- 27/10/14
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Quite some time ago I posted a thread on the mechanics of the rep watch industry and as a result of that thread, more questions naturally came up from you guys, that I will now answer here, and also a few more additions.
Different “V”s:
This is quite simple, if you see a watch that is V2, V3, etc., etc., it simply means that the SAME Maker has updated his previous watch. We never put V2 etc., etc., for a watch that has been produced by a different Maker.
Child Workers:
Please do not worry, child labor is NOT used when producing watches. This is a highly specialized industry, requiring skill throughout the entire process, something a child could not do. Regardless of the fact that this practice is highly unethical, it is also outdated within China, just like most of the world. GZ is actually a very modern city, modeled around HK (being only 2 hours away via train).
Now these questions are out of the way… on to the meaty stuff..:
Simple Watches, WHY AREN’T THEY REPPED?
Many of you wonder why simple watches aren’t made. There are a lot of fantastic simple watches out there (Glashutte Senator Sixties springs to mind) that can be quite easily repped, considering the current standard and technologies used within the industry. The answer to this is simple, however quite sad.
The easier a watch is to replicate, the more likely another Maker will come along and purchase the original Maker’s 1:1 version of it and then rep it themselves. So the original Maker has spent all that money buying the gen (which has gotten heavily damaged, or quite likely destroyed during the replication process, so he can’t even sell it on to recoup his investment), has spent all the time finding the best parts factories to produce the various parts, all the time in repping the watch to make it as perfect as can be, and then some other Maker can just come along, buy the original Maker’s 1:1 rep and make it for themselves for a lot cheaper.
This has pushed the rep scene into a place of showmanship in a way. The more complex the watch, the harder it is to replicate (and therefore the harder it would be for another Maker to replicate) the more desireable it is for a Maker to produce it. Not only showmanship of course, but maximum profitability too. If a Maker has to spend $10,000-$15,000 just to get a simple (easily repped to 1:1 standard) watch, and then another Maker can buy the 1:1 rep for $200 (and due to the simplicity, get it repped within 2-3 months) it means the original Maker has 2-3 months to recoup his $10,000-$15,000, factor in all the costs to make the watch, factor in all his other costs (rent, bills, employees, etc., etc.) and make a decent profit. That is not enough time, the risk is huge, and therefore the Makers are not really keen on it.
It is sad, but there is the honest truth for you guys.
China and English:
I was reading a thread recently, where someone asked who were the best TDs in terms of their English skills. I posted on the tread, but it gave me an idea to write a bit about China and the English language.
China really is largely locked off from the English language, with written English being quite shoddy, to the point of being barely decipherable at times, and spoken English skills being next to non-existent, unless you were privately educated within a very good school.
I learned English out of a desire, but mostly a need. You guys taught me English. My English skills, written and spoken, developed right here on the forums. It has taken me 7+ years of being on the forums everyday to get as good as I am at English, and I am not even that great, and regularly have to ask Francis (who is English) about definitions, terms and sayings. The English language is complex, for anyone who is a non-native speaker. Throw into the mix that Mainland China itself does not regularly practice it, and you have a situation where communicating with us can sometimes be hard.
Bearing the above in mind, I want to point something out, on behalf of all the TDs who are Chinese and/or who have Chinese employees, to you guys:
As I went into it before in my previous thread, this business is also a passion for me, but also a business, and must maintain profitability, just like any other business out there. My passion for this industry is not necessarily shared by my employees. To them, in fact, to most employees around the world, this is just a job, to degree.
They work their 8 hours, and then they clock out, job done for the day. My employees are fantastic, I love them all, we regularly go out for some food and karaoke, I give them incentives, I try to treat them as best as I possibly can, but I cannot afford, no TD can afford, to hire people within Mainland China with stellar English skills. To find someone with amazing English skills, I’d have to pay 2-3x more in wages, and there goes the profitability (and then some) of the whole operation.
I actually have 2 employees right now who are English born and bred, who know a lot, a lot about the industry, and I pay them Western world wages. I do this to maintain a balance, and to provide the best service I can to you guys. I am just pointing all of this out as a gentle reminder, not to be too harsh or get too frustrated with any China based TD and/or their employees. We work very hard, always strive to do our best, and if our English or communications should fall short from time to time, please take a deep breath and help us, guide us in communicating to you better.
Exclusivity on Watches: Why & How:
As mentioned within V1 and V1.1, different TDs have different relationships with different Makers. Some TDs have no relationship with any Makers, but some of us are fortunate enough to have them.
As a result of this some TDs are directly involved within the replication process of a watch. Starting with assessing the estimated popularity (and therefore profitability) of a watch.
Here would be a good example of a TD being as involved as he can be:
This is of course is a fair reward for all the work us TDs put into this. I wanted to put this out there so there is an explanation as to why some TDs can get watches, and others can’t.
Cheers, and i hope this is a good read for you guys, and let me know if there are any more questions you guys have!
Angus
Different “V”s:
This is quite simple, if you see a watch that is V2, V3, etc., etc., it simply means that the SAME Maker has updated his previous watch. We never put V2 etc., etc., for a watch that has been produced by a different Maker.
