116610LN - down to VSF and ZZF v3. Ultimate winner?

[StreetFighter]

VSF has nailed crown guards and case, clasp and bracelet with a gen like date wheel and crystall. ZZF has not. My VSF made my zzfv2 look like a rep.

 

[StreetFighter]

Youre drunk

that’s nice, all but the crown guards and SEL’s looks premium.

 

[GrandmasterChime]

I have never seen someone take offense over a different opinion before. Now I get why gen owners are upset at rep owners, cause deep down they feel like they might have wasted more money on a product and want to lash out at those who save their cash on a different product.

It's okay, bro. Enjoy that ZF!

Youre a halfwit. Youre dismissing a product youve never seen in fact what havve you seen. You started the thread and bought up the zf and made blanket statements with zero experience. I dont rubbish the zff v3 or vsf because i have not held them. You should do the same

 

[Duckber]

Youre a halfwit. Youre dismissing a product youve never seen in fact what havve you seen. You started the thread and bought up the zf and made blanket statements with zero experience. I dont rubbish the zff v3 or vsf because i have not held them. You should do the same

As modernclassic stated before your post, the crownguards look off. Which is not a deal breaker for me. The SELs also look off. Which is a HUGE deal breaker to me.

For my tastes I don't need to have it in hand, even if the rest is absolutely-fucking-gen-like I would not be interested cause of those SELs

You're clearly taking offense because you own it even though I have a reasonable rationale as to why I am not interested for MY tastes.

Grow up, you're very emotionally immature.

 

[GrandmasterChime]

As modernclassic stated before your post, the crownguards look off. Which is not a deal breaker for me. The SELs also look off. Which is a HUGE deal breaker to me.

For my tastes I don't need to have it in hand, even if the rest is absolutely-fucking-gen-like I would not be interested cause of those SELs

You're clearly taking offense because you own it even though I have a reasonable rationale as to why I am not interested for MY tastes.

Grow up, you're very emotionally immature.

Better than having opinions based on other peoples opinions. Dont be a sheep buy something

 

[Duckber]

Better than having opinions based on other peoples opinions. Dont be a sheep buy something

If I would be basing it on other people's opinions I'd have a DHGate level SEL rep like you cause I'd be following your advice. I'm basing it off of pictures. Even your latest picture in fact. Are you intentionally arguing in bad faith? Another sign of emotional immaturity.

I have an RXF, which I would take over that ZF any day. The brightness on the bezel is an issue. Which is why I am upgrading.

 

[GrandmasterChime]

If I would be basing it on other people's opinions I'd have a DHGate level SEL rep like you cause I'd be following your advice. I'm basing it off of pictures. Even your latest picture in fact. Are you intentionally arguing in bad faith? Another sign of emotional immaturity.

I have an RXF, which I would take over that ZF any day. The brightness on the bezel is an issue. Which is why I am upgrading.

Okay now youre just being silly.

 

[muiramas]

Let me reiterate, SEL recession is a huge factor to me that I find very visually pleasing to the eye. As you said, they all have different flaws and it all depends on which flaws you can be comfortable with. That's why I personally throw ZF out.

You haven't had a ZZF v3 which I heard is a major upgrade to even the V2S. Nor the VSF... so you're speculating like the rest of us.

I have seen people choose the ZF as their favorite, but realisticlaly speaking maybe just by two people who actually had all 3 in hand.

That's not exactly a sizeable amount to go by.

Regardless, if you'd rather this be phrased as "best $428 dollar rep" then yeah we can go with that. Not a big deal to me, ZF just doesn't look good with those terrible end links for my personal tastes. Certainly not for $90 more.

I was all for getting the ZF. You know this as you and I sparred early on in that thread - I was about the only guy saying it was a decent rep early on.

A couple of things broke the deal. The SEL’s are not quite flush, but they are pretty close to being so - this is annoying having lived with the Noob V7 for so long. The second is the lume on the hands not matching the indices. Now, there may be some / one, who says neither of these are true, or a thing, but I asked my TD for a bunch of QC pics - and his opinion in the matter - and these were enough to make me stay away - not acceptable to me, and they wouldn't be even if the pricing was on parity with the competition.

To be clear - I see the almost flush SEL's and the mis match on the lume - and they bother me. It does not mean that they would bother everyone.

