Panerai Strap Tubes?

[tootall]

You are right, it is getting funny. Panerai did not invnet tubes in straps. Their engineers had nothing to do with that.

All of the original "dive" models did not have tubes in them, so I don't get your point about that. The modern dive models use rubber straps, so that is a different point all together.

I do like your example of the wetting leather, but are you really swimming with your leather strap? If so, then that is something I have not tested, as a rubber or SS strap would be a much better strap for that application. And after the strap dries it will shrink a little and thus the screw hole will be larger. So no point there.

I guess nothing I say will satisfy you. I have told you 3 times now, I have proven my points to be factual. I guess I will do a youtube video tonight to further prove this point if need be. Wait, that won't work as you will say I am not twisting hard enough or something.

Just start making your own straps and experiment, don't just put on some you have bought. Then get back with me

 

[Ferrariman]

Well....I certainly don't want to add any fuel here but I have had a strap loosen a lug screw on my rep 187 without tubes. In fact a member on the board was witness to it. I installed tubes and it quit doing it.

Could you explain "how" the strap loosened the screw. I am willing to give up my position if someone has proof otherwise. Are you sure the screw was not messed up in the first place? And what strap was this?

I'm sorry I can't tell you how exactly. A guess it was the movement of the watch on my wrist. I had a leather strap that I bought (I think) from TC.

I am certainly not asking you to give up any position. I think it just depends on many factors mostly the nonstandardization of our watches. You may never experience what happened to me but I assure you it did happen.

And for the record I have a Trevor S.T. Dupont lighter that the pin comes out from opening and closing it. LOL

 

[pugwash]

I do like your example of the wetting leather, but are you really swimming with your leather strap?

Why else would we spend extra for "Waterproof Leather" straps? :shock:

 

[tootall]

I do like your example of the wetting leather, but are you really swimming with your leather strap?

Why else would we spend extra for "Waterproof Leather" straps? :shock:

LOL, well then his example of it shrinking or fusing to the screw wouldn't hold true if it's waterproof leather.

I'm sorry I can't tell you how exactly. A guess it was the movement of the watch on my wrist. I had a leather strap that I bought (I think) from TC.

I am certainly not asking you to give up any position. I think it just depends on many factors mostly the nonstandardization of our watches. You may never experience what happened to me but I assure you it did happen.

And for the record I have a Trevor S.T. Dupont lighter that the pin comes out from opening and closing it. LOL

I am sorry if you thought I didn't believe you. I totally believe you. I was just wondering "how" this came about. It seems that your screw was messed up to begin with, so I could see how it would loosen it. And especially if it was a TC strap which have no skivving.

About Trevor? huh? :? I don't get that

 

[pugwash]

LOL, well then his example of it shrinking or fusing to the screw wouldn't hold true if it's waterproof leather.

Sure it will. Give it a go, it'll save loads of discussions.

hint: waterproofing of leather is usually exterior treatment.

 

[bme]

Let's face it some of us are tube people and others not. Me, I'm all for them!

Now, there must be more important scientific data we can discuss....how about the ethics of human cloning?

 

[pugwash]

Let's face it some of us are tube people and others not. Me, I'm all for them!

I use tubes on half of my Panerais, the other half having River's spring bars installed instead.

 

[Ferrariman]

I am sorry if you thought I didn't believe you. I totally believe you. I was just wondering "how" this came about. It seems that your screw was messed up to begin with, so I could see how it would loosen it. And especially if it was a TC strap which have no skivving.

About Trevor? huh? :? I don't get that

No worries mate, I didn't take it as though you didn't believe me. As far as the trevor thing I was just making fun.

 

[Jake48]

I do like your example of the wetting leather, but are you really swimming with your leather strap?

Your not going to tell me you have never seen a leather strap that was soaked with sweat now are you?

Like I said earlier, it only takes a little bit of moisture (sweat) to expand leather. Swimming is a whole 'nother deal. Again, I think if you read my posts I don't say things like "never" or claim my ideas are "proven facts".

