Differences between Asian 6497 Swan Neck and SWISS 6497 SN?

[Paulrnyn]

Re: the point babola, is why bother with this guy?

Why would the Chinese make 2 different models of the same movement? why not just spiff it up and put an ETA stamp on it?

 

[avitt]

Re: the point babola, is why bother with this guy?

Why would the Chinese make 2 different models of the same movement? why not just spiff it up and put an ETA stamp on it?

"Chinese" factories also compete with one another...

 

[tootall]

Let's send a couple of these to ETA and see what they have to say. I would be interested in their reply. I have contacted them already about this subject and got the answer from the pictures I showed them, that the movements are NOT eta. However, no one seems to believe little ol me. I had this same argument with ThumbWa in a previous thread.

But if you want to be 100% sure, let's send them a couple.

 

[hooligan]

You showed them pictures of rep movements?

 

[rogerwine]

IMHO, this is a very good debate and it never gets settled. And I don't feel that it has been beaten to death. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle of the issue. However, there must be an agreed upon test or standard that describes what a true Swiss 6497 should consist of. One part of it was the standardization of the movement and parts and their ability to be replaced. Other statements are that the ETA markings were stamped and not laser etched. The bevel of the gears the shape of the spokes of the balance wheel. These were issues that could generally be seen without taking apart the entire movement. So, do those standards still hold true or are there new traits that need to be identified? It seems likely that the lines are becoming seriously blurred and harder to agree on. If the issue is bogus then Tourby's points of contention need to be refuted one by one.
That has been the reality of this issue all along, suspicions are there, but no one has produced the knock out punch, one way or the other. I have no vested interest in either position, but at this point I would strongly tend to agree with Tourby's point of view. I would rather, that the point of view be proven incorrect and then we could all happily relax.
"Wheres the Beef"
Rogerwine

 

[tootall]

You showed them pictures of rep movements?

Yes, I showed them many pictures of rep movements. Macro shots, etc. I was trying to get to the bottom of it after thumb bashed me in that thread. He is a very respected guy on here and no matter how hard I tried to prove otherwise people believe what they want even in the face of factual proof.

ETA says the movement is fake. That is enough for me. You can go and email them. Wait the three months it takes them to respond and then make your own conclusion as well.

 

[hooligan]

Well, I'm not saying that they lied, but I'd certainly understand if they didn't want to own up to having their movements used in counterfeit products.

Personally I couldn't care less. If the movement looks and works well, and can be repaired if necessary, I'm fine with it.

 

[avitt]

Think about this: It took replica collectors about a year to determine that the Asian 2892 copy was just that...What makes it so hard to believe that the master Chinese craftsmen would have such a difficult time reproducing the "look and feel" of an enormous, mid-century pocket watch movement?

 

[tootall]

Well, I'm not saying that they lied, but I'd certainly understand if they didn't want to own up to having their movements used in counterfeit products.

Personally I couldn't care less. If the movement looks and works well, and can be repaired if necessary, I'm fine with it.

LOL, I didn't send them pics of the movement in a replica watch. I sent them pictures of a unbranded Asian clone by itself, out of the case. It's was the same thing ThumbWa sells except that it did not have the Panerai logo's.

I also sent them pictures of a 2892 clone, but that's a whole other story.

 

[hooligan]

Ah, gotcha. OK.

:wink:

 

[drfcfighter]

Well... you guys definitely know better than me regarding this issue.

My one question is...

anyone have problems with Asian version? How does the movement hold up compared to the Swiss?

I've been only buying "Swiss" but if the Asian ones work fine and are servicable and repairable by Vac, Flav, Joe, etc., I guess I'll try.

Key thing is... is the Asian version as durable and with longevity as the Swiss versions???

 

[babola]

I believe this post should die its slow death...but since one of the participants started another thread on RWG, rather than me repeating the same here :

http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?sho ... ntry276566

I'm ready to debate this all you want, but the fact remains - there are still good Swiss ETA mov'ts available in PAM reps, the trick is how to ensure you get one when you order you rep... 8)

cheers,
babola

 

[tourby]

@babola

maybe you are right (i were very happy) and i had bad luck with my swan neck rep movements. Bought 4 movements and 2 different versions of swan neck... and they are the asian ones... but it exis swiss movements???