Spend enough time here and you’ll know there is little correlation between price and quality / accuracy. Look at the VSF Seamaster - this watch is way, way more complicated to make than a Sub, and yet VSF made a superb rep which is not expensive. Another good example is the JF vs XF ceramic / carbon AP ROO. The JF is $100 more expensive and worse in every way than the XF. So price does not equate to best. To say that because the ZZF or VSF is cheaper than the ZF means they 'cut corners' is egregiously wrong.

I also don't buy the 2 years in development crap. It does not take 2 years to copy a watch which was launched in 2010. Especially when they can't even match the lume.

I have a VSF incoming. I am not saying this is the best, and time will tell if it was the right choice. It's only £300 so no big deal either way. I see VSF as a positive, disruptive addition to the Sub game - just like the ZZF was last year.

I suspect you'll be happy whichever one you get. Just don't become one of 'those guys' who endlessly declare their own choice as the best, or jump into other Sub threads with the sole intention of shitposting that version. There's been far too much of that recently.

 

[Duckber]

I was all for getting the ZF. You know this as you and I sparred early on in that thread - I was about the only guy saying it was a decent rep early on.

A couple of things broke the deal. The SEL’s are not quite flush, but they are pretty close to being so - this is annoying having lived with the Noob V7 for so long. The second is the lume on the hands not matching the indices. Now, there may be some / one, who says neither of these are true, or a thing, but I asked my TD for a bunch of QC pics - and his opinion in the matter - and these were enough to make me stay away - not acceptable to me, and they wouldn't be even if the pricing was on parity with the competition.

To be clear - I see the almost flush SEL's and the mis match on the lume - and they bother me. It does not mean that they would bother everyone.

Spend enough time here and you’ll know there is little correlation between price and quality / accuracy. Look at the VSF Seamaster - this watch is way, way more complicated to make than a Sub, and yet VSF made a superb rep which is not expensive. Another good example is the JF vs XF ceramic / carbon AP ROO. The JF is $100 more expensive and worse in every way than the XF. So price does not equate to best. To say that because the ZZF or VSF is cheaper than the ZF means they 'cut corners' is egregiously wrong.

I also don't buy the 2 years in development crap. It does not take 2 years to copy a watch which was launched in 2010. Especially when they can't even match the lume.

I have a VSF incoming. I am not saying this is the best, and time will tell if it was the right choice. It's only £300 so no big deal either way. I see VSF as a positive, disruptive addition to the Sub game - just like the ZZF was last year.

I suspect you'll be happy whichever one you get. Just don't become one of 'those guys' who endlessly declare their own choice as the best, or jump into other Sub threads with the sole intention of shitposting that version. There's been far too much of that recently.

Not going to lie, as soon as I saw your name here I thought about our previous clash earlier and thought this was going to be another one of those, haha.

But I am glad your opinion changed with reason and the evidence to support a different viewpoint. Make no mistake I would have done the same had the SEL been great on the ZF. Although the pricepoint is still a dick move to me personally. But that's a side point.

.

Just don't become one of 'those guys' who endlessly declare their own choice as the best, or jump into other Sub threads with the sole intention of shitposting that version.

Now who would do that, even in this very topic? Ahem.... anyway, yeah. As mentioned, it all depends on what flaws you're okay with.

I have actually told my TD to source me both the ZZF V3 (eta) and the VSF. Same price, and as a catch and release it should hopefully not be hard to sell one of them.

I might make a review between the two as well to give back to the community here once they arrive.

 

[GrandmasterChime]

I was all for getting the ZF. You know this as you and I sparred early on in that thread - I was about the only guy saying it was a decent rep early on.

A couple of things broke the deal. The SEL’s are not quite flush, but they are pretty close to being so - this is annoying having lived with the Noob V7 for so long. The second is the lume on the hands not matching the indices. Now, there may be some / one, who says neither of these are true, or a thing, but I asked my TD for a bunch of QC pics - and his opinion in the matter - and these were enough to make me stay away - not acceptable to me, and they wouldn't be even if the pricing was on parity with the competition.

To be clear - I see the almost flush SEL's and the mis match on the lume - and they bother me. It does not mean that they would bother everyone.

Spend enough time here and you’ll know there is little correlation between price and quality / accuracy. Look at the VSF Seamaster - this watch is way, way more complicated to make than a Sub, and yet VSF made a superb rep which is not expensive. Another good example is the JF vs XF ceramic / carbon AP ROO. The JF is $100 more expensive and worse in every way than the XF. So price does not equate to best. To say that because the ZZF or VSF is cheaper than the ZF means they 'cut corners' is egregiously wrong.