Interesting thoughts - all of them. But I think you might want to take your argument about tubes - "They don't really serve a purpose" to the guys at Panerai.

On this one, I am going to side with them. Sorry tootall. I'll be in Italy next January - just for you I'll go to the source and ask them what the h%ll they were thinking putting tubes on a watch when everyone knows "they don't really serve a purpose"

I ll try and get you a name too. Then you can send them your youtube video and prove them wrong - every single one of those doubting Panerai b@strards!


OK - Maybe we are all just a bunch of BS'ers - this seems to make the most sense - Taken from the Officine Panerai Reference Section, TimeZone -
"You will notice that the screws are passed through a tube that adds to the tensile strength of the strap attachment, and it is recommended that you use these tubes with each strap that you fit to your watch."

May I suggest you send your video over to timezone too. It seems they don't have there "facts" right. They don't understand that tubes are for making the strap pins glide easier nor do they understand that they (tubes) don't really serve a purpose"

(Just kidd'n tootall - come on, you have got to be getting a laugh by now)

Please tell me your not going to argue that the tubes don't add tensile strength...

 

[seraphe]

Yikes! A simple question turned into a debate overnight? It's still a productive one though...

On the logic of tubes protecting the screws, I am still puzzled to how much the straps should move when one's wearing it. Do they really move enough to unscrew the pins if worn without tubes?

On protecting the strap, I would think the reason leather is ideal as a strap is the toughness. It's not easy to break or tear leather (ie. unless it's faux leather). Protection seems only logical if the strap is rubber.

The other logical purpose I can see for the tubes is to prevent the screw pins from bending upon extensive wear. Again, this can only be possible if the strap is made of thin/soft leather or rubber, where the pull pressure is not even across the pin.

Just my thoughts after reading all your opinions.

(Oh, btw... there isn't a universal fact when it comes to the effect of tubes since we wear our watches differently. Some loose some tight. Some conical shaped wrist, some cylindical.)

 

[Jake48]

Yikes! A simple question turned into a debate overnight? It's still a productive one though...

Welcome to the internet seraphe!!!!!!!!

Nice synopsis by the way!!!

 

[tootall]

Yikes! A simple question turned into a debate overnight? It's still a productive one though...

On the logic of tubes protecting the screws, I am still puzzled to how much the straps should move when one's wearing it. Do they really move enough to unscrew the pins if worn without tubes?

This is my point exactly. It is not possible to do this. For example. Take your PAM. And while the strap is on, pinch your fingers together around the screw and strap, like using the strap as a sort of wrench. Try to spin the screw out. You won't be able to do it. If you have decent screws with good lugs you won't even be able to loosen it. I included a pic of what I mean.

 

[seraphe]

Let's put the 'protective' purpose of the tube aside. I think another possible use of the tube is to tighten straps that are a little loose for the lug pins. This can happen for thinner leather stretched after some use or custom straps a little 'less than perfect'. With this stretched, the strap can become shaky on the lug pins. Perhap the tubes can help to prevent this?

 

[d4m.test]

I think the same than tootall, tubes are NOT necesary. I have buoght one 177h davidsen i can´t use strap with tubes on it. Case and screw are very near on davidsen watch.

If the straps are made with quality a 3 leathers, use tubes is loose money and time.

Tubes are not necesary.

Regards,
Fran

 

[Jake48]

I think the same than tootall, tubes are NOT necesary. I have buoght one 177h davidsen i can´t use strap with tubes on it. Case and screw are very near on davidsen watch.
If the straps are made with quality a 3 leathers, use tubes is loose money and time.
Tubes are not necesary.
Regards,
Fran

Fran,
Strap tubes don't work on many of Davidsen's models because he uses larger strap pins and the tubes will not fit over the larger diameter pins. If I remember correctly, especially on most of his older cases, he had the larger strap pins. You probably have one of those cases. Not to mention that even as good as Davidsens watches are (I own four of them) they are still Reps and you are trying to compare an engineered function (strap tubes) of a Gen to a Rep that is not exactly 1:1.

