Dealer Pricing

[jag0]

I am TOTALLY new to the rep scene/hobby and these forums in general.

I can only assume that all this 'drama' isnt regular. In any case, do those two guys really have THAT much control over prices and such? In my ignorant mind i have a picture of rep factories selling to many people. The more units you buy the better the unit price you get. But nobody aside from factory owners can and would willingly NOT sell to people who are going to resell your already illegal products.

But from my reading on the forum it appears that im totally wrong, and Josh/andrew are able to set prices, dictate to factories, and intimidate other sellers....

Which brings me to my next point. I'm not sure who has been following my thread on my recent purchases from hont. But thus far hont has been really great in terms of communication, prices, being patient with a noob, and I am tempted to promote the hell out of him. But because of possibility of him being intimidated i didnt even want to post the prices that i got my stuff for... Is this how you guys have always operated? and is this the way that i can expect the scene will continue to operate?

 

[KBH]

i have several screen shots of trusty in watchstation's section (since we removed jandrew from rwi) for long periods of time checking his prices. they are checking on everybody that is posting prices to make sure they aren't being undersold by large amounts.

hk

That's called market research. Every good businessman wants to know what their competition's pricing is. Don't be overly paranoid about it.

Problem is not snooping, did you miss the part where Jandrew were threatening other dealers because they were lowering down the prices? :?

I've been following it all the way. I can't say the evidence was overwhelming one way or the other. As I keep hearing, there's more to the story than we have seen. Maybe that's why I haven't been fully persuaded.

 

[hk45ca]

this is the second time since i have been involved with this game i have seen this exact same crap happen. a dealer starts out as a no body, builds up a good reputation, has a great business with tons of happy customers, the factories and suppliers start catering to him because he is their best customer and then the more power they get the greedier they get until it kills their business and they become a nobody. this is exactly what is going to happen here it is just a matter of time. if you stick around as long as i have you will watch it come to pass.

 

[KBH]

When I see watches being sold from 400.00 to a G-note for a watch that was retailing for 150.00 a year ago I get a bit pissed. We as a community would laugh at those paying such prices. What went up? Production cost? lol Please. Anyone buying into the term 1:1 (or produced from the Gen) is being fleeced. Now if you are enjoying your bend over action, Do what thou wilt, shall be the whole of the law.

Not that I agree with the new prices. I wouldn't buy them either. But I don't believe a $1000 Hublot was ever available at $150. My last rep was a $275 Skyland and I would take it over the last $550 gen Accutron I bought. A couple of years ago these kind of reps weren't even available. The prices in the most part are not too out of line with the quality.

If only the QC would improve.

 

[KBH]

this is the second time since i have been involved with this game i have seen this exact same crap happen. a dealer starts out as a no body, builds up a good reputation, has a great business with tons of happy customers, the factories and suppliers start catering to him because he is their best customer and then the more power they get the greedier they get until it kills their business and they become a nobody. this is exactly what is going to happen here it is just a matter of time. if you stick around as long as i have you will watch it come to pass.

I agree with you 100%. If Jandrew don't follow the market's lower prices, they will surely fail. In the long run it's still a free market. No 2 people are bigger than the world market for reps. It they were, they'd be multi, multi millionaires and would no longer care.

 

[watchbuff]

@ jag
Pricing is a delicate subject for individulas and for the cartels. If member X sees you get watch x for $x dollars he will think it will be that price for him, and it should. You did buy in "bulk" so some may not get that rate in your case. Im sure for such a bulk order a watch was "thrown in" gratis.

The cartel and the douche lurkers at RepGeek see and read stuff here. Trust me if i can lurk after being banned, many others can. Still many must cut paste and report back of our operation.So thankfully prices are not listed but any mole can become a new member here and just get prices from Hont and the proverbial "cat" is out of the bag. So they should post prices IMO.

It's just silly drama that went on here and RG.l It was a long time coming and yet it could have been avoided. Some house cleaning was in order and some feelings were hurt.....no big deal.

Jandrew can control SOME of the inventory but never all. I think there could be an availability issue but Hont and the otehrs always seem to be able to get what the Cartel has. It may take a little more time...but is it not worth a few days of waiting for not getting the Cartels pipe up the cornhole?

I would like to see pricing, some side by side pricing ( i made this suggestion before) so we can shop smarter, and maybe as we all know the best price does not always yield the better version.

Ive been kinda quiet around here since the Klink thing and some of the other controversies re-hashed. But I am grateful for TTK...being no where to be found nor read his rhetoric and piss poor excuses on why he basically stole someones money. That Jandrew is also a memory and the fancy website, 1:1, and other lingo which rings of the very terminology we have come to flag in our heads. Some members who were inflammatory have become silent either because they have been banned or their opinion gets no support from the collective here.

