i dont know if there is a ....

[trailboss99]

I find it hard to believe that the great man who wrote the below, a man of peace, a man of great empathy, a man who embodies Christian principles will not make it to heaven (whatever that may be) simply because he was not a Christian. To me the idea that Chief Seattle is not worthy of Heaven goes against the concept of a kind and benevolent God who wants the best for His children. Quite frankly if such a man is not worthy of Heaven I'm not sure that I would want to be there either.

[AME]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CP61T1I1qVE[/AME]

 

[ahw676]

To me the idea that Chief Seattle is not worthy of Heaven goes against the concept of a kind and benevolent God who wants the best for His children. Quite frankly if such a man is not worthy of Heaven I'm not sure that I would want to be there either.

For me, this goes back to the "man's understanding" vs "God's understanding" concept.

Chief Seattle perfect compared to man? Maybe.

Chief Seattle perfect compared to God? No.

So it follows then that Chief Seattle needs to be saved by God, and still needs Christ as his Savior.

 

[RWIGWH]

For me, this goes back to the "man's understanding" vs "God's understanding" concept.

Chief Seattle perfect compared to man? Maybe.

Chief Seattle perfect compared to God? No.

So it follows then that Chief Seattle needs to be saved by God, and still needs Christ as his Savior.

Is it possible this man has made peace with God in his heart without proclamation of your beliefs?

 

[ahw676]

Is it possible this man has made peace with God in his heart without proclamation of your beliefs?

Stop attributing the beliefs to just me. I'm not the only Christian on this planet that believes this.

Is it possible yes? Do I find any reassurance in that as a method of saving? Not so much.

 

[RWIGWH]

It is your belief, no matter how I direct it. I am not accusing, or asking you to be responsible (or accountable) for them, I am simply asking your opinion. No right or wrong answer.

 

[ahw676]

Well, the answer is above then. Is it possible? Sure. Would I pin my eternal soul on that method? No. I want more reassurance than that.

 

[RWIGWH]

Oh you answered the question just fine. I am in complete agreement of your assessment, but it does come down to your own personal belief in the end...As I am sure it does/did for the Chief.

 

[cybee]

Is it possible this man has made peace with God in his heart without proclamation of your beliefs?

Without Christ, no it is not possible. This is what the Christian believe's.

See 1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

Christianity begins at Genesis chapter one. That is the whole reference point for the believer. "In the beginning God created" If one cannot get passed this point none of it will make sense. The entire Old testament of the Jews is the foretelling and prophecying of a future Messiah to come, quite detailed in fact if you read it.

Frankly my opinion is that if someone is really searching for the truth, they should seek out the scripture in earnest. If someone really wants to know, then read the Bible and start with the book of John. Otherwise we'll just talk in circles.

You guys are lucky to have ahw, you know she really loves you guys.

 

[MrYesterday]

Another thing that gets me is the idea that by His crucifiction, Jesus opened the gates to Heaven for the first time. So for thousands of years (according to the Bible) people went straight to hell. It was written to be a part of hell where the just were comforted, but hell just the same. That, along with the idea that unbaptized babies (who are fundamentally without sin, aside from the mere fact that they were born human) go to hell as well, or "Limbo", whatever your belief system may be. If anyone should go to Heaven it should ONLY be babies, who by their lack of opportunity have never even had a chance to sin.

 

[RWIGWH]

Without Christ, no it is not possible. This is what the Christian believe's.

See 1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

Christianity begins at Genesis chapter one. That is the whole reference point for the believer. "In the beginning God created" If one cannot get passed this point none of it will make sense. The entire Old testament of the Jews is the foretelling and prophecying of a future Messiah to come, quite detailed in fact if you read it.

Frankly my opinion is that if someone is really searching for the truth, they should seek out the scripture in earnest. If someone really wants to know, then read the Bible and start with the book of John. Otherwise we'll just talk in circles.