Child Workers:
Please do not worry, child labor is NOT used when producing watches. This is a highly specialized industry, requiring skill throughout the entire process, something a child could not do. Regardless of the fact that this practice is highly unethical, it is also outdated within China, just like most of the world. GZ is actually a very modern city, modeled around HK (being only 2 hours away via train).
Now these questions are out of the way… on to the meaty stuff..:
Simple Watches, WHY AREN’T THEY REPPED?
Many of you wonder why simple watches aren’t made. There are a lot of fantastic simple watches out there (Glashutte Senator Sixties springs to mind) that can be quite easily repped, considering the current standard and technologies used within the industry. The answer to this is simple, however quite sad.
The easier a watch is to replicate, the more likely another Maker will come along and purchase the original Maker’s 1:1 version of it and then rep it themselves. So the original Maker has spent all that money buying the gen (which has gotten heavily damaged, or quite likely destroyed during the replication process, so he can’t even sell it on to recoup his investment), has spent all the time finding the best parts factories to produce the various parts, all the time in repping the watch to make it as perfect as can be, and then some other Maker can just come along, buy the original Maker’s 1:1 rep and make it for themselves for a lot cheaper.
This has pushed the rep scene into a place of showmanship in a way. The more complex the watch, the harder it is to replicate (and therefore the harder it would be for another Maker to replicate) the more desireable it is for a Maker to produce it. Not only showmanship of course, but maximum profitability too. If a Maker has to spend $10,000-$15,000 just to get a simple (easily repped to 1:1 standard) watch, and then another Maker can buy the 1:1 rep for $200 (and due to the simplicity, get it repped within 2-3 months) it means the original Maker has 2-3 months to recoup his $10,000-$15,000, factor in all the costs to make the watch, factor in all his other costs (rent, bills, employees, etc., etc.) and make a decent profit. That is not enough time, the risk is huge, and therefore the Makers are not really keen on it.
It is sad, but there is the honest truth for you guys.
China and English:
I was reading a thread recently, where someone asked who were the best TDs in terms of their English skills. I posted on the tread, but it gave me an idea to write a bit about China and the English language.
China really is largely locked off from the English language, with written English being quite shoddy, to the point of being barely decipherable at times, and spoken English skills being next to non-existent, unless you were privately educated within a very good school.
I learned English out of a desire, but mostly a need. You guys taught me English. My English skills, written and spoken, developed right here on the forums. It has taken me 7+ years of being on the forums everyday to get as good as I am at English, and I am not even that great, and regularly have to ask Francis (who is English) about definitions, terms and sayings. The English language is complex, for anyone who is a non-native speaker. Throw into the mix that Mainland China itself does not regularly practice it, and you have a situation where communicating with us can sometimes be hard.
Bearing the above in mind, I want to point something out, on behalf of all the TDs who are Chinese and/or who have Chinese employees, to you guys:
As I went into it before in my previous thread, this business is also a passion for me, but also a business, and must maintain profitability, just like any other business out there. My passion for this industry is not necessarily shared by my employees. To them, in fact, to most employees around the world, this is just a job, to degree.
They work their 8 hours, and then they clock out, job done for the day. My employees are fantastic, I love them all, we regularly go out for some food and karaoke, I give them incentives, I try to treat them as best as I possibly can, but I cannot afford, no TD can afford, to hire people within Mainland China with stellar English skills. To find someone with amazing English skills, I’d have to pay 2-3x more in wages, and there goes the profitability (and then some) of the whole operation.
I actually have 2 employees right now who are English born and bred, who know a lot, a lot about the industry, and I pay them Western world wages. I do this to maintain a balance, and to provide the best service I can to you guys. I am just pointing all of this out as a gentle reminder, not to be too harsh or get too frustrated with any China based TD and/or their employees. We work very hard, always strive to do our best, and if our English or communications should fall short from time to time, please take a deep breath and help us, guide us in communicating to you better.
Exclusivity on Watches: Why & How:
As mentioned within V1 and V1.1, different TDs have different relationships with different Makers. Some TDs have no relationship with any Makers, but some of us are fortunate enough to have them.
As a result of this some TDs are directly involved within the replication process of a watch. Starting with assessing the estimated popularity (and therefore profitability) of a watch.
Here would be a good example of a TD being as involved as he can be:
- Looks through forum/s, checks posts about gens that haven’t been repped. If he sees a watch with a lot of interest, puts up a thread/poll to get a better idea as to the potential popularity.
- If he finds a watch that looks to be good, he approaches a Maker with the idea, and proves potential popularity.
- Depending on the Maker and the relationship the TD and Maker has; the TD will either buy the gen version himself, or at least source it for the Maker at the best price.
- Depending on the knowledge of the TD, he will also inspect every single part produced for the watch, point out any flaws and occasionally go to the forums for advice and geek feedback (you guys really know a lot about watches, haha).
- Final piece is produced, and as a thank you from the Maker, the TD will get a certain amount of exclusivity. The exclusivity depends on a few things, such as your relationship with the Maker, the amount of money you spent on the project (if you buy the watch for the Maker, you get a longer time-frame of exclusivity, or sometimes complete exclusivity) and the of time you invested in making sure the rep was as good as it can be.
This is of course is a fair reward for all the work us TDs put into this. I wanted to put this out there so there is an explanation as to why some TDs can get watches, and others can’t.
Cheers, and i hope this is a good read for you guys, and let me know if there are any more questions you guys have!
Angus
