Re Gluing Bezel Insert

[Kerbus]

Ugh! It’s 3 AM here! After about 16 years the bezel insert on my BK Sub fell off. Thank God it happened at home! I got it and the bezel all cleaned up and I’m really hoping it’s a simple Hypo Cement job I can do without removing the bezel because I’ve never removed a bezel on a better watch before. I’m fairly confident I can execute my plan because I did it on a GMT before but that was years ago.

For those much better than me at tinkering: Is it advisable to attempt a re glue with the bezel on in this situation? Any tips? I’ve viewed videos and some marvelous threads here that I plan to review again

I am not considering tape or adhesive rings now because I read they can interfere with the height while cement does not. Is this really true?

One really fortunate thing is I have a junk watch to practice on. It has the back and crystal removed by a much younger me long ago and that bezel lifted out with my finger and seems only pressure fitted. Another fortunate thing is new inserts are easily available but I’m not going gen today. Have you seen what they go for now?? Astronomical!!

I can provide photos when I’m near my bench in the morning again if handier to visualize everything

For others caught in the same situation, I hope my journey I’m about to embark on with this will help you. If you own several divers,you gotta expect this kind of thing, and become accustomed to attempting a fix.

Thanks! Good night for now…

 

[KJ2020]

Ugh! It’s 3 AM here! After about 16 years the bezel insert on my BK Sub fell off. Thank God it happened at home! I got it and the bezel all cleaned up and I’m really hoping it’s a simple Hypo Cement job I can do without removing the bezel because I’ve never removed a bezel on a better watch before. I’m fairly confident I can execute my plan because I did it on a GMT before but that was years ago.

For those much better than me at tinkering: Is it advisable to attempt a re glue with the bezel on in this situation? Any tips? I’ve viewed videos and some marvelous threads here that I plan to review again

I am not considering tape or adhesive rings now because I read they can interfere with the height while cement does not. Is this really true?

One really fortunate thing is I have a junk watch to practice on. It has the back and crystal removed by a much younger me long ago and that bezel lifted out with my finger and seems only pressure fitted. Another fortunate thing is new inserts are easily available but I’m not going gen today. Have you seen what they go for now?? Astronomical!!

I can provide photos when I’m near my bench in the morning again if handier to visualize everything

For others caught in the same situation, I hope my journey I’m about to embark on with this will help you. If you own several divers,you gotta expect this kind of thing, and become accustomed to attempting a fix.

Thanks! Good night for now…

You absolutely can re-adhere a ceramic insert to a bezel that is still on a case. I would suggest testing the fit for height with a small arc of a tape ring before deciding on which method to use.

I say this because BK primarily used Noobs and they were not press fit inserts, so most likely yours has had a tape ring before. If height was OK then it will be OK now. If you want to test this, you'll need at least two tape rings or you can reuse the test arc of tape.

I swap inserts around a lot and there are many differences in insert thicknesses and in the depth of bezel wells. So I am used to insert sitting heights not always being perfect without some tweaking. The test involves cutting a small arc (about 5 dial tics across) out of the replacement tape ring and installing it on the bezel. Place a wide piece of tape or other obstructive object across the bezel well on the opposite side to make it easy to lift the insert away when done.

Then just fit the insert to the bezel well over the short tape arc and evaluate the sitting height. Tape rings are very thin, it's rare that one ring will push an insert up too high. This is more of an issue with thicker than normal inserts like many earlier model XING GMT inserts. If the insert sits too low, I stack a second or even a third test arc. Above that I'll use a different approach like an epoxy glue bed or a spacer. You will likely find that a single tape ring is perfect for your reinstall.

If you are good with the sitting height, remove the insert. Then fit the remaining 11/12ths of the test ring to the bezel, or use a new one and get ready to press it for good. Note that when working with tape rings it's useful to have two pairs of tweezers, some toothpicks and a little rectangular razor blade on hand. Also use magnification to make backing paper removal easier. Take it slow, be patient and avoid touching any exposed adhesive. Use the tweezers to place it and a toothpick to hold it stuck to the bezel while pulling the tweezers away.

