fully functional chrono and since the dials are upgraded on V2, no need for a franken.
The case on both are the same, compare the pics. If you never had a ARF Daytona, you will not feel the difference on the bracelet. In my opinion, the crystal is on both a little high. This could be resolved by modding the gasket. A gen gasket is not needed. But careful when you remove the ceramic bezel, without the right tool I cannot recomend this.

Now to some pics

Left ARF, right Noob V1

check out the bezel engraving

noob on top, better pusher but I would say, same case

ARF without bridges and eta rotor which is a must

solid clone movement from noob

gen

my franken

gen

franken

noob pushers and bezel engraving




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Very good comparison. Objective perspective. Thanks a lot for your valuable effort.




PgrPgrPG

 

[lcsrep11]

Hmmm I will take your word for it. But most of the people I know can't even get hold of one hence the price is going through the roof.

the tell-tale on Chrono24 if the dealer is saying something like delivery 2 to 3 weeks or available on demand it means they haven't actually got one they are just trying to wind you in.​

But back to the point in hand has a steel Rolex ever gone this high before it's insane. The difference between a steel one and the precious metal one is negligible. The reality is the precious metal version is actually worth something even for scrap.

The reps are getting so good now it's unbelievable I certainly wouldn't be investing in a ceramic stainless steel Daytona right now. I would for $16,000.

Like the pictures earlier on in this post look at the insides of the ARF it's got Cartier inscribed on it...

Inside the noob is completely indistinguishable from the real thing. Albeit it is not as solid and I doubt it will last as long.

Stick an Everest strap on it so you don't have to suffer the crappy rattle of the strap and for around £600 you've got something that only someone really really clued up would be able to tell on wrist

Like I said CRM jewellers in Miami a very reputable store have one now for $18500 give them a call. $24000 is like everything else in NYC a rip off. As for has Steel Daytona ever been so high I guess its all relative. When gold daytona's were £15k in the UK the stainless was £9/10k now a gold is anywhere from £17k to £23k grey market price and the daytona is £13 to £15k so its still the about the same. If you talking about scrap price gold per kg todays price is around £29900 in the uk seeing as a gold daytona weighs in around 205g that puts the gold value of the watch at £6130 roughly and thats if every component is solid gold which it isn't.. Just because its gold don't think you are getting value for money in the weight of the gold.

At the end of the day it doesn't matter what its worth it matters how badly people want it and what there willing to pay. Is a stainless patek phillippe nautilus 5711 worth 20k to 25k over list lol no of course not but I guarantee you someone will pay it.

I may be wrong but i believe the cartier plate has been added to the arf to reduce rotar noise i don't think it came like that. The daytona in your images is bad. Those sub dials are far too fat I could pick that out as a rep on someones wrist no problem at all. It just looks wrong.

 

[TagHeuerFan1963]

Has the black dial on the V2 been updated as well?

 

[timnic54]

Knowing your not going dive with a replica sub doesn't excuse the fact that its form and function is a dive watch so same applies its not going diving wearing it, or even swimming for that matter, its knowing you cant.

No matter which watch I was wearing to time something I would use an iPhone / mobile phone i'm guessing so would most. Its all the same none of these reps can actually do what the gens can so its just down to personal preference as to what feature you don't mind sacrificing for me I would choose the best looking over working chrono all day long. Mainly for the reasons I stated early...I very rarely use the chrono. Also i've never ever been asked to start the chrono on my gen daytona not once.

I guess a 200m dive is an extreme example. I really feel they should put more emphasis on water resistance of these watches, its definitely very important to me anyway. I want to be able to wear a watch to swim in a pool or in the sea on holiday as I do with my gens. If you can buy a £50 watch thats water resistant to 200m I don't see why they cant do it with these reps.

Other than those on Gator straps I swim with all of mine and have never had a water ingress problem.

 

[theREALgoat]

Here is mine. Bought it 5 days ago in Guangzhou..

Have they improved the SEL yet? I can't tell from your photos.

 

[timnic54]

Have they improved the SEL yet? I can't tell from your photos.

SEL

Within Gen to Gen Variation

 

[lcsrep11]

Other than those on Gator straps I swim with all of mine and have never had a water ingress problem.

Total luck of the draw out the box. I woudn't risk it. Even more so with a rep chrono.

 

[dadog13]

Have they improved the SEL yet? I can't tell from your photos.

Does this help? I am not an expert and don’t know what exactly to look for as improvement or not..

 

[thinwhiteduke]

guru sir, what are the obvious tells, if any, in the 116520 black dial, aside from the double tick which may or may not be an issue? I see 0n page 1 of this thread you picked the 116520 white dial. Anything bad with the black dial, or is it just a matter of color preference? TIA!

 

[fabbe79]

Does this help? I am not an expert and don’t know what exactly to look for as improvement or not..

I need one of those..