ORF Seamaster 300M movement pictorial; unidirectional autowinding and other differences from VSF

[NaviChief]

Hello,
I had an ORF Seamaster 300M on the bench recently. It was the first one I've serviced in comparison to many VSF's. Here are some thoughts and observations on the movement aspect of it. I recently purged a lot of photos, so I'm a bit lacking in VSF movement shots at the moment.

Both movements are decorated A2824's. My general impression is that VSF uses higher quality clone A2824s. For instance, VSF uses balances with Lyre style Incabloc shock protection found on higher end grades of 2824, vs ORF's Novodiac shock spring. General fit, finish, and cleanliness is also better on the VSF movements.

The automatic rotor is attached differently from VSF. I actually prefer ORF in this regard, as it has no glued on decoration to fall off.

ORF:

VSF:

The decorations are also handled differently. VSF is one large piece that fits over the 2824 and attached with 3 screws under the dial. ORF has smaller plates that attach directly to the 2824. The nod goes to ORF here as the movement is much easier to access for repair or regulation than on VSF.

ORF:

VSF:

Now, what I consider the biggest difference, is how the automatic bridge has been altered in the ORF. I believe this was to improve the look of the decorated movement. One of the reversing wheels was removed, the bridge has been cut and altered, and a click spring installed. This makes the automatic winding system on ORF's unidirectional only.

There are also custom parts there that won't be available to replace.
Functionally you won't notice a difference in winding or power reserve, but unidirectional movements like the 7750 and Miyota 9015 often get labeled as "loud and helicoptory" as the rotor has less resistance in one direction.

I'm not sure how to end this, other than I hope you find that interesting.

 

[flashu]

Interesting read, thanks for sharing.
Overall will you prefer to work on vsf or orf ? Seeing what you r observations are I guess is vsf

 

[40mm]

I have just ordered an ORF version thinking that the VSF models would no longer be available new.

I have always assumed that 'decorated' meant a marked up rotor and maybe an engraved bridge, or plate. I was not expecting changes to the automatic works.

If the poorer quality A2824 in the ORF were to fail would you see any reason it could not be replaced with a genuine eta 2824?

Thanks for this post.

 

[Plaasbaas]

Interesting read! Good to know what to expect if one wants to access the 2824 core of the movement. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Replisimio]

If the poorer quality A2824 in the ORF were to fail would you see any reason it could not be replaced with a genuine eta 2824?

Thanks for this post.

Other than the obvious altering of the auto bridge it would work fine. I’m guessing it would need to be swapped over to the new movement.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[NaviChief]

Interesting read, thanks for sharing.
Overall will you prefer to work on vsf or orf ? Seeing what you r observations are I guess is vsf

My money would go to VSF every time.

If the poorer quality A2824 in the ORF were to fail would you see any reason it could not be replaced with a genuine eta 2824?

At the time I had the movement apart, I wasn't stopping to think if it could be replaced. My fear is that you'd have to be able to drill and tap screw holes in the ETA plates in order to add the decorations on.

 

[Teamjlf]

Great insight… assumed that both movements would be the same considering price point and no real need to make changes as these factories would likely share stuff anyways.

I guess the VSF stuff may be better long term then whilst the later stuff by ORF / HRF may be aesthetically more pleasing.

 

[40mm]

Functionally you won't notice a difference in winding or power reserve, but unidirectional movements like the 7750 and Miyota 9015 often get labeled as "loud and helicoptory" as the rotor has less resistance in one direction.

I have just received my ORF 300M Seamaster and found that the rotor is indeed very loud. It sounds like a tin can being kicked down the road. The movement winds nicely, but there is a lot of free play when setting the time, and I often have to try multiple times to get it to hack. I am inclined to replace the movement even at the expense of loosing some of the decorations.

On the other hand, it looks stunning, and fine adjustments on the clasp are very smooth.


!

 

[APjumbo]

I have just received my ORF 300M Seamaster and found that the rotor is indeed very loud. It sounds like a tin can being kicked down the road. The movement winds nicely, but there is a lot of free play when setting the time, and I often have to try multiple times to get it to hack. I am inclined to replace the movement even at the expense of loosing some of the decorations.

On the other hand, it looks stunning, and fine adjustments on the clasp are very smooth.


!

no joke, one of my 7750 watches had rotor noise, tried very carefully lubricating the rotor with quality lubricant, helped but not perfect, removed the rotor completely with a simple screwdriver in a minute, enjoyed the watch as a manual wind ever since.

 

[Teamjlf]

My pre raid VSF seamster 300 isn’t exactly whisper quiet either. When you shake it you can hear the rotor easily.

 

[APjumbo]

My pre raid VSF seamster 300 isn’t exactly whisper quiet either. When you shake it you can hear the rotor easily.

Buy a $2 blue ball. Figure out what type of lube to use like mobius or something. Use a very tiny amount.
it will help a bit.

 

[aggiedds]

As I’m just getting into watch repair, I’m probably off here - wouldn’t it be possible to replace the automatic winding works with one from another a2824 movement? Should fit if no extra screw holes - which I didn’t see any of. Looks like it still fits under the esthetic parts too.

 

[Damian-DG]

This movement is interchangeable by eta 2824 clones like sea gull st2130 or pt5000?

I bought the seamasters 300 from ZF factory, and I don't know if in case of a problem I could replace it with the st2130. I do not mind losing the decoration.

 

[stack]

So, if I understood correctly the movement by ZF is bi-directional while that of ORF (and the others) is unidirectional but it's look prettier. So you have to choose between better quality and less noise (VSF) and better look (ORF)?
Am i right ?

 

[Diana]

looks cool

 

[jmfrank703]

Can anyone help me find a replica 8800 coaxial movement for my seamaster planet ocean 43.5mm? Can’t find it anywhere.

 

[eBoy]

Can anyone help me find a replica 8800 coaxial movement for my seamaster planet ocean 43.5mm? Can’t find it anywhere.

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[eBoy]

Can anyone help me find a replica 8800 coaxial movement for my seamaster planet ocean 43.5mm? Can’t find it anywhere.

Well, there's an easy explanation for that: There are no replica movements that have a real co-axial escapement. All decorated clones as well as the super clones are non-co-axial even though it says so on the rep dials.