ARF 16610 LV Submariner 904L Kermit photo review

[wristonfire123]

Thanks for the advice! This is more of a practice piece for me so I would prefer to try everything on my own first (and destroy countless parts in the process!).

I actually tried the pinching and now the opening is too small. I will try to widen it the next time I work on this again.

I may potentially ruin the hands altogether so my next move could be:

1) look out for JF/TC/ARF/BP hands on m2m
2) get 116610 hands + dial and relume
3) get a BP 16610lv watch altogether and use its hands + dial

I had the same issue when swapping out the movements on the GMT, if you use one end of the tweezer to go up through the underside of the minute hand, you can gently widen the opening again by rotating the hand or tweezer. You have to do it gently and test the hand fitting after every couple of turns.

It worked for me! Good luck


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[Stevenf]

I had the same issue when swapping out the movements on the GMT, if you use one end of the tweezer to go up through the underside of the minute hand, you can gently widen the opening again by rotating the hand or tweezer. You have to do it gently and test the hand fitting after every couple of turns.

It worked for me! Good luck


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Thank you all so much for the assurance, that gave me hope to modify the minute hand again, and it fit like a glove after the adjustments!

The new movement is now in but I made another blunder along the way. I lost the screw that holds the movement in place. Wonder if it matters since I am still able to put everything back together.

 

[wristonfire123]

Thank you all so much for the assurance, that gave me hope to modify the minute hand again, and it fit like a glove after the adjustments!

The new movement is now in but I made another blunder along the way. I lost the screw that holds the movement in place. Wonder if it matters since I am still able to put everything back together.

Great! Glad it worked. Should be fine for a short time while you order a new screw. I would get it replaced ASAP though.

I finally pulled the trigger yesterday. Not sure what mods I’ll do yet. I’ll wait to see how it looks on my wrist first. If the date wheel is okay I’ll keep it standard until the movement fails and replace it with the VR.

Where did you source your other inserts from?


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[Stevenf]

Great! Glad it worked. Should be fine for a short time while you order a new screw. I would get it replaced ASAP though.

I finally pulled the trigger yesterday. Not sure what mods I’ll do yet. I’ll wait to see how it looks on my wrist first. If the date wheel is okay I’ll keep it standard until the movement fails and replace it with the VR.

Where did you source your other inserts from?


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The ARF stock datewheel is not that bad to be honest. Some may argue that it’s period correct for a no-rehaut Kermit as some of them do have thick DW.

For now, I only have this cheapie blue insert from taobao. Planning to try other aftermarket blacks and greens.

 

[Stevenf]

Great! Glad it worked. Should be fine for a short time while you order a new screw. I would get it replaced ASAP though.

I finally pulled the trigger yesterday. Not sure what mods I’ll do yet. I’ll wait to see how it looks on my wrist first. If the date wheel is okay I’ll keep it standard until the movement fails and replace it with the VR.

Where did you source your other inserts from?


Sent from the RWI App

The ARF stock datewheel is not that bad to be honest. Some may argue that it’s period correct for a no-rehaut Kermit as some of them do have thick DW.

For now, I only have this cheapie blue insert from taobao. Planning to try other aftermarket blacks and greens.

 

[Ro13x]

I love the blue bezel

 

[Hinclimincli]

Has anyone tried to install an ETA/clone movement in this watch? Would a 2836 with H4 pinion work? I guess you would need a movement holder and maybe a dial spacer? (and a DWO, of course).

 

[prv654]

Yes, as discussed in another thread, my BK ARF 16610LV runs a swiss ETA 2824-2 with H4 cannon pinion. It needs spacers, rings, tabs and screws as you mentioned, and the dial feet, DWO and crown stem must be modified. And you must get ETA maxi hands as the clone 3135 hands apparently won't work.
I suspect a SW-200 would be as good as an ETA, but significantly cheaper, while still much better than a chinese clone.

Some members here argue that swapping the SH3135 for a VS or VR3135 would be the most straghtforward upgrade in terms of reliability, date font and cost.

 

[Hinclimincli]

Yes, as discussed in another thread, my BK ARF 16610LV runs a swiss ETA 2824-2 with H4 cannon pinion. It needs spacers, rings, tabs and screws as you mentioned, and the dial feet, DWO and crown stem must be modified. And you must get ETA maxi hands as the clone 3135 hands apparently won't work.
I suspect a SW-200 would be as good as an ETA, but significantly cheaper, while still much better than a chinese clone.

Some members here argue that swapping the SH3135 for a VS or VR3135 would be the most straghtforward upgrade in terms of reliability, date font and cost.

I can imagine, yep. Another option is a Seagull ST2130, almost as good as the ETA but significantly cheaper. Check this comparison: https://watchguy.co.uk/comparison-sea-gull-st2130-eta-2824-2-peacock-sl3000/

In terms of dial and movement, I assume you would need this for the dial: http://rafflesdials.com/one-set-of-...-2824-or-2834-movement-inside-the-watch-case/

And this for the movement: http://rafflesdials.com/one-pc-29-2...-inside-the-40mm-rolex-submariner-watch-case/

For the crown I would probably order a 2824 stem and replace it completely. I'm not sure if the regular SH3135 crown can be moved onto a 2824 stem, but you can buy pretty decent Sub crowns that would work on a 2824.

For hands it's a bit trickier as you would need maxi hands, but with superluminova instead of chromalite (as the Kermit glows green, not blue). You can buy a set of ARF hands from their 116610 Submariner, which are really excellent, and relume them to superluminova, shouldn't be difficult. And these hands have the advantage of being tall post hands, meaning you don't need a H4 pinion height, they will work well on a H2 pinion movement.

I'm more interested in the LN sub, however, so getting decent LN hands should be easy. Yuki or any of the other habitual suspects would have decent mercedes hands for 2824/36 movements. And if you can get their long post options you won't even need a H4 movement, a regular H2 will suffice.

The best alternative, though, and I agree, is to just get a VS/VR3135 and swap it straight away once the SH3135 craps out.

I've just ordered a LN and will have all the stuff ready in case the SH3135 says goodbye. Maybe in a month, maybe in a year, or maybe never!

 

[AndreaPirlo]

Sorry but 904 is more shiny ? True?

 

[Hinclimincli]

Sorry but 904 is more shiny ? True?

Yes, and has a very distinct aroma of lavender. Also if you put it on the top of the Staff of Ra and take it to the Chamber of Maps it will point you to the Well of Souls where the Ark of the Covenant lies. A weeery speeecial metal that 904L it is!!!

 

[prv654]

Need some expert advice on the crystal (this is a BK ARF and the crystal sits lower than in the review pictures, more like the JF).

Isn't this level of mag too low?

If so, should I swap it with a non-AR Clark crystal with a higher gasket?

 

[KJ2020]

Need some expert advice on the crystal (this is a BK ARF and the crystal sits lower than in the review pictures, more like the JF).

Isn't this level of mag too low?

If so, should I swap it with a non-AR Clark crystal with a higher gasket?

ARF did something weird with their stock crystal, gasket, and DW font size to make it all look right at a really tall height. GMF does this too on their GMTs and it makes it really hard to adjust anything without it looking wrong.

Your font size looks about right in your pic, but the dial date window is way smaller than a gen looks.

However, increasing the mag to make your date window size the same as the gen would make the DW font too big.

You could probably find a better solution - a happy medium of date window only slightly too small and date fonts only slightly too big and crystal only slightly too high. It would likely take some trial and error with different height gaskets and/or different thickness crystals. A thicker crystal results in increased mag. The gaskets can also be fairly easily shaved to any custom height. I've done this on some GMTs, it just takes patience and persistence.

Note the difference in stock crystal height on this GMF GMT compared to the finished height.

Using several different crystals and gaskets I was able to find a combo that gave me an acceptable date font size.

 

[prv654]

Thanks so much for the through analysis! Indeed the date window is too small, not the font. I'll try something with a higher gasket, I'd rather have it slightly too big than too small.

Your GMT is really nice, congrats on the mods!

 

[stealth658]

I can imagine, yep. Another option is a Seagull ST2130, almost as good as the ETA but significantly cheaper. Check this comparison: https://watchguy.co.uk/comparison-sea-gull-st2130-eta-2824-2-peacock-sl3000/

In terms of dial and movement, I assume you would need this for the dial: http://rafflesdials.com/one-set-of-...-2824-or-2834-movement-inside-the-watch-case/

And this for the movement: http://rafflesdials.com/one-pc-29-2...-inside-the-40mm-rolex-submariner-watch-case/

For the crown I would probably order a 2824 stem and replace it completely. I'm not sure if the regular SH3135 crown can be moved onto a 2824 stem, but you can buy pretty decent Sub crowns that would work on a 2824.

For hands it's a bit trickier as you would need maxi hands, but with superluminova instead of chromalite (as the Kermit glows green, not blue). You can buy a set of ARF hands from their 116610 Submariner, which are really excellent, and relume them to superluminova, shouldn't be difficult. And these hands have the advantage of being tall post hands, meaning you don't need a H4 pinion height, they will work well on a H2 pinion movement.

I'm more interested in the LN sub, however, so getting decent LN hands should be easy. Yuki or any of the other habitual suspects would have decent mercedes hands for 2824/36 movements. And if you can get their long post options you won't even need a H4 movement, a regular H2 will suffice.

The best alternative, though, and I agree, is to just get a VS/VR3135 and swap it straight away once the SH3135 craps out.

I've just ordered a LN and will have all the stuff ready in case the SH3135 says goodbye. Maybe in a month, maybe in a year, or maybe never!

Any idea if it would be possible to swap the SH3135 for a VS3235 if I can source it? The power reserve is very appealing to me.

 

[Hinclimincli]

Any idea if it would be possible to swap the SH3135 for a VS3235 if I can source it? The power reserve is very appealing to me.

I'm not familiar with the VS3235 unfortunately so I don't know the dimensions of it, or what size of hands does it use.

 

[wristonfire123]

Got my QC though. Date a little fat but not as bad as some. Will most like drop the VR in at some point which will take care of that. The 2 on the bezel doesn’t have the hangman noose on this batch and it looks like the crown stamp on the clasp is centred again although I can’t be sure from the angle. (Already given the green light)

 

[MikeMeezy77]

wristonfire123 Interesting. The bezel is a lot different from last batch. The white lines from 12 to 3 on the bezel look like they run all the way to the inside diameter. The lines from 9 to 12 also have that same run length.

 

[Crabber]

Argh 2 steps forward, 1 step back


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[Crabber]

Always 2 steps forward and one step back...ugh


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