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BE AWARE! Flawed KW PAM 127 with SF movement- ***[QCpics allowed]***

undercoverz

Active Member
17/9/15
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DUE TO THE INTEREST AND IMPORTANCE OF THIS MATTER
I WILL ALLOW QC PICS HERE FOR INFORMATIVE PURPOSES

INDEED YOUR QC PICS WILL BE WELCOME

ALE



Dear all,

Here's my story: I purchased two KW PAM 127s from a local dealer in Guangzhou, China in early September. One for myself and the other as a gift for my best pal. Familiarizing subsequently myself with some of the knowledge you folks impart here, I noticed that both of my KW pieces has the same problem: the erroneous placement of inscriptions on bridges. After comparing multiple photos on PureTime featuring the three versions (SF, ZF, KW) being offered presently. I was able to conclude with confidence that the case itself was KW (especially given mine is with an OOR serial, and judging the shape of CG) while the movement was SF (largely because of wrong locations of backcase engravings and weaker sunburst effect). Then I went to my dealer and made this suggestion to him. He later confirmed with the vendor from KW it was indeed the case. KW ran out of its own movements so it just borrowed its parts from SF.

I firstly mentioned this incident a few days ago in a reply to the thread "Luminor {*PCTeam*} Quick&Dirty KW PAM 127 comments". Since then a number of fellow members have confirmed with the TDs that indeed the current batch of KW PAM 127s are loaded with SF movements, which has the vital flaw of wrong inscriptions. After a few exchanges in that thread, I feel obligated to bring your attention to the fact that it seems highly likely that the latest batch of our currently recommended fiddy -- KW PAM 127 is a hybrid loaded with an obviously-flawed movement made by SF. Several photos of this type of KW fiddy are attached for your convenient reference.


One of my fiddies upon arrival:
Untitled



An upfront shot:




My KW fiddy's backcase, notice the wrong placement of inscriptions:
Untitled


My friend's KW Fiddy's backcase, notice the wrong placement of inscrptions is even slightly different from mine. Another easy tell is that the Y-Incabloc is missing. I was in a hurry to send my friend this gift so proper QC didn't really happen. And now we can only regret the result.
Untitled

Finally, I will give a photo of largely correct inscriptions on the bridge (very close to gen after comparison)





In conclusion, I use the inscriptions right above the golden OFFICINE PANERAI as an easy reference point. The right ones should be ANERAI PA, whereas the inscriptions on the latest batch of KW fiddy are quite all over the place. This consists a rather important flaw worth a whole new thread, in my opinion.
 

JMMC

Active Member
30/11/14
330
1
18
I´m not going to point anyone as guilty, certain factories?, some dealers?, trying to sell a cheaper watch as KW or ZF. I have not enought data/info to judge. No doubt, time will bring us the answer, sooner or later.

The sad point is, at least a couple more of users (all recent purchases), have been offered one of those flawed units, after ordering an original top quality KW. I've seen, via PM, the pics, what a shame :-(

By looking/reading at the detailed post (thanks for rising the warning flag), is clear those watches are "KW-SF? hybrids" or whatever. That's not what they payed for, KW :-(((

My only doubt is the case back engravings (no matter it's a OOR engraved) do not look like the quality of the OOR KW ones, offered by some well know and reputated dealers (wich are not TD on RWI). Just compare, and see how crispy, contrasted and deep are the engravings (just lighting conditions when shooting the pic?, may be, but I do not think so)...




Personally I've been not affected by that issue, all I can do is to contribute with that home-made collage where you can easy compare all versions available, to check you have installed the right movement.

Just check the following...

- PANERAI PANERAI PANERAI pattern distribution. KW and ZF quite similar, SF completely off (it reads vertically ININ, PEPE, RARA, NANA, :laugh: ) , and...

- The hash marks above the dagger regulator, the KW are higher and the others sit lower.



 

pamdude

Known Member
19/3/15
180
3
18
Bad news :cry2:...I hope Marlin can still source the correct one for my build...
Sneaky
 

ALE7575

Section Mod
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18/1/11
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Nice jobs from undercoverz and JMMC
We will see the evolution of claims, pics frrom owners and QC pics
Anyway that produces an atmosphere of distrust from buyers. This is sad

Thanks. Rep points added for both

ALE
 

svshawn

Renowned Member
24/2/14
527
160
43
It looks like KW found a fire sale and bought out SF movements. Let's hope this stops.
 

maxnty

Active Member
15/4/14
326
0
0
I'm hopeful to hear back from Ryan or Jordan at InTime in the next few days for confirmation after they speak to KW.
 