Once the entire ring is in place, I put the obstructive piece back in place (see pic above) and set about aligning the insert perfectly. You may not be overly particular about this step, I absolutely despise it when an insert is half a click off center. I lay the top arc of the insert onto the tape ring and carefully evaluate its rotational position. If it isn't perfect, it's easy to lift the insert away and try again. This is where using a tape ring beats GSHypo cement hands down. Aside from leaving messy stringers, GSHypo cures quite rapidly so you don't have time to make multiple corrections if they are needed.

See the thread below for some additional info about insert alignment.

How to achieve proper bezel alignment

 

[KJ2020]

BTW if the marker fill on your insert is not looking good (I can't imagine that it would), now would be an awesome time to do an insert paint mod. It's fast, easy and I'll let these pics speak for themselves.

Insert paint mod - latest recommendation

 

[Kerbus]

You absolutely can re-adhere a ceramic insert to a bezel that is still on a case. I would suggest testing the fit for height with a small arc of a tape ring before deciding on which method to use.

I say this because BK primarily used Noobs and they were not press fit inserts, so most likely yours has had a tape ring before. If height was OK then it will be OK now. If you want to test this, you'll need at least two tape rings or you can reuse the test arc of tape.

I swap inserts around a lot and there are many differences in insert thicknesses and in the depth of bezel wells. So I am used to insert sitting heights not always being perfect without some tweaking. The test involves cutting a small arc, about 5 dial tics across, away from the replacement ring and installing it on the bezel. Place a wide piece of tape or other obstructive object across the bezel well on the opposite side to make it easy to lift the insert away when done.

Then just fit the insert to the bezel well over the short tape arc and evaluate the sitting height. Tape rings are very thin, it's rare that one ring will push an insert up too high. This is more of an issue with thicker than normal inserts like many earlier model XING GMT inserts. If the insert sits too low, I stack a second or even a third test arc. Above that I'll use a different approach like an epoxy glue bed or a spacer. You will likely find that a single tape ring is perfect for your reinstall.

If you are good with the sitting height, remove the insert. Then fit the remaining 11/12ths of the test ring to the bezel, or use a new one and get ready to press it for good. Note that when working with tape rings it's useful to have two pairs of tweezers, some toothpicks and a little rectangular razor blade on hand. Also use magnification to make backing paper removal easier. Take it slow, be patient and avoid touching any exposed adhesive. Use the tweezers to place it and a toothpick to hold it stuck to the bezel while pulling the tweezers away.

Once the entire ring is in place, I put the obstructive piece back in place (see pic above) and set about aligning the insert perfectly. You may not be overly particular about this step, I absolutely despise it when an insert is half a click off center. I lay the top arc of the insert onto the tape ring and carefully evaluate its rotational position. If it isn't perfect, it's easy to lift the insert away and try again. This is where using a tape ring beats GSHypo cement hands down. Aside from leaving messy stringers, GSHypo cures quite rapidly so you don't have time to make multiple corrections if they are needed.

See the thread below for some additional info about insert alignment.

How to achieve proper bezel alignment

Oh my! That’s an incredible reply! Your posts have got to be the best I’ve ever read on this subject and I’ll re read them. Thanks so much.

No cement, huh? Gee, I was hoping to be able to run to the store here and just get what I would need. I guess I’ll scout out those adhesive rings. I’m not going to attempt removing the bezel, unless I master it on my scrap watch which is not the exact same design as this BK watch

I’ll update this thread if I go ahead with the rings and in the mean time I’ll re read and re watch everything I can find on this task.

 

[KJ2020]

Oh my! That’s an incredible reply! Your posts have got to be the best I’ve ever read on this subject and I’ll re read them. Thanks so much.

No cement, huh? Gee, I was hoping to be able to run to the store here and just get what I would need. I guess I’ll scout out those adhesive rings. I’m not going to attempt removing the bezel, unless I master it on my scrap watch which is not the exact same design as this BK watch

I’ll update this thread if I go ahead with the rings and in the mean time I’ll re read and re watch everything I can find on this task.

You can use GSHypo if you want, it's done commonly enough. I just don't like having to rush to align the triangle quicker than it cures. If I misalign an insert I can't live with it - it's coming off again. And in this scenario that means the bezel has to come off to get the insert out.

 

[Kerbus]

You absolutely can re-adhere a ceramic insert to a bezel that is still on a case. I would suggest testing the fit for height with a small arc of a tape ring before deciding on which method to use.