Whether you want to use tubes or not, really becomes a personal choice, but when you start saying things like "they serve no purpose" and I know, because I have the "facts" the obvious question is how is it that you would know more than the designers at Panerai?

I would find it hard to believe the designers at Panerai sat around one day and said I know, let's put something that is totally useless on our watch. What could we do that serves no purpose, will cost us extra money to manufacture and will not improve the quality of our watch one bit? I know... STRAP TUBES!

Do you really think that is what happened? Or do you think that maybe, just maybe, someone over at Panerai actually knows what they are doing?

We may not be able to agree on what exactly the function or benefit a strap tube accomplishes, but if were a gambling man I would bet that there is a little Italian guy over at Panerai that is really proud of his strap tubes and would laugh at the idea that we think we know better...

Just something to think about

 

[d4m.test]

I didn´t known Jake48, davidsen has sent me older case

I use tubes in my others Pam, but i really think they are not necesary. I´m speaking about custom straps, i make it with a small hole and i don´t put tubes on it.

Regards,
Fran

 

[Jake48]

I didn´t known Jake48, davidsen has sent me older case

I use tubes in my others Pam, but i really think they are not necesary. I´m speaking about custom straps, i make it with a small hole and i don´t put tubes on it.
Regards,
Fran

Fran,
I can't be sure of course, but the older style 44mm case he used did not come with tubes and had less of a cut away between the lugs for the strap to clear. The newer style case uses tubes on the pins and has a little bigger cut away for the strap to clear.

And yes, some straps I have had custom made do not fit tubes. I have tried to fit the tube in the strap, but it seems like it stretches the leather to tight so I run the strap without the tube.

Hope this helps...

 

[tootall]

Hey Jake48,

I don't know where you got the information that Panerai engineered and invented strap tubes. Whoever told you that is ignorant of the facts.

Strap tubes were around for a while in many many other watch brands. Panerai did not invent the leather watch strap, nor did they come up with any new inventions about the strap, except maybe the Pre-V buckle. Strap tubes are not placed in after the strap is assembled, but while it is being assembled. It provides a means of holding a strap in place in a jig while the machine stitches. So the guys at Panerai, didn't engineer this design, nor did they put them in their straps for added protection.

 

[Jake48]

Hey Jake48,

I don't know where you got the information that Panerai engineered and invented strap tubes. Whoever told you that is ignorant of the facts.

Strap tubes were around for a while in many many other watch brands. Panerai did not invent the leather watch strap, nor did they come up with any new inventions about the strap, except maybe the Pre-V buckle. Strap tubes are not placed in after the strap is assembled, but while it is being assembled. It provides a means of holding a strap in place in a jig while the machine stitches. So the guys at Panerai, didn't engineer this design, nor did they put them in their straps for added protection.

Tootall - I did not say the engineers at Panerai INVENTED strap tubes, nor more than Toyota invented the wheel. The OBVIOUS point is that like the engineers at Toyota with the wheel, the engineers at Panerai feel that strap tubes serve a purpose. This is in direct opposition to your stated opinion of "strap tubes really serve no purpose" I am not looking to debate the strap tube deal with you. Clearly you have stated how you feel about tubes. We don't agree - can you leave it at that? No amount of saying things like I have the "facts" will change how you see it or I see it.

I have contacted a friend who knows someone inside at Panerai. He will get a name and an anwser to the the reason Panerai chooses to use strap tubes. I will post the answer with the name over at Panerai. You can take your arguement to him and tell hm that he is wasting Panerai's money with something that "serves no purpose".

Untill then, my friend, we just disagree. I think strap tubes serve a purpose (which I have already stated) and you have stated ""They don't really serve a purpose"

Oh - and good luck...

 

[tootall]

I have contacted a friend who knows someone inside at Panerai. He will get a name and an anwser to the the reason Panerai chooses to use strap tubes. I will post the answer with the name over at Panerai. You can take your arguement to him and tell hm that he is wasting Panerai's money with something that "serves no purpose".

LOL,

I look forward to your friend of a friend's response. :lol: