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HOW TO: Adjust your rep's timing and beat.

colt45gto

Renowned Member
22/12/10
769
3
0
i didn't mess with 'B' no i don't have that kind of steady hand. my fingers are more like sledge hammers for small stuff lol.
i called the WS that supposedly serviced it. he thinks a hair spring might be caught up, i'm taking it back monday so he can have a play with it, its not a 21j its got the adjustment screw and the other which i didn't touch. so i wouldn't know which way to move the 'B' towards the movement or away from?
 

WatchDoc

I'm Pretty Popular
15/2/10
1,088
0
0
if you move A and B farther apart, it slows the movement down (on an ETA clone).
on a 21J it's the opposite. Check the pics above. I've been adjusting a 21j, and that's the first service I've done on my watches. Really not too hard, fingers notwithstanding.
 

colt45gto

Renowned Member
22/12/10
769
3
0
yep just done that. its now fully adjusted to its absolute maximum on both A+B and its still 5 secs fast over 2 mins :S

so a ETA 2834-2 you move 'B' towards the movement to slow it down, move it away to speed it up.

i might just have got this? i started it off a second behind and after 2 mins its loosing time. now i can fine tune it with the adjustment screw :)
 

Bigbear

You're Saying I Can Sell?
6/10/09
57
0
0
Great stuff! Did this on my newly arrived 005 which was running wayyyyyy to fast.
 

Wirral_guy

Horology Curious
10/5/11
19
1
0
My very nice Pam power reserve (from Reg) has become my daily wearer but it was adding 45 secs-1:30 mins a day. Not too serious but a pain to reset every few days. I had a bit of a search and found this article. Big thanks to gioarmani for originally putting it up.


So, with the aid of a rubber ball case opener (BTW - genius piece of kit), a toothpick and bags of optimism, I opened my case, stopped the watch (just in case I touched anything) and started to play
smile.gif


Using the toothpick I moved the regulation arm slightly anti-clockwise (check the article again - yep, clockwise if too slow, anti-clockwise if too fast), closed the case, reset to a radio-controlled clock and put back on wrist.
3 hours later - Damn, it's gaining even more time! now about 1 min per 3 hours

Take 2 - open the case (did I mention the genius rubber ball?
smile.gif
), check the web article again, look at pics of movement, stop the mech, adjust a little more and put back on wrist.
3 hours later - Damn, still gaining like mad
wounded1.gif
.

Take 3 - re-read the entire article again including all replies, draw diagram of directions to move arm, open the case, look at diagram, stop the mech, look at diagram, chant direction mantra "up - fast, down - slow" adjust clockwise a little.... just a little more.... itty bit more....Bugger, too much pressure and the arm moves about 3 feet!. Read article, look at diagram. Try to correct back to roughly where it was and move it slightly.
5 hours later - Oh For F**** sake!!!! - it's now haemorrhaging time and is currently close to 5 mins slow. Have I done something wrong? Did I touch something I shouldn't of? Have I misread the article? Bugger, I've knackered it now haven't I. I just knew I shouldn't have touched it. Now a perfectly good watch is knackered. Stupid, stupid stupid idiot
wounded1.gif


Time for bed

New day, renewed optimism.
Take 4 - open the case, read article, look at pics of movement in article, stop the mech, look at pics of movement in article, take a deep breath, hold breath, adjust anti-clockwise again (just a fraction), look at pics of movement in article, close case and put back on wrist. Breathe again.
4 hours later - losing less time but still well out.

Take 5, 6, 7, 8...... - repeat as above
smile.gif
)

3 Days later
Take 382 (OK, maybe slight exaggeration) - One last adjustment. Read article. Look at pics of movement in article. I move it a smidgeon anti-clockwise and put back on wrist.
1 hour later - hey, spot on!. Must be a fluke. refuse to look at watch for 2 hours - hey! still within a tick of spot-on. Nah, can't be right, ignore watch for rest of evening.


Next morning, make tea, check watch against atomic clock - Success!!! (cue fanfare, balloons, streamers etc). It's still less than a second out. I'm a genius! I always knew I could do it.
smile.gif
Always had the faith.