I was glad when July ended, and feeling better that this mess is winding down in Mid August finally.

Bought a few cool reps, shared some pics and got right back to what I post here for. It's not about the forum. It's about the watch on my wrist, that I like to share with all of you.

 

[RWIGWH]

When I see watches being sold from 400.00 to a G-note for a watch that was retailing for 150.00 a year ago I get a bit pissed. We as a community would laugh at those paying such prices. What went up? Production cost? lol Please. Anyone buying into the term 1:1 (or produced from the Gen) is being fleeced. Now if you are enjoying your bend over action, Do what thou wilt, shall be the whole of the law.

Not that I agree with the new prices. I wouldn't buy them either. But I don't believe a $1000 Hublot was ever available at $150. My last rep was a $275 Skyland and I would take it over the last $550 gen Accutron I bought. A couple of years ago these kind of reps weren't even available. The prices in the most part are not too out of line with the quality.

If only the QC would improve.

No matter how you would like to look at it, these watches have the same generic movements in them. A few improvements here and there, but nothing has changed. So uh, explain to me again how I can buy my Asia 7750 Daytona for a buck and a half and a watch with the same crap movement in it is now 400??? Wow design costs are thru the roof in the black market? No.

 

[watchbuff]

The supply and demand model does not apply here. even if supply is up, if demand is up prices will be high. There is not an abundance of the "good"reps out there unlike the Canal st crap that is in abundace. So these "better " versions and especially the ones with Swiss movements are the best of what they are making.

My Nazi guru matchmaker I worked for so many years ago was quite impressed with my MBW GMTII with IHS. He thought it was genius in simplicity on how they took what is the better if not best movements and placed it in a watch that 99.9% of the population could never tell.

Think of it...Bell and Ross uses a $400.00 movement in a $6000.00 watch......pretty easy decision.

 

[KBH]

No matter how you would like to look at it, these watches have the same generic movements in them. A few improvements here and there, but nothing has changed. So uh, explain to me again how I can buy my Asia 7750 Daytona for a buck and a half and a watch with the same crap movement in it is now 400??? Wow design costs are thru the roof in the black market? No.

First of all, the same generic movement, the Asian 7750, is now a world class movement compared to the earlier lo beat pieces of crap of a few years ago. Check Ziggyzumba's write up on that. Second, I wouldn't pay a buck and a half for a Daytona with huge known problems due to the additional gears that were glued on. You get what you pay for.

How many old $150 reps had double AR and superluminova and ALMOST exact dials, bracelets, etc. How many $150 reps fool the WIS's on the gen boards like they are doing today. Not many!

 

[RWIGWH]

No matter how you would like to look at it, these watches have the same generic movements in them. A few improvements here and there, but nothing has changed. So uh, explain to me again how I can buy my Asia 7750 Daytona for a buck and a half and a watch with the same crap movement in it is now 400??? Wow design costs are thru the roof in the black market? No.

First of all, the same generic movement, the Asian 7750, is now a world class movement compared to the earlier lo beat pieces of crap of a few years ago. Check Ziggyzumba's write up on that. Second, I wouldn't pay a buck and a half for a Daytona with huge known problems due to the additional gears that were glued on. You get what you pay for.

How many old $150 reps had double AR and superluminova and ALMOST exact dials, bracelets, etc. How many $150 reps fool the WIS's on the gen boards like they are doing today. Not many!

World class movement? lol... Di-sect an asian 7750 and you will find a world class mess made by people without a clue of what they are doing. You have no idea WTF you are talking about. A actual Swiss 7750 is a work of art. The Asia one is a fucking lump of nickle plated crap compared. Cheaper rubber and ever cheaper leather bands are now all the rage. I can't tell you how many times of I have read about my AR "coming off" my rep. The quality is getting better I agree, but these price points are treading close to some very well made QC'D gens. And to me that's just insane.

 

[KBH]

Notice I said "compared to the earlier lo beat pieces of crap". I was just saying they've come a long way. Not that they are in any way comparable to Swiss ETA.

They've come a long way, as have reps in general, as far as I have seen.

 

[RWIGWH]

Notice I said "compared to the earlier lo beat pieces of crap". I was just saying they've come a long way. Not that they are in any way comparable to Swiss ETA.

They've come a long way, as have reps in general, as far as I have seen.

They have yes. My point is, we now have dealers trying to sell us watches at gen price points that do not warrant it. No matter what you read, and from whoever says it with an impeccable reputation, it is a flat out lie. It is the nature of our hobby to do so. That is why I am so impressed with the decision made here. It is highly commendable.