You guys are lucky to have ahw, you know she really loves you guys.

I already knew the answer no matter how it's worded. The red highlight is the crux of the answer Cy. It's what you believe. This is my only point. It's all in your faith.

 

[rol_man]

Do you have Smite key? I don't.

I want one.

+1 Would certainly make life easier and more interesting!

 

[cybee]

I already knew the answer no matter how it's worded. The red highlight is the crux of the answer Cy. It's what you believe. This is my only point. It's all in your faith.

Yep your're absolutely right Z...But the real good news is that my hat is now one size larger

 

[robbnj]

Why did God wait until only 2000 years ago to reveal his existence through Christ when humans have existed on this earth anywhere from half a million to a million years?

Does that mean that all humans who existed previous to the revelation are not allowed into heaven as they could not possibly have accepted Christ as their saviour?

If Jehova will only accept 144,000 people into heaven, why do thse people keep knocking at my door asking me to convert to their faith?
Their odds suck, quite frankly.

God is all powerful, all knowing, all benevolent.
Why does the Church need my money?

Does the Church pay to raise all the children saved from abortion by their anti-abortion efforts?

Despite scientific FACT disproving creationism, why do people still adhere to hit?

I wish SOMEONE could give me a straight answer to these questions, but no one ever has.

 

[tommy_boy]

+1 Would certainly make life easier and more interesting!

Especially if it involves a large vat of liquified Velveeta.

Hope springs eternal.


:lol:

 

[PecMan]

Pec, what do you think of Tahitian Noni juice ?

i heard is really good for cholesterol my friend

 

[MrYesterday]

Why did God wait until only 2000 years ago to reveal his existence through Christ when humans have existed on this earth anywhere from half a million to a million years?

Before Jesus (Old Testament), the Bible said that God spoke directly to some people (Moses, Abraham, ect.), and that Angels were also middle men.

Does that mean that all humans who existed previous to the revelation are not allowed into heaven as they could not possibly have accepted Christ as their saviour?

That's what the Bible says. "Jesus opened the gates of Heaven when he was crucified.".

God is all powerful, all knowing, all benevolent.
Why does the Church need my money?

The church is a construct of man, not God. Several times in the Bible churches are spoken out against. God doesn't need money, men do.

Does the Church pay to raise all the children saved from abortion by their anti-abortion efforts?

Of course not. Most churches are too poor, and the Vatican is too greedy. It's chalked up to another trial, like cancer, disease, famine, homelessness, ect. Sure you have small churches who try to help, but they are in now way well enough funded, but most large churches won't/haven't. I've had more compassion given to me by regular men in my life than anyone ordained.

Despite scientific FACT disproving creationism, why do people still adhere to hit?

Some people who have faith in God, don't have faith in science. As such they either don't believe the findings, or believe God made things seem the way they are as a test of faith. So to them it's a moot point. Some others believe that creation WAS the Big Bang, and since, to us, time is relative the people that wrote about creation wrote "six days", when in reality it it was thousands/millions of years.

But then again you have those that believe the earth is 6000 years old.

I could be entirely off base on most of these, but I tried my best.

 

[PecMan]

well guys there is something that for sure we will agree
we wont change u
u wont change us

just opinions right here,
like i said , not just becouse the bible says that u wont be safe , no matter how good u are , u must take jesus as ur savior and then u will be safe
well i dont agree and i dont think god thinks that way . lets say there is this god that created everything or something bigger and energy , well i dont think he spoke to anyone here in this world

 

[cybee]

well guys there is something that for sure we will agree
we wont change u
u wont change us

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nDbeqj-1XOo"]Pink Floyd - Us and Them - YouTube[/ame]

 

[PecMan]

i like andrea bocelli

 

[cybee]

i like andrea bocelli

Me too Pec. One thing is for sure Pec, you have quite a thread going here.

Hey everyone, it's the weekend and time to lighten up. I hope you all have a good weekend. Super Bowl weekend.