I say this because BK primarily used Noobs and they were not press fit inserts, so most likely yours has had a tape ring before. If height was OK then it will be OK now. If you want to test this, you'll need at least two tape rings or you can reuse the test arc of tape.

I swap inserts around a lot and there are many differences in insert thicknesses and in the depth of bezel wells. So I am used to insert sitting heights not always being perfect without some tweaking. The test involves cutting a small arc, about 5 dial tics across, away from the replacement ring and installing it on the bezel. Place a wide piece of tape or other obstructive object across the bezel well on the opposite side to make it easy to lift the insert away when done.

Then just fit the insert to the bezel well over the short tape arc and evaluate the sitting height. Tape rings are very thin, it's rare that one ring will push an insert up too high. This is more of an issue with thicker than normal inserts like many earlier model XING GMT inserts. If the insert sits too low, I stack a second or even a third test arc. Above that I'll use a different approach like an epoxy glue bed or a spacer. You will likely find that a single tape ring is perfect for your reinstall.

If you are good with the sitting height, remove the insert. Then fit the remaining 11/12ths of the test ring to the bezel, or use a new one and get ready to press it for good. Note that when working with tape rings it's useful to have two pairs of tweezers, some toothpicks and a little rectangular razor blade on hand. Also use magnification to make backing paper removal easier. Take it slow, be patient and avoid touching any exposed adhesive. Use the tweezers to place it and a toothpick to hold it stuck to the bezel while pulling the tweezers away.

Once the entire ring is in place, I put the obstructive piece back in place (see pic above) and set about aligning the insert perfectly. You may not be overly particular about this step, I absolutely despise it when an insert is half a click off center. I lay the top arc of the insert onto the tape ring and carefully evaluate its rotational position. If it isn't perfect, it's easy to lift the insert away and try again. This is where using a tape ring beats GSHypo cement hands dow

.

Insert paint mod - latest recommendation

How to achieve proper bezel alignment

How to achieve proper bezel alignment

You can use GSHypo if you want, it's done commonly enough. I just don't like having to rush to align the triangle quicker than it cures. If I misalign an insert I can't live with it - it's coming off again. And in this scenario that means the bezel has to come off to get the insert out.

It sounds like decisions, decisions


I ought to go get some. I do have that scrap watch to practice on even though the construction is different. I just thought running to the store would make things start sooner so I’d opt for the cenent

Otherwise, gotta rely on Amazon or whoever. I’m going to go back and look again for those rings to order. It appeared when they say for Submariner, they ought to be okay for this BK watch

Here’s what i think I should order:

Amazon.com

This is for a blue dial/ bezel BK 16613

 

[KJ2020]

If your scrap watch is as old as your BK or is a cheapie chances are good it has a bezel held on with a wire clip. Learning how and practicing removing those will be of no benefit regarding your BK rep.

6-digit Sub crystal and bezel swap

How to remove a bezel attached by a wire clip

 

[KJ2020]

It sounds like decisions, decisions


I ought to go get some. I do have that scrap watch to practice on even though the construction is different. I just thought running to the store would make things start sooner so I’d opt for the cenent

Otherwise, gotta rely on Amazon or whoever. I’m going to go back and look again for those rings to order. It appeared when they say for Submariner, they ought to be okay for this BK watch

Here’s what i think I should order:

Amazon.com

This is for a blue dial/ bezel BK 16613

It's a 5 digit or 6 digit 116613?

 

[Kerbus]

Classic non ceramic insert 5 digit equivalent to a model from 2007 or so

The scrap watch is a cheapie would be for insert re installation only. I easily pried if off with my finger. The crystal and back cover are long gone so I got at it very easily Im just looking to practice gluing if it’s not a waste of time

IMG 0255

Image IMG 0255 hosted in ClickPix.org

clickpix.org

 

[KJ2020]

Can you post a pic of the BK with the insert removed, sitting next to it?

Also, when you post pics if you select Full image-> BBCode, it will post the pic right in the thread for viewers.

 

[Kerbus]

Here they are

 

[KJ2020]

I can't see what is going on at 12 o'clock with what looks like the click. The bezel appears to be gen-spec. It should look like this:

That little metal rod ("spring") is the click. It allows for counterclockwise rotation but prevents clockwise rotation. That area should be free of all dirt and adhesion remnants. Yours does not like it is. If you want the bezel to rotate you need to clean up that area.

