More info on BR rep movements

[watchbuff]

Wow. SO now we have gone back to square one. Someone somewhere is making the movements for the BR. When I get mine from Silix i will scrutinize it and get an answer. Maybe someone could go ask over at RWG (I wont..I hate that place) and maybe someone there will know.

So it looks for now if a movement goes tits up we have to buy a new watch or get the $85.00 movement from Silix.

 

[earlgrey-erfurt]

ok i will ask

 

[watchbuff]

When I get my movement from silix I will do my best to analyze it and ID it for future reference.


On another topic, I spoke to Everest watch works and he said the phantom dials were a standard lume job. So about $ 100.00 or so to "pimp" your BR

 

[Tommy Tom]

Vince,

Do you mean that it would cost around $100 to turn a standard B&R Phantom to one with high quality lume? I'd be interested to hear if they could do decent lume that dark.

Fleed has managed to get lume pretty grey but not as dark as the gen Phantom, though I have to say having held a gen up to a halogen lamp for a minute it doesn't glow anyway near what they claim.

 

[watchbuff]

More like 120, 130 for lume , pressure test and shipping. Still worth it. I have never seen Everest phantom lume but he has every tint imaginable. With the tint being so dark you'll have to expect the lume to be subdued. My orange lume is not as bright as rye blue- green lume for the white on black dial. Seeing kente work first hand, I'm sure his would be spot on.

 

[earlgrey-erfurt]

Hi Tommy

I have the same movement in as you!!!

From who do you get the watch, cause mine is from a forum member who s getting it from another one

so maybe the question on RWG get a result

cheers helmut

Just for reference here is a few images of the 3.6mm "Asian 2813-2 clone" in the Bell & Ross watches. It is exactly the same thickness as the ETA - 3.6mm, but it's definitely NOT a Seagull ST18





[img=http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/1655/cimg5943me5.th.jpg]



I can also confirm that the Seagull ST18 will not fit in any of the B&R cases, precisely because they are a clone of the ETA 2892 - the stem release is in the wrong place.

Here is an image of the ST18. "1" shows where the release button is and "2" shows where it would need to be to work in a rep B&R case.



I guess this means that I'm going to have to now buy another watch and pray to god it's one that doesn't have this thin mechanism in it, because after more than 6 months looking for a replacement and coming up with nothing I think I should finally admit defeat....even the dealer that sold me the original watch can't get it for me.

Worth thinking about in hindsight....If you want to keep your reps for years you need to make sure that the mechanism is cheap and easily replaceable.

 

[Tommy Tom]

Helmut,

Mine was bought new from Trevor. He has been trying to locate one for months but not come up with anything yet. It's annoying because mine still actually works - it's just that the second hand stem has snapped off. I guess I could live with the second hand until I can get a replacement - I just want to wear the bloody thing again!!!

 

[earlgrey-erfurt]

i started new threads on RG and RWG about our question

found yours from the last year

think this mvmt is a kind of ghost...

helmut

 

[watchbuff]

Ok. I got hosed. Silix's movement came defective. I am waiting a response on "what are you gonna do" at our last email. I have faith in his good Customer service but after the aggravation a bad movement really "ticked " me off. I took it to my watchmaker and he wont touch it since parts are near impossible to source. HE says it's cheaper to get a new movement Does anyone have ANY idea where i could get this in case Silix cannot deliver?



Frustrated! :?

 

[Tommy Tom]

Oh God Vince, I'm sorry for you man. What on earth happened? Did it just stop?

I think i'd do what I think you recommended to me - get a £60 rep from ufanta, then use the mechanism. Just ask him first what the case size is. I think the one we have is 9mm of the top of my head.

 

[watchbuff]

sux i know. the cases are 9mm thick pretty standard. ufanta has the crappy acid etched one but who cares. the movement is what we need and we'll have spare parts to boot. one more yry or else it goes up for sale.

 

[nielsen]

I may be speaking entirely out of turn here, and if so, please ignore, but...... I just checked Trusty Time's web site and he's selling BR 03 with the option of Swiss ETA 2836 movements. Isn't that what we are all trying to achieve here? I'm not familiar with the 2836. Are they the standard automatic? I'd love to hear from anyone who has bought one of these because that's sorta what I've been holding out for--except, of course, the olive green one!

 

[Tommy Tom]

Nielsen - of course your not speaking out of turn. That's what this forum is all about - increasing and sharing knowledge (and comforting yourself with the knowledge that you are not alone in your rep nerdishness)

I hadn't seen those watches on Andy's site, but they are there. Unfortunately they are fantasy watches so not quite the holy grail. B&R never made a 42mm watch without a date, and they never made a limited edition blue coloured one in a 42mm. They're all 46mm.

Other things to report is that Kent at Everest has taken delivery of the black lume which B&R use - it's made by Tritec and comes in four shades of....well... black. This would be what you'd need for the ultimate phantom.

The main problem is that any phantom rep you buy will, as Watchbuff has said, have a shitty case. I would wait a few months until our dealers bring out a PVD 46mm case with the allen bolts on the back (they already have a silver case), then have Everest paint the dial grey/back, before luming it. I would think that would give you the best.

