ARF 16610 LV Submariner 904L Kermit photo review

[maxus minimax]

I have just received an ARF 16610 LV from a TD. In this and other threads some people mentioned that the bezel is a bit "wobbly". The bezel on my one turns and clicks quite ok. It sits flush on the case, but it can be lifted up half a millimeter without using force, just put a fingernail between bezel and case. I can´t imagine how the clickspring could have an influence on this. It is also very easy to get the bezel off and on again, compared to the construction with an octagonal spring or the six digit version using a nylon ring.
Is this just what it is with this type of bezel construction, on this ARF model in particular? I have a gen insert , DW and crystal already, but this loose bezel is really annoying and keeps me from putting the parts in.

 

[KJ2020]

Thank you KJ2020
Do you by any chance know if the gasket of the sub 116610 is the same as that of the 16610? because I would like to mount the glass you mentioned, but I see that the glass is lower than how arf makes it come out

Sorry didn't see this til now. I believe the gen 16610 crystal takes a 2.5mm gen gasket, so yes the gen crystal sits lower on a gen 16610 than the stock ARF or ARF with 116610 gasket at 2.7mm

 

[KJ2020]

I have just received an ARF 16610 LV from a TD. In this and other threads some people mentioned that the bezel is a bit "wobbly". The bezel on my one turns and clicks quite ok. It sits flush on the case, but it can be lifted up half a millimeter without using force, just put a fingernail between bezel and case. I can´t imagine how the clickspring could have an influence on this. It is also very easy to get the bezel off and on again, compared to the construction with an octagonal spring or the six digit version using a nylon ring.
Is this just what it is with this type of bezel construction, on this ARF model in particular? I have a gen insert , DW and crystal already, but this loose bezel is really annoying and keeps me from putting the parts in.

A gen 5 digit Sub or GMT bezel should not have any vertical play in it. I also have several gen-spec rep and aftermarket bezels (TC, WSO, etc.) with no vertical gap or play. I understand your hesitancy to add gen parts. Maybe try an aftermarket or used gen retaining ring and see if the ARF bezel locks in better. Or maybe an aftermarket bezel. WSO bezels used to be decent but they can vary a lot over time. I have 3 of those and had to tweak every one to fit properly on their own WSO retaining rings. But all are now solid and function right - no gaps, smooth operation, good clicks.

 

[maxus minimax]

Thanks KJ2020 for the clarification.
..but, really, is ARF serious about that ?

 

[cassapanca]

Sorry didn't see this til now. I believe the gen 16610 crystal takes a 2.5mm gen gasket, so yes the gen crystal sits lower on a gen 16610 than the stock ARF or ARF with 116610 gasket at 2.7mm

So if I buy a gen crystal without gasket I have to source a 2.5mm gasket?


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[KJ2020]

Thanks KJ2020 for the clarification.
..but, really, is ARF serious about that ?

Yeah I wouldn't be happy at all about that bro

 

[KJ2020]

So if I buy a gen crystal without gasket I have to source a 2.5mm gasket?


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I always bring an assortment of gaskets to a crystal change. Use the one that gives you the best date mag as a priority, then the correct sitting height as a secondary consideration. Clark's gaskets on Ebay are good quality and only about $4.

 

[cassapanca]

I always bring an assortment of gaskets to a crystal change. Use the one that gives you the best date mag as a priority, then the correct sitting height as a secondary consideration. Clark's gaskets on Ebay are good quality and only about $4.

Many thanks KJ


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[KJ2020]

5 digit gen spec bezels like ARF are easy to pop off so an ARF crystal change is really straight forward if anyone feels handy enough to try it DIY. The ARF 16610 crystal change would be essentially the same steps as for a 116610 once the bezel is removed.

6-digit Sub crystal and bezel swap

 

[mrsullivan]

Thanks KJ2020 for the clarification.
..but, really, is ARF serious about that ?

It may be a matter of batches. My ARF16610 has the same specs and same feeling when used as yours, but the bezel sits tight and firm on the case.

I agree with you that such a play would make me tick too though.


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[maxus minimax]

It may be a matter of batches. My ARF16610 has the same specs and same feeling when used as yours, but the bezel sits tight and firm on the case.

I agree with you that such a play would make me tick too though.

Matter of batches, or maybe just picked a bad one... ? Who knows. Not my first watch from ARF, so I expected a decent quality, or at least nothing like this. Have asked Li and Lana jtimewatch what they think about it, waiting for an answer since 10 days...

 

[cassapanca]

Could a bp dial be an upgrade for an arf kermit or not? In the jf many people installed bp dials, in the arf i don’t know if it’s worth..