Now, I've always been a bit sceptical of claims of + or - secs a day for a generic 21j movement but I swear on my dogs life that, after 5 days, my watch is now losing less than a second per day (2/3 seconds lost since the last adjustment). It is worn all day and is on my nightstand, face-up, overnight.


Points to note:
1. I think it is a little tricky because the 21j movements are not the highest craftsmanship around to start with. I'm guessing that moving the regulation arm in itself introduces other stresses\changes to the hairspring etc so moving one way does not necessarily alter the timing in the way you'd think so it is a case of trial and error until you find the sweet spot.
2. When I say move slightly, I mean move SLIGHTLY. Less than a mm at a time.
3. Patience\perseverance! OK, it may not have taken 382 attempts but it was well into the teens so you need to allow for several days worth of adjustment.
4. Buy a sticky ball! Probably the cheapest and most useful bit of kit I have bought for anything.
5. Remember that this is a sub-$100 delivered watch and marvel that it even manages to stay ticking for more than a few days let alone manage to tell the time!
6. Finally, you realise no-one (outside of this forum) cares! Not a jot. Not one iota. Missus thinks you're becoming [more] anal. Resolve to 'get a life'

Dave
 
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Darkneomd21

Horology Curious
27/11/09
15
0
0
Nice thread, my PO was running about 3s fast every 30 minutes, its been keeping time (to the second) with my authentic quartz Swatch chrono) the sec hands on both watches have kept pace with eachother for over a day now... big improvement.
Normally I would lose about a minute every 2 ~ 3 days depending how much I wore the watch that week.... now its almost perfect! i didn't even have to move the arm much just a light tap tap.

If you are having problems moving the arm too much try just taping it and not pushing it, because its the natural instinct for the human hand to apply force and then over-apply pressure when resistance stops and the arm starts to move, lightly tapping the arm in the desired direction worked for me... but I practiced on a junk movement for about 5 minutes before I attempted it on my 7750.

Thanks for the thread....!

Try using your finger (kinda like chop sticks motion or tickling with one finger and wedge your hand so that it doesn't move)... also it helps to remove the watch band (if you have a steel band with deployment clasp) prior to opening the case so that you can focus on the arm and not preventing the clasp from smacking the movement/fly wheel.!



Also, don't go crazy over it, your not gona get the watch to stay perfectly timed (assuming you actually wear the thing day to day) simply moving/swinging your arm / walking will slowly make it gain/lose a sec or two a day in normal use... its a mechanical watch ! moving your arm has gyroscopic forces on the rotor... causing it to absorb movements...etc.)

I tend to leave my watch 12" o clock position facing up (like in a display case position) and it seems to keep good time like that when not wearing it ... (usually while sleeping etc cause I can't sleep with watches on).
 

xX ZMonster Xx

Active Member
31/1/12
278
0
16
The only thing I would add to this is the use of the Kello app for iPhone/iPad to check the +/- sec per day. It is cheap and worked really well for me in addition to the other steps you had listed.
 

elmataplata

Active Member
29/12/10
299
0
0
The only thing I would add to this is the use of the Kello app for iPhone/iPad to check the +/- sec per day. It is cheap and worked really well for me in addition to the other steps you had listed.

sadly its not very accurate. Biburo for PC gives a much better impression.
 

oberblender

Active Member
Certified
20/4/08
375
70
28
Very nice one! Is there any chance you could fix the missing pics? :)
 

toasternz

You're Saying I Can Sell?
30/4/12
33
0
0
Accuracy dependent on how wound the mechanism is??

Can I ask a question, does accuracy of the movement depend heavily on how wound the mechanism is?

For instance my new watch with Asian 2836-2 seems to lose about 5sec a day when well wound on my wrist but during a run down test [it lasted 44+ hours] I noticed that in the last day before running down it started to lose time much faster, something like 20-30sec a day. Is that normal??

Thanks.
 

