Lesson Learned: How and how not to replace the ARF 116610 crystal

[ExOmegaFan]

All,

As I'm far from being as experienced as other people here, let me document some of my lesson learned to avoid that you step into the same pile of shit and lose hairs at spots where you'd like to keep them. This is also the reason why I don't call this "tutorial", as there are other posts available but haven't really seen or not found a one that covers the ARF (that is a little bit different from the BP from what I can tell). If you work on a BP, this is different as the bezel gives you a headache when putting it back - read other threads to work on that kind of watch!

Let me start by telling you that you should take your time and not get overly excited by the arrival of the prof blackhole crystal. Breath, THINK, then act ...

I strongly recommend to also read this thread and in addition every post you can find by KJ2020 (this is not about boot-licking but without his help I'd still be stuck, thanks again!): https://forum.replica-watch.info/fo...-rolex-submariner-116610-ln-lower-crystal-mag

Disassembly / Removal of the crystal

• Remove the bezel assembly, I can't tell you how important it is to do that - otherwise: Greetings from my bank account to acquire a new insert ...
• Ensure that you tape the area where your knife makes contact with the case when you remove the bezel, to avoid scratches
• Below the bezel there are in total four clicks with springs below them, one of the clicks goes in only in one direction as it is the one that keeps the bezel from turning forward
• Remove the caseback and the movement, keep it in a safe place (a dust tray for example)
• You can try to press out the crystal with your hands but unless you're Hulk (pun intended) the crystal will not move (at least that was the case for me - as Mr. IT-nice-guy-without-muscles)
• You did remove the bezel before putting it in your glass press now to press the crystal out - correct? You don't want to end up with this ... (at this point, this was a cry-stal replacement for me)
• If you answered the above with yes, you may put the watch upside down (hollow die under the watch to catch the crystal) and press out the crystal with a flat die that fits inside of the watch (in my case I used the 27 mm flat die)

• Chances are that you ended up with the following "parts" now, if you ignored the remark regarding your bezel - your insert will also be gone to "insert heaven" (trash bin)

Inserting/Positioning the crystal

• Before you do anything with the crystal, it is important that you clean it properly from both sides and wear finger cots to avoid that you add fingerprints
• You should have the gasket, retaining ring and crystal in hand - in case you were lucky and the stock crystal just popped out - you can skip the following steps until the crystal positioning
  • Push the gasket on the watch first, ensure it is firmly seated on the watch case
  • For the next step (retainer ring), it is important that you note the orientation of the ring - which has a notch that should be close to the case (as the bezel assembly will lock into place there later)
  • Following picture is a reference for this retainer ring orientation
  • 
  • Put the retainer ring over the gasket and push it down as far as you can by hand
  • At some point you can't push it further by hand, you'll need to use your glass press to do that. Use one of the hollow dies that fits over the retainer ring (in my case the 34 mm die) and push it down until the retainer ring reaches the case. It might be necessary to dremel on your die if you can't push it far enough without pressing the gasket/case. Some appear to use a 36mm DJF fluted bezel for this task - but I didn't have the luck of owning such piece
• The crystal positioning is delicate, as depending on the quality of your glass press (I didn't buy the $15 one, but spent $45 - but that one still isn't very precise)
• I found the following Youtube video helpful, which uses the inserted stem as a reference point where the cyclops should be positioned you may also use the tube as orientation

• You need to select and appropriate size for the dies on your glass press. I selected 39mm below the watch and pressed the glas in with the 27mm die
• Choose a die that lets you push in the crystal while the die doesn't push on the cyclops!

• When you found a good position for your crystal, you need to press it on with your glass press. Depending on your strength you may be able to do the early beginning by hand - I couldn't, probably lack of muscles
• I ended up with multiple attempts to press this in and failed and could see small "steps" on the gasket which is gave away that the positioning of the crystal wasn't good
• I'm writing this, to tell you that the world didn't yet come to an end: I removed the whole gasket/retainer combination again and turned the gasket around, which gave me a fresh start
  • I'm well aware that this is likely not "best watchsmiths practice", but frick I was desperate to fit this crystal
• I positioned everything perfectly again, ensured that the crystal position towards the gasket got as good as it gets and pushed the hell out of this press and voila: If finally made it onto the watch case!

Bezel assembly

• TODO as I need to wait for my replacement insert
• I'll add that once I get the parts (hopefully I can still edit my post at that time)

Intermediate result so far




I hope that is helpful for some of you. If you have remarks on what I should have done differently, feel free to provide me your feedback. Please keep in mind that this is my first attempt to replace a crystal and I'm satisfied with the result.

 

[KJ2020]

Fantastic write up and pics bro! Way to hang in there and get it done - it looks marvelous. There is much greater satisfaction wearing your reps when you have modded them yourself. Mistakes are often the best teachers - there are those who have cracked inserts and those who will. This post will be a great resource for those who follow. Welcome the world of Rolex modding!

Save your ARF pearl, it can become quite useful.

 

[Hazing]

Awesome thread, man. I’ve been wanting to try this just for curiosity’s sake anyway, but with the recent arrival of my new ARF Hulk (yesterday) it’s something that I am going to need to do. My intent was to try and find a decent practice watch because I assumed that the first time I do this, it’s going to be a total practice run and probably someth that ends up with me having like a bunch of miscellaneous parts instead of an assembled watch but this thread gives me some hope. I still don’t want to open the LV until I have a better idea of what to expect and a decent *feel* for how to do this. How to much pressure to apply and how tight the parts are, things like that. I also need a better press and some other tools and back up spare parts as well. But good stuff man. Thanks for posting this and also taking the time while working on the watch to take pics for this thread. I can’t wait to try this.

 

[Hazing]

Save your ARF pearl, it can become quite useful.

Good advice. I was just looking at that poor bezel insert and laughing as I imagined what it went through to end up in a few hundred pieces like that.

 

[sn95]

Thank you for taking your time to write this up, very nice hobby to get into and I think with enough practice it might eventually become relaxing

 

[muiramas]

How does the crystal press work with the cyclops? Is there are recess that the cyclops fits inside on the punch/ die?

 

[ExOmegaFan]

Yes, the die is hollow so you really press on the outer side of the die/glass instead of the full glass (which would include and could damage the cyclops - also it would be even more difficult to properly position the glass with the date magnification)

 

[KJ2020]

There are dies made with cuts in them for cyclops. I just took a dremel to a couple of my dies.

 

[Spiral_Cabbage]

Thanks for the right up. I remember my first insert break.

For the crystal installation, I have done it a little differently. I instal the crystal onto the gasket and then place them together on the case. Then aligning the cyclops, I place the steel retainer ring and push it down. I don’t know if this is right or not, however, I try not to harm the gasket at all to help with water resistance.

Thanks again for taking the time to do this.

 

[MrBobDobbs]

Thanks for the tips! I tend to learn things the hard way!

 

[KJ2020]

Thanks for the right up. I remember my first insert break.

For the crystal installation, I have done it a little differently. I instal the crystal onto the gasket and then place them together on the case. Then aligning the cyclops, I place the steel retainer ring and push it down. I don’t know if this is right or not, however, I try not to harm the gasket at all to help with water resistance.

Thanks again for taking the time to do this.

Really no right or wrong way, whatever you're comfortable with is fine. Many watches don't have a separate retaining ring, the outer gasket surround is built into the watch case. The gasket can be damaged any way you do it and pressing a retaining ring over a tight gasket with a crystal already seated can be quite challenging without a really good die (or substitute pressing object).

There was a member who made a custom pressing object especially for retaining rings that looked like it would work really well. I'll try to find the thread. A hollow die with a non-sloped inner wall is good - I grinded one of mine out that had a sloped wall and it works well. You could also find and use a PVC pipe section of the correct inner diameter. Lay the watch flat on the bench and use a sturdy piece of wood atop the pipe section and press by hand. I've used this approach to re-press bezels that didn't want to co-operate with other techniques. Even used a vice as a press one time, lol.

 

[Spiral_Cabbage]

The gasket can be damaged any way you do it and pressing a retaining ring over a tight gasket with a crystal already seated can be quite challenging without a really good die (or substitute pressing object)

That is so true. I had to make a die out of delrin to be able to do it correctly. Grinding out the sloped die is a good idea and I wish that I would of thought of that first.

 

[Futzorr]

I love these helpful topics!
i myself am new and keep reading/watching videos to avoid making mistakes (probably still will do haha)

anyhow, good work!

 

[ExOmegaFan]

Those who wonder how you end up with the ceramic insert like that (since I got messages asking how I did that):

I'm not exactly proud, but I thought it was a great idea to just put the watch in the matching die in the glass press to press the crystal out (where the bezel rested on the die). History was made, the idea didn't turn out to be great. I can strongly recommend to avoid this - which is the reason I state like ten times in my "lesson learned" post, to not push on the ceramic.

 

[ExOmegaFan]

Current status:



On Monday I can continue as the bezel insert should arrive

 

[PurePete]

Great effort! Thanks for posting the info.

 

[Bilbobfd]

Did you ever finish the repair?

 

[KJ2020]

Did you ever finish the repair?

Another DIY thread in the link below if interested

6-digit Sub crystal and bezel swap

 

[Bloyall110]

That is so true. I had to make a die out of delrin to be able to do it correctly. Grinding out the sloped die is a good idea and I wish that I would of thought of that first.

 

[m5750]

Friend. Your post saved me from losing hair. Huge, huge help. Thank you.