Why can't rep manufacturer's make gen?

[fakemaster]

He wants to know why the rep makers don't make a watch that is 1:1 in every way.

But you have a good point. And it's one that I have established more than once. If it don't say Rolex then you don't want it.

 

[trailboss99]

To answer the OP's question: They could make a perfect rep. If it suited them. They don't beacuse of the following reasons.

1/ As stated earlier if it's perfect you won't buy another one. Ever noticed how the perfect reps (and there is a handfull) are less popular reps? The Timewalker, the Acedemia, the Discovery. All are nearly perfect. Why? Because these models are not popular enough to bring out repeted "improved" models, the volume isn't there so one near perfect one makes sence. As well as the folk who realy want one you will get buyers drawn by it's accuracy and add to your sales.

2/ Most of the time they just can't be bothered. We buy 'em anyway and remember we picky buggers are a very small element of the rep market. Most of it consists of people who buy one , amye two or three reps in their whole lifetime and would now recognise a wonky rehaut or care if they did. Perfect accuracy is just not that important.

3/ MVTs. I think this is a different story. MVT manufactures are larger concerns. It takes time, experiance and money to copy or design a MVT. All our MVTs come from established legitimate companys who make millions of MVTs yearly. They have got away with cloneing the ETA but I don't think Rolex would be as forgiving and the MVT manufactures present a rather large and visible target compared with the "cottage" nature of the rep industry. I suspect Rolex would cream them but yes, they most certanily could make a perfect Rolex MVT for little more than the cost of a ETA clone, proberly around 70-100 USD retail compared to 40 for the clone ETA. Personaly I would be happy if they just improved the build quality of the exelent designs they have now. Oh, and burn to the ground the workshop (factory would be to grand a title I'm shure) of who ever makes the sec@6 module for the 7750 and start again with a decent design. Hangzhow make the MVT used in most of our chrono reps but no one seems to know where the sec@6 module comes from. It ain't HZ, I know that much.


Col.

 

[jmd33]

I think they can and will - what I mean is there will probably always be errors. Not because they can't make a good one, but becuase they don't want to. Volume right. Most buyers that picky will just by gen. With gen a large part of the price is marketing. Huge research goes into price point for any gen item. If Rolex could double its price it would, for sure.

I think the rep market is about volume, and you can't do volume, low price point, and high QC at the same time. Just look at guns - Beretta vrs. Taurus. Why is the Beretta 92 more money than the Taurus. Fast answer, different markets. Most here that shoot probably know in the 90's Taurus bought Beretta's old equipment, so if you buy a Taurus, you are just buyin old Beretta specs made at a higher volume with lower QC. Same with 1911's. What is difference between an Auto Ordnance, Kimber, and Dan Wesson? Why can't Auto Ordnance make a pistol as good as a Dan Wesson. Short answer, they can but choose not to. Kimber has low volume and almost perfect specs and QC (for a mass produced firearm). Dan Wesson is lower volume with higher quality. Auto Ordnance is high volume at low price point. Totally different markets, requirements, cost of production, etc... . Could you make a Kimber in China instead of New York? Of course. Could it be as good (with the exact same time and care into building it)? Of course. Would any body do it? That day is coming.

Just look at the difference between the highest quality reps now vrs. 10 - 15 years ago.

[kinda just dumped that shit, so forgive any typos]

 

[Minion]

thanks for all the great comments - all that being said, and I've had reps over the past 15 years, they have increased exponentially in quality and dare I say, so has the gens....could the rep improvements be driving the gen improvements? Remember all those $4000 crimped metal end link gen Rolexes that rattled and stretched....

my first "ultimate" rep will be the BK-WM9 v2 with clark's crystal and BK's crown mod....deposit sent and received, now I'm waiting anxiously for this beauty to arrive.

from what I see, this group acts as a "free" quality control for factories like noobmaster, wm9, ect.....I'm still a newbie, did I get that right?

2nd rep will be a WM9-v2 or higher quality level GMTIIc with a Chinese made 3136 movt and a true triplock stem/crown.....any bet takers on how soon something like this will be out?

