Its a new 2836 from O Frei that Adrian put the H4 pinions on but the trick is this movement that O Frei sold me was used...Yes used sold as new, It looked new but when Adrian saw and felt it he could tell it was used he tore it down and gave me a detailed report of all the evidence within, I'm going to make a Otto Frei sells used junk thread one of these days! Another time I bought two T19s from O Frei and they sent them in little paper envelops with no plastic over the plexi so they came with micro scratches... Adrian has told me that Cousins UK has sold used movements as new. So from now on I only buy from StarTime. [MENTION=57136]Turbo350z[/MENTION]