ZF Calatrava is out

[SKnight]

Hey watch fam

so I've pulled the trigger on a ZF 5227r, but the two things that bothering a little are

​​​​​​1. The PP font seems a little bold
2. The dates seem a little left adjusted, from the QC's I've received which show dates 3, 15 and 28 the last one, 28, seems to be the one that's bothering me most.

If I could get some reference images from those with the 5227 showing the above dates I would really appreciate it.

Thanks in advance and stay safe in these crazy times

 

[Doud]

Intime posted a new sector dial 5296G in its new arrivals. Have they improved the dial? The previous ZF version was slightly too white instead of greyish/silver.

https://www.intime05.co/patek-phili...-blue-hands-on-black-leather-strap-324cs.html

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[effewatch]

Intime posted a new sector dial 5296G in its new arrivals. Have they improved the dial? The previous ZF version was slightly too white instead of greyish/silver.

https://www.intime05.co/patek-phili...-blue-hands-on-black-leather-strap-324cs.html

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

i was thinking the same...it seems improved

 

[effewatch]

Zf's work on the caseback is quite good.

 

[SKnight]

effewatch ZFs work is looking good. But if they could get the 3K movement for there calatravas that would be a game changer I feel.

One can dream.

 

[Sonofalich]

effewatch ZFs work is looking good. But if they could get the 3K movement for there calatravas that would be a game changer I feel.

One can dream.

Why? I don't get peoples obsession with the movements... who's looking at the back of your watch? haha

I mean if someone is looking that closely, they're going to see the other tells anyway. I've never understood this about the rep community tbh.

 

[flextime]

Why? I don't get peoples obsession with the movements... who's looking at the back of your watch? haha

I mean if someone is looking that closely, they're going to see the other tells anyway. I've never understood this about the rep community tbh.

To me, it’s less what others think when they look closely (it doesn’t happen often). I would look at the case back and despite it being a rep, there is some sense of satisfaction knowing it’s actuate.

I have the ZF 5296 and a 3K aquanaut. The date wheel winding direction in the cloned movement makes it a more interesting.


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[effewatch]

To me, it’s less what others think when they look closely (it doesn’t happen often). I would look at the case back and despite it being a rep, there is some sense of satisfaction knowing it’s actuate.

+1

 

[SKnight]

Sonofalich I think the 3K movement is a huge achievement much likes Noobs 4130, they have done the so called 'impossible', and for those reasons I'd like to own the movement not because I'm looking to pass it if as gen or that somebody might ask to see it, but because of my appreciation for what it represents.

These movements along with Super reps and Nwbigs dispell some of the myth that a watch if not 'Swiss' or 'expensive' is not worthy which is clearly not true.

I'm new to the hobby, and I was actually looking into purchasing a gen when I stumbled upon reps and this forum. And I'm really glad I did, because the quality of reps has come so far. More so, with these movements the quality is not superficial/ surface level anymore either!!

At the risk of sounding dramatic with these movements they have crossed the final frontier, which was once seen as the purview of a few Swiss houses.

 

[Rainbowkin]

Intime posted a new sector dial 5296G in its new arrivals. Have they improved the dial? The previous ZF version was slightly too white instead of greyish/silver.

https://www.intime05.co/patek-phili...-blue-hands-on-black-leather-strap-324cs.html

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

majwilliams0308 has posted a picture of his gen 5296 sector dial somewhere. The gen dial has this almost bead-blasted-like textured finish.

 

[srhoque]

Sonofalich I think the 3K movement is a huge achievement much likes Noobs 4130, they have done the so called 'impossible', and for those reasons I'd like to own the movement not because I'm looking to pass it if as gen or that somebody might ask to see it, but because of my appreciation for what it represents.

These movements along with Super reps and Nwbigs dispell some of the myth that a watch if not 'Swiss' or 'expensive' is not worthy which is clearly not true.

I'm new to the hobby, and I was actually looking into purchasing a gen when I stumbled upon reps and this forum. And I'm really glad I did, because the quality of reps has come so far. More so, with these movements the quality is not superficial/ surface level anymore either!!

At the risk of sounding dramatic with these movements they have crossed the final frontier, which was once seen as the purview of a few Swiss houses.

Well said!! I share the same sentiment as well. While the long term reliability of the 324 Clone is still in question, I think the fact that they have cloned it is an achievement for the rep community. The last time, I felt this excited was when the 4130 clone got released (and to a lesser extent when the 3185/6 clone got released because it was just more parts on the 3135 clone). It definitely gives me (and for sure others) an elevated sense of pride and pleasure wearing a rep watch with these movements even though they are behind a case.