 

[watchbuff]

I agree KBH the swiss stil have the best quality movemetns but teh chinese are not too far behind. I still would love to get one swiss and one asian (both new)watch in a winder and let them rip and see which one chokes first.

 

[RWIGWH]

BTW the low beat POS is virtually the same movement as the high beat.

 

[watchbuff]

Well it seems this group grew a back bone. Good on ya.

We always had one...just cant go hitting the "eject" button without a case first.

I have always said I admire the Admin here for having the courage to do the right thing.....it's honorable

 

[RWIGWH]

Well it seems this group grew a back bone. Good on ya.

We always had one...just cant go hitting the "eject" button without a case first.

I have always said I admire the Admin here for having the courage to do the right thing.....it's honorable

I was referring to the present day admin. Not the community. It has been made public more then once over the years.

 

[KBH]

BTW the low beat POS is virtually the same movement as the high beat.

Why are there not the same problems with the movements as a few years ago?

Don't kid yourself if you don't think there is ongoing improvements in these movements.

They aren't "rep" movements. The Chinese watch industry is highly subsidized by the Chinese government and they have every intention of competing head to head with the Swiss. As I'm sure you know, most of the Swiss movements are now made in China, anyway.

And, on another note, there are still plenty of excellent reps for $100 to $150. Noobmariner and Chopard GTXL come to mind. Lot's of others.

Good night, all.

 

[Pizzanooo]

My guess is that as long as the so called "cartel" act as yard sticks then one can easily estimate what a "fair deal" is, basically if your quote is higher than the cartel's you're being fleeced, lower then you've got yourself a deal, who cares if someone can still shave another 5 to 10% off. (this isn't taking into account factors such as QC, shipping guarantees or counseling, which in my opinion are still worth prime $)

if you are paying cartel prices you are getting it broke off in you. it's that simple and even the cheaper pricing that you see isn't anywhere near how cheap it could be because they are artificially elevating the market. that is where getting other dealers cut off from supplies come in. get rid of those two and you will see prices drop dramatically.

you want qc and shipping guarantees go to ruby or hont. they are the cheapest at providing that. every bodies prices could be much lower if jandrew were gone, stop buying from them and they will loose that power. we have seen this before. paul used to be the factories go to guy and have all the best stuff when nobody else would. he got greedy, lost his customers and now he is just another nobody. the sooner people wise up the sooner it will happen here and the sooner we can all go back to enjoying this hobby for what it is, cheap ass chinese toys.

Hey hk45ca was it was ever determined that Paul version 2 was the same as version 1, or a stand in?
Your not the only old timer around. :wink:

 

[RWIGWH]

BTW the low beat POS is virtually the same movement as the high beat.

Why are there not the same problems with the movements as a few years ago?

Don't kid yourself if you don't think there is ongoing improvements in these movements.

They aren't "rep" movements. The Chinese watch industry is highly subsidized by the Chinese government and they have every intention of competing head to head with the Swiss. As I'm sure you know, most of the Swiss movements are now made in China, anyway.

And, on another note, there are still plenty of excellent reps for $100 to $150. Noobmariner and Chopard GTXL come to mind. Lot's of others.

Good night, all.

They figured out a few problems and fixed it. The higher beat really isn't the difference. 100 to 150??? How about 40 to 90. The Chinese make/copied one of the finest movements made, and you can find them in our reps also. The Seagull ST19.

 

[hk45ca]

My guess is that as long as the so called "cartel" act as yard sticks then one can easily estimate what a "fair deal" is, basically if your quote is higher than the cartel's you're being fleeced, lower then you've got yourself a deal, who cares if someone can still shave another 5 to 10% off. (this isn't taking into account factors such as QC, shipping guarantees or counseling, which in my opinion are still worth prime $)

if you are paying cartel prices you are getting it broke off in you. it's that simple and even the cheaper pricing that you see isn't anywhere near how cheap it could be because they are artificially elevating the market. that is where getting other dealers cut off from supplies come in. get rid of those two and you will see prices drop dramatically.

you want qc and shipping guarantees go to ruby or hont. they are the cheapest at providing that. every bodies prices could be much lower if jandrew were gone, stop buying from them and they will loose that power. we have seen this before. paul used to be the factories go to guy and have all the best stuff when nobody else would. he got greedy, lost his customers and now he is just another nobody. the sooner people wise up the sooner it will happen here and the sooner we can all go back to enjoying this hobby for what it is, cheap ass chinese toys.

Hey hk45ca was it was ever determined that Paul version 2 was the same as version 1, or a stand in?
Your not the only old timer around. :wink:

i know and i am glad. lmao :wink: