VSF3235 - VR3235 Comparison

[dogwood]

I read somewhere that the barrel is sealed on the vs3235 and can’t be serviced. Are the mainsprings thinner longer or stronger in some way? Just trying to figure out how they were able to boost the power reserve to 72 hrs in the reps. I read they boosted the Gen 3235 about 15% through less mass and inertia by skeletonizing the escape wheel. However that still doesn’t account for all the additional boost they achieved in the Gen 3235. These are really incredible movements but I wonder if trade off were made or actual improvements. What’s your thoughts on the 3235 and common problems you’ve encountered?

The gen 3235 mainspring & barrel is considered a consumable (ie not serviceable) part of the movement. I don’t open the barrel to service the mainspring when I work on a vs3235 (or dd3285). I might be wrong, but I think one issue is that the 3235 mainspring is wound in the opposite direction compared to normal Swiss mainsprings (ie in the Japanese mainspring direction). This means you’d need a new mainspring winder to get the spring back into the barrel since the existing 3135 winder would have the wrong arbor… but I’m not 100% on the direction of the coil thing.

I believe the gen mainspring is also slightly softer / less stiff than the VS version. I’ve seen movements drop a bit in amplitude when I replaced the mainspring barrel with a gen one. This makes sense though. The gen train wheels / escapement will have lower friction compared with the rep, so a less powerful mainspring would be needed to drive it. That probably explains why the gen gets 72 hours of power reserve and the rep gets slightly less. Power reserve is a function of the physical length of the mainspring. A thinner mainspring (weaker) can be longer and still be wound into a barrel of a fix diameter. The rep mainspring is probably slightly thicker (stronger) so it has to be slightly shorter to be wound into the same size barrel.

 

[Zeta7]

The gen 3235 mainspring & barrel is considered a consumable (ie not serviceable) part of the movement. I don’t open the barrel to service the mainspring when I work on a vs3235 (or dd3285). I might be wrong, but I think one issue is that the 3235 mainspring is wound in the opposite direction compared to normal Swiss mainsprings (ie in the Japanese mainspring direction). This means you’d need a new mainspring winder to get the spring back into the barrel since the existing 3135 winder would have the wrong arbor… but I’m not 100% on the direction of the coil thing.

I believe the gen mainspring is also slightly softer / less stiff than the VS version. I’ve seen movements drop a bit in amplitude when I replaced the mainspring barrel with a gen one. This makes sense though. The gen train wheels / escapement will have lower friction compared with the rep, so a less powerful mainspring would be needed to drive it. That probably explains why the gen gets 72 hours of power reserve and the rep gets slightly less. Power reserve is a function of the physical length of the mainspring. A thinner mainspring (weaker) can be longer and still be wound into a barrel of a fix diameter. The rep mainspring is probably slightly thicker (stronger) so it has to be slightly shorter to be wound into the same size barrel.

I suspected they had hopped up the reps mainspring to achieve similar results as the gens. Seems like a good idea to swap the reps barrel and mainspring for gen so the extra force of the reps mainspring doesn’t damage other parts

 

[dogwood]

I suspected they had hopped up the reps mainspring to achieve similar results as the gens. Seems like a good idea to swap the reps barrel and mainspring for gen so the extra force of the reps mainspring doesn’t damage other parts

Swapping a gen mainspring and barrel into a vs3235 can result in low amplitude because the rep escapement has more friction — the rep escape wheel isn’t skeletonized and the rep pallet stones are bigger than the pallet stones on the gen pallet fork. So the rep mainspring is likely balanced correctly to provide the right amount of force for the rep escapement. A gen mainspring might not apply enough force to the escapement to yield a healthy amplitude.

 

[Mark1937]

The Submariner 40mm got a different movement, the 3135.
The Submariner 41mm got a different datewheel compared to the Yacht Master.

Wich 3235 on DJ 36 126234?

 

[Zeta7]

Swapping a gen mainspring and barrel into a vs3235 can result in low amplitude because the rep escapement has more friction — the rep escape wheel isn’t skeletonized and the rep pallet stones are bigger than the pallet stones on the gen pallet fork. So the rep mainspring is likely balanced correctly to provide the right amount of force for the rep escapement. A gen mainspring might not apply enough force to the escapement to yield a healthy amplitude.