The problem with adhering an aluminum insert to a bezel by either method is that whether it's glue or a tape strip, the adhesive can (will likely) interfere with the insides of the bezel teeth and make rotation more difficult and less tactile.

Since this is your arrangement, you need to decide a few things.

Do you want to be able to rotate the bezel?

Will the insert stick out above the bezel rim if you use a tape ring? Just cut a narrow piece of masking or painter's tape, stick it in the bezel well, lay the insert on top and see how it fits. This will give you a good idea of sitting height with a tape ring.

If you don't care about the bezel rotating, you can just glue the insert in with near reckless abandon and be done with it. If you want it to rotate, you need to do it very carefully by either:

Placing glue drops on top of the bezel teeth, small enough drops that they won't drool down between the teeth when the insert is pressed. I've done this but I use 30 min slow cure epoxy because it's not messy (no stringers) and much easier to control. Plus placing 120 drops on tiny teeth ledges takes way too long - GSHypo will cure before you finish.

Or, use a very narrow tape ring that will stay mostly level on top of the teeth and not interfere with the click as the bezel is rotated. You can cut away the inner perimeter of a tape ring to make it narrower. Curved manicuring scissors are ideal for this, it's not terribly difficult. You can make this even easier by cutting the tape ring into halves or thirds beforehand. Ofc all cutting is done before any paper backings are removed.

 

[Kerbus]

Ah, you’ve revealed why this bezel was never super easy to rotate since I got it

Maybe the 30 mins low cure epoxy and some praying is good enough for me. I honestly don’t even think I used this watch to time anything any how

Off I go to do a search for the epoxy…

I will clean the insert and bezel even better IPA and ridiculous ready to go…

 

[Kerbus]

R odico, not ridiculous!

 

[KJ2020]

Ah, you’ve revealed why this bezel was never super easy to rotate since I got it

Maybe the 30 mins low cure epoxy and some praying is good enough for me. I honestly don’t even think I used this watch to time anything any how

Off I go to do a search for the epoxy…

I will clean the insert and bezel even better IPA and ridiculous ready to go…

You should use an epoxy that is pretty viscous (runny not pasty). I use Bob Smith Industry's (BSI) from Amazon. I mix it, let it sit about 5 minutes to harden slightly then start to apply it.

It takes a crazy tiny drop to do this. Here is a pic of filling a crystal chip with epoxy so it won't worsen and to improve appearances. For an applicator I use the tip of a 0.25mm broaching file which is quite a bit smaller than that.

So I really don't recommend doing it this way for someone not used to this kind of micro surgery. I think you are better off using a narrow tape ring or even a stock tape ring and take what you get with bezel rotation. This is ofc if it doesn't make the insert sit too high. Otherwise you should probably just glue it with the aforementioned reckless abandon, haha.

You could also just apply a narrow bead of epoxy on the insert underside near the outer edge, about 1mm wide. Then take a clean finger and swipe away most of the bead's depth, leaving only a thin trace of glue. Place the insert and weight it down against the teeth. I use a crystal die as a protective buffer then place a fairly heavy object on top during the 24 hour cure time.

Example

 

[Kerbus]

It’s going to; have to be reckless for me! I think BK even spread the epoxy based on the cleaning I did. Going to seek out the right epoxy now. I can’t do anything else til I have it in hand. Thank you for the pointers!

 

[Kerbus]

Epoxy ordered. Posts re read, wait game has begun. My plan is to practice with the epoxy on the scrap watch case insert to get a general idea of how to attempt this. It doesn’t have to be really similar to the type of insert my watch has, I don’t think! If I feel it’s a no go, maybe I’ll try all over again by attempting to remove that scarp watch insert I used the epoxy on, clean it, then try cut up adhesive tape rings I’d have to order. I believe there are two kinds on Amazon. Maybe I’ll have to measure first

If this shows to be a good plan, and if the above is possible after what I plan to do, then I’ll know what I can do within my ability on the actual insert for my watch.

I will need luck and who knows when I can begin or how long it’s going to take me. This is now my substitute for buying watches this year ( tariffs) I think I’m going to do a passable job, I did recklessly glue a GMT insert once, so maybe that means this could be promising. Otherwise, I’d send this out to the maestro to do it for me


I’ll report back for those who will be in the same situation as I am in now who might read this.