Ok i´ll belive you...

but hey!!!!... where are this swiss swan neck pam rep movements? Where? Show us this movements... and please remove the winding gears and show us the swiss parts. If they exist, it should be easy to post pics...

i white you are a good guy babola... and i white you have very good knowledge. And i will belive you when you told me it exist swiss swan neck rep movements. But please understand also my opinion. I can talk only about what i see... and i have not see any swiss swan neck rep movement.

@Enzo

i am not interested to call all asian movements bad to make promotion for my swiss movements sale... i have post my movements, because they are my proud collection. I have enough customers and very happy with my business and don´t need more promotion. Also i get RWG/RWI members 20% discount on my parts. That´s means i make only very less profit here... ask my customers from RWG/RWI and they will let you know how kindhearted i am.

also is "Unitas" a term which used here many thousand time for ETA 6497... never any criticism from you or any other member... but if i use this general term "Unitas"... it is FU**ING WRONG???????

 

[babola]

@ Tourby

I'm not at home @ the mo, will be back in a week. Until then have a look here:
http://forum.replica-watch.info/forum/vie ... 86&start=0

This is the EXACT new Swiss ETA 6497-1 E-series movement I received in Fiddy from Davidsen, as described (I nicknamed it super-E mov't ).
It was made available few months ago, then completely dissapeared from the market not long after, and now again available as part of Davidsen's latest ultimate Fiddy offering that he just announced on Monday (see his forum for more info).

Joshua had the one PAM rep available with this super-E movement (111G), and Paul @Wo-mart had few (111G, 113G, 183G and Fiddy). All of them are now unavailable, but as I said Davidsen managed to source a new shipment few days ago, and will be offering them inside his Fiddys.

cheers,
babola

 

[tourby]

@babola

yes this movements from DVDS looks very good. Seems like a swiss movement? I know Davidsens, he is a good guy and wouldn not call it swiss, if it were asian.

i like this DVDS movement and i am very happy. Would see it in my hand. Can´t wait to order it.

great news... but 90% of all other swan neck movements shown on other dealers sites are asian for sure.

 

[horologie_unitas]

lets not forget....


ETA IS MANUFACTURING IN ASIA !! ( CHINA & THAILAND )

 

[tourby]

lets not forget....


ETA IS MANUFACTURING IN ASIA !! ( CHINA & THAILAND )

but not movements with swan neck... and not movements with panerai personalized bridges... etc etc etc

ETA sell only plain movements. The decoration comes from swiss factorys like SOPROD etc etc etc

 

[bigbadbrad]

super-E

@ Tourby

I'm not at home @ the mo, will be back in a week. Until then have a look here:
http://forum.replica-watch.info/forum/vie ... 86&start=0

This is the EXACT new Swiss ETA 6497-1 E-series movement I received in Fiddy from Davidsen, as described (I nicknamed it super-E mov't ).

cool @babola

That's the one I'm looking for in my new Fidd - the ONLY reason I'm ante-ing up a 2nd time.. my Fiddy habit's already set me back 5 figs :? :shock:

 

[daytona4me]

^^^^ What enzo said ^^^^

:wink:

 

[avitt]

Enzo, that is an excellent summary, which I believe to be pretty much on point.

It is also an excellent argument against the belief that there exist "Swiss" movements with Panerai shaped bridges...

When you think about it, a Swiss movement, reworked with Asian parts, represents the most expensive option possible (even more than a 100% Swiss movement, because of the additional parts and labor).

Because of the price point of their product, the replica industry is significantly more sensitive to costs than genuine watch manufacturers. (Assuming that they even had access to a vast supply of ETA movements or Ebauches) Why would any manufacturer choose the option with the highest cost, when it is within their means to produce an extremely low cost alternative?

These conversations, while they may seem like they are

are still productive....