I also don't buy the 2 years in development crap. It does not take 2 years to copy a watch which was launched in 2010. Especially when they can't even match the lume.

I have a VSF incoming. I am not saying this is the best, and time will tell if it was the right choice. It's only £300 so no big deal either way. I see VSF as a positive, disruptive addition to the Sub game - just like the ZZF was last year.

I suspect you'll be happy whichever one you get. Just don't become one of 'those guys' who endlessly declare their own choice as the best, or jump into other Sub threads with the sole intention of shitposting that version. There's been far too much of that recently.

Now thats a balanced critique which i have no problem with. Its as soon as someone makes definitive statements like this thread was started with i get triggered. I repeat im not tied to zf in anyway, if vsf does a 12 series cermit i will jump on it.

 

[Duckber]

Now thats a balanced critique which i have no problem with. Its as soon as someone makes definitive statements like this thread was started with i get triggered. I repeat im not tied to zf in anyway, if vsf does a 12 series cermit i will jump on it.

How was I unbalanced? I am not a fan of the ZF for the same reason he is, the nearly close flush lugs. What in the hell?

Or does the addition of mismatched lume somehow tip his argument from unbalanced to balanced territory?

Give me a break. Just admit you overreacted.

 

[GrandmasterChime]

How was I unbalanced? I am not a fan of the ZF for the same reason he is, the nearly close flush lugs. What in the hell?

Or does the addition of mismatched lume somehow tip his argument from unbalanced to balanced territory?

Give me a break. Just admit you overreacted.

You said dhgate level bozo, which is just being a dellusional dick. You can get an aligned rehaut on a dhgate rep does that mean the vsf is complete shit then in your eyes?
and he stated its just his opinion he may be wrong time will tell.

If you cant tell the difference thats on you

 

[Duckber]

You said dhgate level bozo, which is just being a dellusional dick. You can get an aligned rehaut on a dhgate rep does that mean the vsf is complete shit then in your eyes?
and he stated its just his opinion he may be wrong time will tell.

If you cant tell the difference thats on you

I did and still believe that the ZF end links looks DHGate level and I don't think that's an unfair rationale to have.

I don't care about a misaligned rehaut, but if someone does all the power to them if they do.

If someone posts about VSF stating their rehaut is DHGate level I won't pout like a giant baby about it. I'd respect their opinion and think it's valid even though I personally don't value that aspect in my watch as much as they do.

But I'm not insecure with my opinion. It honestly screams to me that you are insecure with your purchase which is why you're lashing out so much.

Again, understand that different people have different tastes. I rank SEL recession highly for my reps and would take nicely recessed SEL over 904L (bringing it up cause you mentioned 316L as a bad thing earlier) any day.

ZF end links are HORRID. Your picture only strengthened that opinion.

 

[GrandmasterChime]

I did and still believe that the ZF end links looks DHGate level and I don't think that's an unfair rationale to have.

I don't care about a misaligned rehaut, but if someone does all the power to them if they do.

If someone posts about VSF stating their rehaut is DHGate level I won't pout like a giant baby about it. I'd respect their opinion and think it's valid even though I personally don't value that aspect in my watch as much as they do.

But I'm not insecure with my opinion. It honestly screams to me that you are insecure with your purchase which is why you're lashing out so much.

Again, understand that different people have different tastes. I rank SEL recession highly for my reps and would take nicely recessed SEL over 904L (bringing it up cause you mentioned 316L as a bad thing earlier) any day.

ZF end links are HORRID. Your picture only strengthened that opinion.

Okay buddy you only hear what you want to hear. I will continue to buy from many different factories as and when i like as i always do.My watchbox runneth over.

 

[Duckber]

Okay buddy you only hear what you want to hear. I will continue to buy from many different factories as and when i like as i always do. The watchbox runneth over.

Another strawman tactic. I never said ZF is bad in general, just for this model. I have a Black Bay and a 15500 from ZF. This is not a sport with favorite teams.

 

[Substar]

Op you are talking out of your backside pal and creating pointless posts that already exist!!!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[PAMorROLEX]

I have been reading about ZZF vs VSF vs NOOB vs RXF vs ARF sub for quite sometime and I am unable to comprehend anything so far.. May be I am too dumb or a complete NOOB?
Nevertheless, I have ordered VSF+NOOB 11+ZZF all together from a TD. Would post the pictures comparing all three of them here and I shall retain the one which I think is better for me and dispose the rest.

My question is would anyone be able to call me out for a fake when the watch is on my wrist? I usually do meet a lot of people at business, none of them do really care about asking about the watch. I am new to this replica world, would like to know your experience in this.

 

[Yogibear]

Let's also be completely honest, 316L is arguably better than 904L in a practical setting and 904L is a marketing gimmick anyways. If VSF's trade off is looking at what actually matters ie crystal clarity, nice end link recession etc at the expense of cutting useless fat like 904L then I'm all for it.

I really don't want to deviate too much from the main topic though. I'm just not a fan of ZF. This is a topic mainly about ZZF and VSF especially since they're the exact same price for the models used.

I'm sorry if you own a ZF and that annoyed you. I'm glad you enjoy yours.

904l is a better steel than 316l. 904l has much higher corrosive resistance. It's not a marketing gimmick when your brand is known as a luxury divers watch. Sea water eats away at the caseback of a 316l steel. You can find some on ebay time to time. If you are deepsea diving or constantly around the sea for whatever reason then 904l is very much appreciated, especially for what Rolex charges.

Personally I prefer the replica to have 904l since the thing its replicating has it. ZF and VSF have 904l so that's a bonus. Crystal doesn't matter since a gen crystal is needed on any replica. To break it down further:
VSF.... bad rehaut, crap hands.. good price, above average crystal but not gen like. Good SEL.

ZF..... slight chunky case look, SEL is decent but I've seen some good ones lately, pricey.....best rehaut, average crystal, good hands, great dial.

ZF has the advantage imo since the vsf needs more gen parts. If you buy the vsf, those hands need to be gen along with the crystal. The bad rehaut you have to live with. ZF just needs a gen crystal and you are good to go.

 

[GrandmasterChime]

I have been reading about ZZF vs VSF vs NOOB vs RXF vs ARF sub for quite sometime and I am unable to comprehend anything so far.. May be I am too dumb or a complete NOOB?
Nevertheless, I have ordered VSF+NOOB 11+ZZF all together from a TD. Would post the pictures comparing all three of them here and I shall retain the one which I think is better for me and dispose the rest.

My question is would anyone be able to call me out for a fake when the watch is on my wrist? I usually do meet a lot of people at business, none of them do really care about asking about the watch. I am new to this replica world, would like to know your experience in this.

No youre not getting called out with any top tier rep. None of them are like dh gate shitters like this plonker thinks he knows from photos

 

[Duckber]

904l is a better steel than 316l. 904l has much higher corrosive resistance. It's not a marketing gimmick when your brand is known as a luxury divers watch. Sea water eats away at the caseback of a 316l steel. You can find some on ebay time to time. If you are deepsea diving or constantly around the sea for whatever reason then 904l is very much appreciated, especially for what Rolex charges.

Personally I prefer the replica to have 904l since the thing its replicating has it. ZF and VSF have 904l so that's a bonus. Crystal doesn't matter since a gen crystal is needed on any replica. To break it down further:
VSF.... bad rehaut, crap hands.. good price, above average crystal but not gen like. Good SEL.

ZF..... slight chunky case look, SEL is decent but I've seen some good ones lately, pricey.....best rehaut, average crystal, good hands, great dial.

ZF has the advantage imo since the vsf needs more gen parts. If you buy the vsf, those hands need to be gen along with the crystal. The bad rehaut you have to live with. ZF just needs a gen crystal and you are good to go.

Except the vast vast vast majority of people buying a 10k watch isn't going diving into deep depths. Only desk diving. This is a luxury item, for fashion and for status. 904L is absolutely useless to the vast majority of people and only useful to the rare strange breeds that are diving with a 10k luxury watch and not some high end machine instead.

904L is less resistant to scratches and inferior to 316L in this regard. I would take 316L any day for day to day needs to have more scratch prevention which is infinitely more useful than something I'd never do which is dive deep with a luxury watch. And I'm sure the vast majority would say the same. 904L is absolutely a marketing gimmick. Even more so to their other products in their lineup that aren't even for diving and use 904L, such as the Yacht-Master, Date-just, Oyster Perpetual, Daytona.... can't use the diving reason there. It's just a scheme to differentiate their product. Even if that differentiation is inferior. But knobs like Bigpoppad eat it up so... it's working!