On a different note - I also think that the ability to release a 1:1 clone (albeit lower quality parts, poorer finish and cutting other corners) for a fraction of the cost puts the swiss industry on notice. They have for long charged obnoxious premiums for their watches. Looking forward to the 1972 Genta moment again when they do something ground breaking, else the gen swiss mechanical watch industry is bound for extinction maybe in another 15 years. The subset of the population wearing them will be so small that it will become insignificant. The Chinese Rep Industry, Apple and smartwatches are eating their lunch and maybe their dinner as well. I think in 2035 and beyond, such watches will be seen in pics on online forums and only with vintage collectors As a mechnical watch aficionado, I hope this never happens but I can see the wave coming...

 

[jm_brc_7057]

srhoque i don’t share your concern. On the contrary. The number of wealthy people in the world are increasing. Where was the Arabic and Chinese market deceases ago? It feels like ages ago that for example Patek Philippe was only for western world gentlemen.

Secondly more people go back to the roots so to say and appreciate artistry and craftmanship the more Technology takes over. Ask taylors or handcrafted shoemakers. They are on the rise. People don’t want cheap mass production. As wealth increases more people want to distinguish themselves.

Thirdly regarding Apple Watch. Apple are good at making a need where there was no need. That’s how it went with the tablet. Who ever needed a tablet or a smartphone. Now we can’t live without it. Same goes with the smart watch. And the funny thing is. Earlier most people had naked wrists. Now everyone’s wearing an Apple Watch. Many of them will get used to a watch. And many of them again will realise they want something special. Something they don’t need to change every October. Something stylish, elegant that can distinguish them (am I hearing myself say Swiss/Glasgütte region watch?).

 

[srhoque]

srhoque i don’t share your concern. On the contrary. The number of wealthy people in the world are increasing. Where was the Arabic and Chinese market deceases ago? It feels like ages ago that for example Patek Philippe was only for western world gentlemen.

Secondly more people go back to the roots so to say and appreciate artistry and craftmanship the more Technology takes over. Ask taylors or handcrafted shoemakers. They are on the rise. People don’t want cheap mass production. As wealth increases more people want to distinguish themselves.

Thirdly regarding Apple Watch. Apple are good at making a need where there was no need. That’s how it went with the tablet. Who ever needed a tablet or a smartphone. Now we can’t live without it. Same goes with the smart watch. And the funny thing is. Earlier most people had naked wrists. Now everyone’s wearing an Apple Watch. Many of them will get used to a watch. And many of them again will realise they want something special. Something they don’t need to change every October. Something stylish, elegant that can distinguish them (am I hearing myself say Swiss/Glasgütte region watch?).

To each his own

Don’t agree with anything you said because I don’t recall the last time this current generation fancied a mechanical watch or even looked at wrist presence (Phones and smart devices have made the watch redundant probably reduced it a piece of jewelry) Anyways, I sure do hope you are right because I absolutely love the ingenuity of mechanical watches.

 

[jm_brc_7057]

To each his own

Don’t agree with anything you said because I don’t recall the last time this current generation fancied a mechanical watch or even looked at wrist presence (Phones and smart devices have made the watch redundant probably reduced it a piece of jewelry) Anyways, I sure do hope you are right because I absolutely love the ingenuity of mechanical watches.

You are right about one thing. We wouldn’t be able to guess it correctly. But let’s hope there is a future of mechanical watches. It’s more difficult than ever to get watches from Haute Horlorgerie brands now than just 5 years ago. So I think there is a future.

 

[SKnight]

jm_brc_7057 @srhoque

I see the merit in both your arguments.

​​​​​​ I own a luxury fashion brand and therefore my company is constantly having to deal with replicas/ knock offs. It is a headache, and therefore we are constantly having to innovate. For example it pushed us to create a more accessible line. However, I do feel that the gen and rep market can co exist and potentially benefit each other.

They say mimickary is the highest form of flattery, so when our products do get knocked off it tells us we're doing something right. It validates both our brand and product that it has value.

Secondly the rep market and gen market are largely distinct/independent from one another however we see a degree of overlap now. For example, I myself buy both gen luxury products and reps. I might buy a gen realise I like it enough to buy a few rep copies granted the reps are good enough which they are now. This also works in reverse, for example one might buy a replica watch but may save up to buy a gen in the future.
Thirdly, the rep market cannot exist without the gen market. It is the gen luxury market and those who buy it's products that are the taste makers. Furthermore without their innovation/ ingenuity the rep factories have nothing to copy.

​​​​​​A rep watch has 'value' only because of the gen. Even when buying a rep you are aspiring to or buying into the lifestyle associated with the gens brand and the design. However when the reps get this good the value proposition has to change and the Swiss will have to do something about it.

Finally, addressing srhoque , I do think there is hope for this generation because I just turned 30 and I would prefer a proper watch any day over an apple watch. Mind you after achieving some mile stones I was in the market for a gen till I stumbled onto here.


Side note. Mind you Apple and the Apple watch has been branded as a luxury product, Apple hired the head of Burberry's marketing and communications to position and launch the Apple watch.

 

[Rainbowkin]

jm_brc_7057 @srhoque

I see the merit in both your arguments.