Erok68

watch nerd
28/11/10
133
3
18
Norway
Thanks, my hubi is running like a punk on speed, but now it has settled down finally

nice, thank you :)



May be a bit repetitive and requires a modicum of patience, but it's always worked for me. I currently have six (ETAs 2836-2s & 2671-2s, and Asian 7750s & 7753s) all synched with each other, almost to the exact second.

The way I do mine is as follows:

1) Open the digital clock on your computer.

2) Remove the case-back

3) Stop the second hand on the watch by pulling the crown out to the time-set position, to activate the hacking movement (stop the second hand directly at the twelve o'clock position).

4) Then roll the minute hand forward to where it will be, one minute from now.

5) When the digital second hand on the computer reaches 12 o'clock, push the crown back in so the watch & the computer's clock are now synched to the exact hour, minute & second.

6) Put the watch on a winder for a night & compare your watch to the computer's clock after 24 hours to see how far off they are.

7) Pop the caseback. For example, if the watch is now fast by 10 seconds per 24 hours, simply turn the adjustment screw (C, pictured below) so that it loses 10 seconds for every 24 hours; alternatively, do the opposite, if it's slow by 10 seconds.

(If adjusting via the screw doesn't regulate it enough, on an ETA movement--like the one pictured below--the farther apart you move arms A & B from each other, the longer the stroke, so the slower the watch will run. However, a little goes a long way with this, so use cautiously)

ETA 2671-2:

IMG_3657.jpg




ETA 2836-2


183673-6507.jpg




Each notch towards "+" represents a 5 second gain per 24 hours. Each notch towards "-" represents a 5 second loss per 24 hours. Adjust accordingly


NOTE: For Asian chrono movements, they're slightly different. See the little regulation arm circled in red?:


183673-6508.jpg

A.jpg

C.jpg




If it's running too fast, you'll want to move it to the right (counter-clockwise, as shown with the red arrow below) :

183673-6509.jpg



If it's running too slow, you'll want to move it to the left (clockwise & opposite of the red arrow's direction).

The regulation arm on the Asian 7750s & 7753s (sub-dials at 6, 9, & 12 o'clock, or at 3,6, and 9) are very sensitive--they only need to me moved a fraction of an inch at a time; not as much as the picture shows (it's merely an exaggeration to illustrate a point).


8) Now repeat steps 3-7, to test it's accuracy. This should be perfected after a couple of days.


I technically have no way to measure the movement's beat-rate via electronics or machinery, but at this point don't really need or care about that, as long as the watch is keeping the best time it can.

I've now got six synched automatic watches that are so precise, I can literally watch the second hand roll over the 12 o''clock position at the very second when the time on my cell phone (or computer) changes minutes. They're damn near almost exact as digital or quartz watches now.

Note: Depending on what position you store your automatic watch in, will play a role in determining how many seconds it gains or loses every night--this is why I keep them on a winder, so that they are constantly moving and not at rest (in the same position).

1) If you lay an automatic watch flat & level (with the crystal facing up), it will usually gain a couple of seconds per night.

2) If you lay the watch on its side (with the crown facing down) it will lose a second or two per night.

3) Contrarily, if it's stored on its side (crown facing up), it will generally lose more than 2 seconds--or more--per night.


EDIT: Chances are, if you've performed all of this and your movement is still too slow or too fast, it's running dry & will probably need a full service. On the bright side, once done, you won't have to touch it again for another five years.

Hope this is of some help to you. Have fun!
 

Mendota

Put Some Respect On My Name
16/10/08
3,220
85
0
MN
I have 2 watches that are both gaining around 4 minutes or more per day. One is a gen ETA 2846 lowbeat and the other is a fastbeat 21j 2813. Is ~4 minutes fast in 24 hours still within the realm of being able to adjust the timing or is this indicative of a larger problem? I read some articles on gen forums and those guys seem to believe that anything faster than 30 seconds means there is a problem that requires service. Just curious to know what everyone thinks.
 

offroadfreak

You're Saying I Can Sell?
Certified
29/8/12
97
9
8
Hey! First off thanks for the great post!

I am kinda confused with an 7750 movement. My HBB V6 loses 30 secs a day.So i would like to speed up the movement. But I don't understand where to adjust it. On the arrow itself?