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[HardVision]

Please forgive me if this isn’t the proper place to ask this; has anyone had an issue with fitting a gen bezel insert in the ARF bezel ring? Or is the go to move to just replace the bezel ring and insert together?
I tired to install mine and I’m pretty sure the only way to get the bezel into the ring is to remove some material from the insert, but seeing as the insert is more expensive than the entire watch I’d rather not do that :/

 

[keisuke_z]

Please forgive me if this isn’t the proper place to ask this; has anyone had an issue with fitting a gen bezel insert in the ARF bezel ring? Or is the go to move to just replace the bezel ring and insert together?
I tired to install mine and I’m pretty sure the only way to get the bezel into the ring is to remove some material from the insert, but seeing as the insert is more expensive than the entire watch I’d rather not do that :/

Sadly, I think the general consensus is that the ARF 16610 stock bezel ring doesn’t take a gen insert without shaving. You might be better off sourcing a bezel ring that takes the gen insert instead?

 

[McPwn]

Mine took a gen bezel ring without mods. I used a roll of packing tape and rolled it over the insert to get it in, as its hard to apply the force evenly. By hand its tricky as one end always wants to pop out.

 

[HardVision]

Sadly, I think the general consensus is that the ARF 16610 stock bezel ring doesn’t take a gen insert without shaving. You might be better off sourcing a bezel ring that takes the gen insert instead?

Out of a want to fix the wobble/lift that the ARF bezel has I ordered a replacement bezel ring, it’s a replacement for a gen bezel ring, but not gen. The insert fits perfectly in that bezel ring. However that assembly will not stay securely attached to the rest of the watch. I can pull it off with nothing more than my fingers unfortunately and sometimes just turning the bezel will cause it to become loose enough where it will just fall off. Is there something I’m missing with fitting a different bezel ring? I’ve also picked up a gen bezel retaining ring, but I don’t have the other parts that will go along with replacing that part yet (gen xtal and gaskets) I did however stick the bezel ring on the retaining ring and unless the case acts as a top I don’t think that will work since the interface between the two is so tight that I can’t turn the bezel ring around the retaining ring.

Mine took a gen bezel ring without mods. I used a roll of packing tape and rolled it over the insert to get it in, as its hard to apply the force evenly. By hand its tricky as one end always wants to pop out.

I’ll give it another go, I did try to use my crappy Amazon xtal press but I didn’t go too far with that because the lume pip sits proud so most the force is being applied there and I didn’t want to press unevenly on it. I might try to clearance the cup for the press to clear around the pip. I also even tried to stick the insert in the freezer to help shrink it, but because it’s so small it warms up before you can properly place it and push it down.

 

[keisuke_z]

I’ll give it another go, I did try to use my crappy Amazon xtal press but I didn’t go too far with that because the lume pip sits proud so most the force is being applied there and I didn’t want to press unevenly on it. I might try to clearance the cup for the press to clear around the pip. I also even tried to stick the insert in the freezer to help shrink it, but because it’s so small it warms up before you can properly place it and push it down.

Actually ignore my prev comment - I totally forgot that I’d fitted a gen insert to my ARF 16610LV bezel.

You should be able to make it work by slowly working the edge of the insert in against a hard blunt point, like the corner of a wooden block (something that won’t scratch). It’s a slow going process as you slowly push in the edge and work around the insert.

 

[HardVision]

Well I junked my watch. In trying to remove the crystal retaining ring I chowdered the case edges and dinged up the top of the rehaut ring. Once our lovely TDs are back from the CNY break I’ll be buying a replacement and sending it off to oascom to get the movement replaced, a gen xtal installed, and address the bezel wobble, if that’s possible.

 

[keisuke_z]

Well I junked my watch. In trying to remove the crystal retaining ring I chowdered the case edges and dinged up the top of the rehaut ring. Once our lovely TDs are back from the CNY break I’ll be buying a replacement and sending it off to oascom to get the movement replaced, a gen xtal installed, and address the bezel wobble, if that’s possible.

Oh no…. I found that putting it in a vice and then lightly tapping a razor blade under the retaining ring to open up a gap works really well… hopefully the case is recoverable!!

 

[HardVision]

I’m sure it is salvageable, but I think it would be cheaper to get a new one. I also didn’t know about the off center crown stamping on the clasp when I made my first purchase and mine is pretty bad. Getting a gen clasp is more than a new watch and if I’m going to go through the process of getting a new bracelet I might as well just get the whole thing and hand it off to someone who knows what their doing.