That makes perfect sense. So ultimately it would be best to remove all the Chinese mods they made to the movement and return it to its original design. As a cheaper but inferior option, when the barrel has got to be changed it’s best to also change the escape wheel and pallet forks?
I’ve been really interested in these awesome movements since I first started reading about them. I’ve been thinking about it for a while and it seems that returning to the original design and servicing schedule is definitely the way to go. Although a bit pricey it should payoff over time. Just my humble opinion though

 

[dogwood]

That makes perfect sense. So ultimately it would be best to remove all the Chinese mods they made to the movement and return it to its original design. As a cheaper but inferior option, when the barrel has got to be changed it’s best to also change the escape wheel and pallet forks?
I’ve been really interested in these awesome movements since I first started reading about them. I’ve been thinking about it for a while and it seems that returning to the original design and servicing schedule is definitely the way to go. Although a bit pricey it should payoff over time. Just my humble opinion though

Yeah dropping in a gen escape wheel and pallet fork when you eventually replace the rep mainspring isn’t a bad idea. It’s an easy mod and those parts aren’t very expensive.

 

[Zeta7]

Yeah dropping in a gen escape wheel and pallet fork when you eventually replace the rep mainspring isn’t a bad idea. It’s an easy mod and those parts aren’t very expensive.

That’s some good information man. I appreciate you clarifying.

 

[therepfather]

i have issues with the bearings on my rotor (vs3235). Does anyone know if i could swap a vr3235 rotor with vr triangular screw in the vs3235 movement?
Thanks and nice holidays!

 

[Replicated]

Could you share what the issue is?

 

[Replicated]

Wich 3235 on DJ 36 126234?

Don't pin me on this, but I've read the 36mm got the same movement as the 41mm Submariner.

 

[Mark1937]

Don't pin me on this, but I've read the 36mm got the same movement as the 41mm Submariner.

Yes bro. Me too...

 

[therepfather]

Could you share what the issue is?

bearings makes scratchy noises. (i got another vs3235 which works out fine and don't sound like this at all.
i will get my hands on an vr3235 movement in about a week anyway, (cf dj41 donor watch for an hybrid project) and asked me about compatibilty of the rotor.
If this will not work out, i will get a gen one.

 

[therepfather]

Could you share what the issue is?

* i have to add that i tried it with a rotor silencing service (moebius 9010) but i didnt worked out.

 

[StanGENROL]

Hi guys quick question I got a Clean 126610LN with its doggy movement hybrid 3235 and wondered is it possible to just grab vsf126610LN movement and put it into my clean case ? And use clean dial on my vs3235 movement ? Thanks

Also are the vsf126610 in 2024 have their best movement clone ? That can take genuine sub parts ?

 

[lovegensandreps]

Hi guys quick question I got a Clean 126610LN with its doggy movement hybrid 3235 and wondered is it possible to just grab vsf126610LN movement and put it into my clean case ? And use clean dial on my vs3235 movement ? Thanks

Also are the vsf126610 in 2024 have their best movement clone ? That can take genuine sub parts ?

Just read this, it has all the info you require

 

[StanGENROL]

Just read this, it has all the info you require

Seams can’t find exactly my answer to my question if dial from clean 126610 go on to vsf movement and also will vsf movement fit in my clean case ? Both are 126610LN and also 41mm with 3235 movement

 

[StanGENROL]

Also guys the movement I got in clean just unbelievable mix and looks like some of wheels are so fragile and not nicely refined and at some point looks like just foil and any kind of pressure those will snap 🫰

Some detailed photos of some parts, if you need more let me know guys as my movement is now taken a part

 

[Zeta7]

The Gen gears look much better to me. There’s different ways of hobbing gears and some of the reps gears look like they were just stamped and not hobbed at all. No more expensive than what Gen gears are and considering you’ve already got it apart I’d buy Gen gears and be done with it. Just make sure you buy new ones. Just my humble opinion

 

[derjenigewelcher]

"Why does the gen Rolex cost so much? I mean, when chinese can produce so cheap, Rolex must be a ripoff".


Under the microscope and eyes of a watchmaker you can see why.

 

[StanGENROL]

Guys quick question so I lubed the movement and all that jazz, now since I did unwind of spring barel, and I put all movment together strangely when winding my watch it starts but then stops and before stopping it goes nice then this micro lag and then moves and stops, is this because barel spring was not winded ? I just put all together thinking well I put all together even without winded spring this still should wind and work no issues, but then after assembly it doesn’t wind just with crow, it do work but short period time then stops, any advice?


Thanks guys much appreciated

I ordered VSF 126610 41 and will just drop in to my CF case, and then add gen parts got most of them like plates and bridges and springs and even fork and escape wheel date jumper and all that sweet stuff it will be about 78/80% sub 3235 movement, I will update on project here!