Be warned though - this lume doesn't glow very much at all, even on the gen - don't believe the B&R media. It doesn't even glow white as they show, it's olive/green.

 

[watchbuff]

All and any constructive input welcome. Tommy is that a fact the the PVD's will have the he screws in the back? No more drilling???? I would buy one for that.

The only BR's are the 46mm's and the 03's in the correct size without a date. The 46mm's are the deal!

I will also get a "spare"parrts watch from Ufanta if I don't hear back from Silix. Unless these 46mm PVDs with the screws come out then I'll shell out for that.

Tommy, let me know how thew Lume turns out in the Phantom. I will contact Kent at Everest and maybe have him make good on a "favor" he owes me. with the white dial.

 

[nielsen]

Tommy Tom: you say "B&R never made a 42mm watch without a date" (I can't figure out how you quote someone within a box so I've cut-and-pasted. Sorry). The Swiss ETA 2836 on Trusty Time's site do have dates on the 42mm 03 series so I don't understand their shortcoming--at least they do in the picture and his description.

 

[Tommy Tom]

Tommy Tom: you say "B&R never made a 42mm watch without a date" (I can't figure out how you quote someone within a box so I've cut-and-pasted. Sorry). The Swiss ETA 2836 on Trusty Time's site do have dates on the 42mm 03 series so I don't understand their shortcoming--at least they do in the picture and his description.

I could easily have overlooked one of course, but I've just gone back on Trustytime and had a look and he sell two with the swiss 2836 -a SS case with blue dial and PVD case with blue dial (codes BR026 & BR029). In the images he shows of these watches, neither has a date window as the gen. Although they say BR-03 92 on the dial it is a BR01-92 in a 42mm which is a fantasy watch. The watches he sells with a date wheel all have an asian 4813 (or swiss quartz for chrono).

If I have just not spotted the swiss 2836 with a date wheel, as my eyes are not what they used to be, please let me know where it is as I will add it to my wishlist

 

[nielsen]

My mistake, Tommy Tom. Sorry. It is Pure Time's site that has the BR 03 in all sorts of versions with the Swiss ETA 2836 for an extra $120, and it has the date in the picture and the description. Whadya think?

 

[Tommy Tom]

Just has a look - Angus really is pretty great isn't he!

Having thought about it, I personally would go with the asian 21J version. I have found these mechanisms to be real workhorses and very reliable. They do tend to run a little fast but nothing that can't be sorted by adjusting the regulator.

I think that however tempting the swiss is, you can buy 10 of the asian mechanism from Ofrei or Cousins for $120 and with these replacements could run the watch for the next 50 years.

I have had reps with this mechanisms that are still trucking 5 years down the line. As the mechanism is so well sealed inside the case of a B&R I'm not sure how important it is to go swiss.

This of course is just my opinion - but for an extra $120 - i'd get someone to lume it professionally. Something you will really appreciated. Watchbuff, what do you think?

 

[watchbuff]

Absolutely agree my friend.
The cost of these movements compared to swiss is a ratio of 1:10 I can get an ETA 2892 to wedge in BR and have the high probability of it running smooth for years and for less i could have the "chance " of a chinese movement giving the same reliability. Its like Yugo to Benz, both will get you there it's just one has a better mechanical record. I am starting to believe the Swiss movements are hedging there bets in their reputation. If we could get some type of experiment going say 10 ETA movements and 10 Seagull equivalents in a winder running for a given stretch of time, asidfe from regulation the actual movement seizing being the resultant. We might be surprised at the results. Maybe a project for some day, it would take years I'm sure.

I think I would rather replace the movement than have it fixed, even an ETA crapping out would prompt me for a repair probably equaling or exceeding what I paid for the entire rep or movement itself. It's a question of worth. I have no problem tossing an $18.00 asian movemetn in the trash and replacing it, more time efficient too. I could do a swap in 20 minutes. No servicing no fuss. The money saved could get a killer Everest lume job or other mod. I do lean still towards swiss when I can but from spending $200.00 to $360.00 for the same BR one asian one ETA (or copy who the hell knows), it's a no brainer. Look at it like replacing a battery in a quartz. :wink:

It just makes sense.

Tommy , we gotta see that Phantom Lume when it comes back.
Update on my DOA movement. Silix is a genuine dealer. He is sending another movement no charge. I will take the DOA movement and scrutinize it for it's origin and where I can get replacements when and if it dies and/ or get a UFanta $69.00 job to have oodles of parts and spares.

 

[nielsen]

Hey, thanks for the thoughts on the Swiss versus asian ETA. The way you describe it makes good sense. I think it is time I abandoned my prejudice against the Asian movement--especially since it is a prejudice not based on experience. I have a Russian Vostok submariners automatic I bought years ago in Poland. Everyone said the movement was junk but I bought it because of my interest in the Cold War: it looks so cool. It keeps perfect time and has done so for years! (Actually, someone else told me once that the Vostok people used Swiss ETAs, not Soviet-made movements. Do you by chance know whether there's any truth in that? I've never had the case open.