​​​​​​ I own a luxury fashion brand and therefore my company is constantly having to deal with replicas/ knock offs. It is a headache, and therefore we are constantly having to innovate. For example it pushed us to create a more accessible line. However, I do feel that the gen and rep market can co exist and potentially benefit each other.

They say mimickary is the highest form of flattery, so when our products do get knocked off it tells us we're doing something right. It validates both our brand and product that it has value.

Secondly the rep market and gen market are largely distinct/independent from one another however we see a degree of overlap now. For example, I myself buy both gen luxury products and reps. I might buy a gen realise I like it enough to buy a few rep copies granted the reps are good enough which they are now. This also works in reverse, for example one might buy a replica watch but may save up to buy a gen in the future.
Thirdly, the rep market cannot exist without the gen market. It is the gen luxury market and those who buy it's products that are the taste makers. Furthermore without their innovation/ ingenuity the rep factories have nothing to copy.

​​​​​​A rep watch has 'value' only because of the gen. Even when buying a rep you are aspiring to or buying into the lifestyle associated with the gens brand and the design. However when the reps get this good the value proposition has to change and the Swiss will have to do something about it.

Finally, addressing srhoque , I do think there is hope for this generation because I just turned 30 and I would prefer a proper watch any day over an apple watch. Mind you after achieving some mile stones I was in the market for a gen till I stumbled onto here.


Side note. Mind you Apple and the Apple watch has been branded as a luxury product, Apple hired the head of Burberry's marketing and communications to position and launch the Apple watch.

Well said. Franken is another aspect we can consider here. thanks

 

[SKnight]

Rainbowkin I'd love to explore that option if someone can help me with it.

 

[LebronXiJames]

While I agree with points in both sides, I absolutely see a future for mechanical watches. I’m personally in the younger generation category and have always had a huge interest in mechanical watches. I think it’s obvious my generation is infatuated with technology and social media, where it make sense to have an Apple Watch. I do like some of the workout and health related features but to really take advantage of those you need to wear it frequently, which I don’t want that to be my daily wear.

While the appreciation for fine craftsmanship and innovation in mechanical watches may not be where it was for my fathers generation and years past I assure there is still an interest in my generation in watches. From PP, Rolex, AP, these brands all are very popular with people my age.

For me personally, I’m only a few years out of college but make a solid salary and hopefully that will grow as I get older. So for now a very high end rep is what I look for, with a desire to own a gen one day. I do think there is absolutely a decline in interest in these types of fine time pieces but the desire and appreciation for these watches is still there with the younger millennial generation.

 

[Daytonamania]

Personally i believe deep down everyone is a watch person; it just depends when and whether they 'activate' that side of them. For the past 27 years of my life i've never bothered looking at another person's watch. Sure i knew what Rolex was but i never bothered because they spoke of a lifestyle very different from mine and my parents.

Most of my adult life i've been in the military so all i've ever known were G-shocks and watches for tracking fitness like Garmin and Suunto. I have buddies who own Rolexes and Panerais but i've always just been meh, waste of money and big show off.

But just earlier this year i randomly stumbled upon an Omega Speedmaster article online. Since then my life has exploded and i now spend 1-2 hours a day reading articles or watching videos on Youtube about watches. When i'm out (which hasn't been much due to Covid-19), i'm constantly sizing up others by the watches they wear and I can actually name more than one luxury watch brand now (Rolex was the only one i knew). And it's been a treat, exploring all these watches, their movements and the time and effort it takes to build them.

Sure i still love my Garmin and how it knows when my body is 'stressed' or not. It's the watch i wear most considering i'm at work most of the time. But when i leave work, it slips off and is replaced by an AP ROO Diver or my 5296 when i'm feeling like wearing something that would fly under the radar when surrounded by friends who know next to nothing about watches (they all wear Garmins too). Doesn't bother me one bit that it's a $400 rep cos it makes me feel soooo good.

Yes the rep world lets me be part of this community and a lifestyle i never dreamed of. And yes i can now comfortably afford a low-mid ranged luxury watch with the money i've saved over the years of working. But i'd never spend that much on a gen when there are NWBIG pieces around. However i must say my appreciation for Speedmasters, the watch that popped my cherry, is above and beyond any other watch so that i will definitely buy in gen, hopefully sooner rather than later as i'm looking for something very specific and haven't found it yet.

So yeah, there is definitely a future for mechanical watches and yes, the younger generation is definitely still intrigued by more than Apple, Garmin and Casio; be it as a symbol of wealth and social economic status or simply because they are as fascinated by the complications as i am. Cheers, boys.

 

[SKnight]

Daytonamania Couldn't agree more.

Also some of the most iconic time pieces have been either made for the military or are military inspired. I've listed a few below I think you should check out if you haven't already.

1. Cartier Tank
2. Seamaster 300m professional - also definitely worth considering in gen, incredible value for $ and it's cheaper then the speedy.
3. Seamaster 300m 007

Cheers.