 

[robmpulse]

There is a VERY good reason why reps are not made 1:1.

If they did, they would have nothing to improve upon in the years between new model releases. If they made 1:1 reps, then you would buy one and keep it until you wanted a different model all together.

By making the "improvements" along the way.... now people will buy each version along the way.......

 

[RolexAddict]

jmd33,
Taurus is made in Brazil, cheaper cost of production.
Also consider the kind of material used.
The 1911 for exemple : Auto Ordnance uses metal cast frames and slides, all small parts are out of specs...
Kimber and other like Wilson use forged steel parts.
The cheapest 1911 style is actually Charles Daly, frames and slides made in Philippines

I have a 1911A1 .45 classic GI parkerized made by Norinco. Norinco is a China company.
Lot of people don't like Norinco, I assume this is the best gun I owned since 15 years. Building tolerances are very good, the steel is a very high quality carbon steel. Lot of pistolsmithes like Clark Custom recommand Norinco to use strong calibers like the .45 or 460 Rowland.

China can produce and copy LOT of stuff, lot of companies will put factories in China in the next 10 years.

robmpulse,
Since 10 - 15 years Asians produce reps and the target was to sell them to dealers in Italy, West Indies (Dominican Republic) USA/Mexico. All this crap was sold - and is still sold - to the tourists in Vintimille (Italy/France border) in Santo Domigo, Mexico city, Cancun and New York (Canal Street) and also in Morocco, Egypt, Hong Kong, Bangkok and Manilla.
5 years ago, with internet this market has a new segment: websites. Just middlemen who invested in a web catalog and were in relation and positioned between a watch factory and people like us at home in front of a screen and a keyboard...

Today this business for these "dealers" has changed. Now there are forums. Me, may be you and lot of members here, have bought reps from Canal Street or from beach vendors during vacations...

Now with the forums we represent a new community witch has learn and know lot of details about watches. So the classic dealer who wants to extend his services with this new market has to put more efforts, more research and development and quality from factories to attract this new target.
But this represent a very small part from the global rep watches market. That's why you don't notice real improvements, or just a few, always on the same kind of watches : Rolex Submariner/SD.
Lot of big dealers continue to have a big stock of crap to sell to common buyers and they sell A LOT EVERYDAY. I am not anxious for them :lol:

Last year I ordered a watch, my order number was around 7500. 3 weeks later, I ordered a new one, my order
number was almost 9000...
This means some dealers sell a average of 1500 watch a month... not with forums people

 

[ABC123]

Just want to revive this crazy thread.

Most of the money for a gen goes into the movement, there is no way Chinese laborers, as skilled as they are , can efficiently reproduce a custom movement. And the whole point of rep is fake on outside, even more fake on inside.

 

[ckswartwood]

not trying to fan a flame here....but i think there are people on this forum that could order a watch from a dealer, get sent a gen watch; and still scrutinize it for not being 1:1.

...just saying.

I live with the idiosyncrasies because a rep at 1/25th of the cost affords me the opportunity to buy a lot more watches and wear them with as much pride and excitement as if they were gen! Lets not forget why we got into this hobby in the first place.

I think this thread should be turned around to a, "Tell us about the time you ordered and waited for your first rep to be delivered"
That should conjure some good memories it does for me.

 

[fakemaster]

LOL. Dude you have apparently missed some things. There are people on this forum who regularly go into ADs and accuse them of having reps in their cases. There are people who spend the entire day searching ebay just to report every watch that they think is fake...even if no rep of it exists. There are people who think that every watch they see on every person is a rep. and even if those people were to show the paperwork to them they'd think that was repped too.

 

[ABC123]

LOL. Dude you have apparently missed some things. There are people on this forum who regularly go into ADs and accuse them of having reps in their cases. There are people who spend the entire day searching ebay just to report every watch that they think is fake...even if no rep of it exists. There are people who think that every watch they see on every person is a rep. and even if those people were to show the paperwork to them they'd think that was repped too.

It's probably time that these people go to THE Rolex factory and buy a gen.