JMMC

Active Member
30/11/14
330
1
18
I'm hopeful to hear back from Ryan or Jordan at InTime in the next few days for confirmation after they speak to KW.

I wish you good luck maxnty, you were very helpful rising the warnignflag, too.
May be there are still some "good" KW units forgotten inside someone´s drawer.

In the mean time, I'm afraid we have today another "fella" , WalkerDH, afected by those "fiddy-mutants", nice QC pics in the following link from "OOR thread" in this very forum...

https://forum.replica-watch.info/vb/showthread.php/250306-*PCTeam*-KW-PAMs-127-amp-217-Out-Of-Range-serials/page3


 

kilowattore

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Good catch guys.
We know with reps nothing should be taken for granted, but from the maker imho this is really disappointing.
It shows how careful we must be with each and every purchase.
 

maxnty

Active Member
15/4/14
326
0
0
I wish you good luck maxnty, you were very helpful rising the warnignflag, too.
May be there are still some "good" KW units forgotten inside someones drawer.

In the mean time, I'm afraid we have today another "fella" , WalkerDH, afected by those "fiddy-mutants", nice QC pics in the following link from "OOR thread" in this very forum...

https://forum.replica-watch.info/vb/showthread.php/250306-*PCTeam*-KW-PAMs-127-amp-217-Out-Of-Range-serials/page3



Thank you! Fingers crossed :)

I just read that in the other thread and it's a shame. I'm curious what kind of resolution we can come to with the dealers since we aren't getting what is advertised? Accept watch as-is and possibly a partial refund?
 

JMMC

Active Member
30/11/14
330
1
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Good catch guys.
We know with reps nothing should be taken for granted, but from the maker imho this is really disappointing.
It shows how careful we must be with each and every purchase.

Careful for sure, no doubt!!!
I can understand the frustration and feeling of distrust. By the time you receive the QC pics (of something of inferior quality) we all have already paid. So...:cry2: :-(((

Another sad point, that feeds that feeling of distrust, is that certain "names" and "fac" we trusted, are delivering those hybrids.
Let's see how the situation evolve and what are the solutions offered by dealers.
My best wishes for the affected people !!!.
 

ALE7575

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I'm hopeful to hear back from Ryan or Jordan at InTime in the next few days for confirmation after they speak to KW.

That would be really interesting !!
Thanks in advance
ALE
 

ALE7575

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Really sad situation
Those inconsistencies (to not say tricks) are really disappointing and generate a umpleasant atmosphere of distrust
Now we cannot know what we can expect from a dealer about this watch

We have to be extremely careful with the QC pics

ALE
 

Huckleberry

Getting To Know The Place
23/2/15
35
0
6
I'm not sure if my KW 127 is correct as I don't know where to find the y inablock! could someone explain where this is as I can't spot the difference from the pictures
 

WalkerDH

I'm Pretty Popular
14/7/14
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Bucharest Romania
As "announced" in the other thread.. I'm one of the one affected by this "hybrid" kW-SF Fiddy!

some of the QC pics that I got from the dealer.... Since i was expecting a 127 kw.. from a Thrusted Dealer.. I wasn't really looking on the engravings.. I double checked the cristal distortion and that the Y-incablock was there.... And got surprised that I was getting offered an OOR, but... I thought it was a lucky pick for me... Well it wasn't at the end...




 

dfgiop

Getting To Know The Place
2/6/13
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I can also confirm this problem, just got my QC, and I'm in the same boat :(
 

ALE7575

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Could be that the problem is only for OOR units??

ALE
 

JMMC

Active Member
30/11/14
330
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Could be that the problem is only for OOR units??

ALE

NO, for sure, there are also hybrids with standard serial numbers xxxx/1950. I've seen the pics. Different TD's too. The only "common factor" is "recent purchase"


However, some people asked for the "standar serial" ones and received OOR QC pics.
May be there is an stock shortage of standard case back, too. Or just a "trick" to impress customers , you know, flash effect...whoaaa I've been asigned a rare OOR :w00t:, OK QCs accepted ;-)