sorry still hasn't arrived at anyone? I'm curious about a review .... and maybe a comparison with XF
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ZF Audemars Piguet 15202
- Thread starter XLR8R
- Start date
For those that wonder, the Chinese text regarding the now notorious pizza hand stack says:
"ZF has polished the hands, but the diameter of the cannon pinion has to be wider".
no other explanation given why.
the cannon pinion is the biggest difference, the dial looks the same as gen, the rotor is pretty bad and the strap is very close to gen. I think a V2 or V3 can be almost perfect.
jm_brc_7057
I'm Pretty Popular
You are absolutely right (unfortunately). This is a boutique only! There goes my Small chance of getting it at retail if I had any in the first place hahah
Yeah there is something about that. It’s absolutely a nice experience. Also with the interaction with them and so on. It’s quite enjoyable too.
jm_brc_7057
I'm Pretty Popular
As far as i remember Bucherer lost the permission to sell AP in many of their stores long time ago. I remember the time when AP used to buy the watches back and Bucherer was up to give reasonable discounts straight away... That was end of 2017 and 2018 if i remember correctly.
The big "problem" with ADs is that AP won't notice you as a customer - only AD does which results only in a good relationship between you and him - but not towards the brand itself.
The logical consequence is that AP won't offer you the opportunity to get one of these highly sought watches.
The fact that AP returned almost every watch from ADs to focus on their boutiques only doesn't help to gain access or to build up a reasonable portfolio to signal that you are more than just a grey market flipper which is the case with most "waiting lists"... You can speak more of a "focus group" rather than a real chronological waiting list when it comes to watches like this. Patek is also a perfect example for this. You as a Patek owner yourself are familiar with the brands identity and its way to behave - even though your vintage beauty didn't come from the Boutique directly.
Legend knows how the AP game works - he is much more experienced in this manner and you know... a legend on his own haha
Haha true. Maybe he can shed some light.
Yeah you are right. Many of the brands are making this ‘preferred client’ approach. Patek has done it for many years. AP too and now Rolex have changed their policy towards this year also. They now call it Preferred client.
And I can see your point. It’s difficult to become a preferred client in an AP boutique. Then you have to buy a lot of - sorry to say - “Junk” code 11:59 or whatever else they would want to sell you before you can access it. And the it doesn’t make any sense not to buy on grey market instead.
I didn’t know that was the reason with Bucherer. But it’s true because they can’t sell it here either. Here another retailer had AP but I think they didn’t sell enough so they revoked their license to sell APs unfortunately.
Francois talked about the business move in an interview around 2018 that they are going to focus only on boutique sales.
In addition to that he shared the thought of a brands second hand market on which used but fully refurbished watches would be offered by AP themselves. I don't know what happened to those plans but you can easily mention the intention to cut off every part in the sales chain that doesn't make a dollar for AP.
He was harshly criticized for those ideas.
jm_brc_7057
I'm Pretty Popular
Oh that sounds interesting. It's like F.P. Journe does it with their pre-owned watches. They have a programme like that too. Makes sense for them to keep the money inside. Why should grey market dealers benefit.
It's interesting to see if that monopoly would bring prices up or to a more reasonable state.
It does not really say "has to be wider" (as in a design necessity), but rather in this context, its just describing the fact that the diameter of the canon pinion of the ZF is wider. I agree with you that no explanation was given.
Maybe my learned friend tangokilo can chime in.
legend I concur that the text portion in Chinese that is next to the image of the ZF and gen dial with the hands says something to the effect of:
"The needle shaft from ZF is polished and rounded, but the shaft disc is larger than the original".
It does not explicitly state that it had to be made wider but just that it is wider.
Thanks for thinking of me for this translation. I must admit that some of the higher technical terms are difficult for me but a good practice and learning experience!
"The needle shaft from ZF is polished and rounded, but the shaft disc is larger than the original".
It does not explicitly state that it had to be made wider but just that it is wider.
Thanks for thinking of me for this translation. I must admit that some of the higher technical terms are difficult for me but a good practice and learning experience!
Thank you TK.
"needle shaft" = canon pinion
"shaft disc" = hand base of the hour hand, essentially.
A lot of members talk about the "canon pinion mod" when they are really referring to the trimming, beveling and polish of the hand base. The canon pinion of 15202 and other AP reps are almost never modded, but the hand base frequently is.
We are in agreement. I am just wondering why the hand base of the hour hand needs to be so wide. Technically it does not have to be and this is an otherwise stellar release. It is hard to miss the large hand base when it is smack in the middle of the dial, and something you see each time you look at the watch once you know about it.
Yes I see, the anatomy of watches is something I am not familiar with either in German or English, let alone in a language as complex as Chinese.
As you mention, the larger diameter hand base is troubling on such a fine effort by ZF. We will soon know if it can be modified to look much nicer.
As you mention, the larger diameter hand base is troubling on such a fine effort by ZF. We will soon know if it can be modified to look much nicer.
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Well TK, as you know, this thread isn't about technical knowledge of language or details thereof, but plainly speaking, I think we can agree that there is no ostensible reason why the hand base needs to be so large. Even if the pinion opening is larger than gen, the hand base is still out of proportion with regard to width of said opening.
I like to think they did it just to mess with RWI/Repgeek(s) etc. 
jm_brc_7057
I'm Pretty Popular
LOL, and they hit their goal as we do have here approx 10 out of 11 pages of pinion and hands critics and "analysis"
