Movements

21j are junk...just my opinion...that's a big wish list for any watch movement...lol I personally find the Asian 2836-2 to be a fine movement and feel comfortable recommending it...there are different feelings on this some guys swear by ETA...I can tell you from working on many of these that the 2836-2 whether Asian or ETA is far better designed(stouter) then it's 2824-2 competition....

Based on your list of requirements a 21j would not fit. But you can swap the movement for a new one for less than the price of a service. I currently have 1 watch with a 21j and have had a handful in the past I haven't had any issues with them. The one I currently have does not stutter, it ticks consistently but is not as smooth as a higher beat movement. However for many vintage movements this low beat ticking is more accurate to gen.


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My own experience with the 21j was I thought at first to be POS. It gained 45 seconds on daytime use, then gain another 15 seconds at night (and that was an active day). On a lazy day, it would gain or lose 20 seconds, then lose 10 seconds or so at night. This thing was so unpredictable because it wasn't consistent all the time ... not until I read an article about watch positioning regulation. The movement has her own personality, and you should "know" her to pacify her inconsistencies.
First I regulated by moving up a notch the regulator bar to slow down her advancing nature.
It slowed down indeed to 0 seconds in 8 hours (crown up - position) => Didn't gain or lose seconds in 8 hours
Then according to the article, by lying it flat (dial up), it will gain.


This worked out perfect, because after I adjusted the regulator to slow the advance, it slowed down to -8 to -11 seconds (worn on regular days).
Then at night when I lay it flat (dial up), it would gain 9 to 10 seconds in 8 hours. So seeing the end result, you can actually conclude that she only gained or lost a second or two per day. I observed this consistently for a whole week, and it was dead on accurate (+/- 1 to 2 sec per day), and if I didn't want it to advance or lose any, I just position it crown up for the night. Works like a charm! :thumbsup:

It is a generic term. The one I have is a DG2813.


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Please advise a noob.

Is the Asian 21 jewel movement a complete waste of time or not?

Yes.

Does the second hand always stutter?

Almost always. I have only had 1 not.

All I want from a movement is that it keeps reasonable time, say +/- 30 seconds a day.

21J can do that. I have had some that kept perfect time, from WBK time.

Will last 10 years.

I mean, the movement won't cease to exist in 10 years, but no rep movement will work for 10 years on end.

Can be serviced (if you can find a watchmaker willing to do it).

Most movements can be serviced.

Or should I just forget the idea and spend more on an ETA clone?
Yes, definitely. ETA clones are OK. Miyota movements are the best.

What have been your experiences with the Asian 21jewel movement?

Nothing good whatsoever. They're throw away $30 movements.

Thanks

I have V1.5 Ploprof with 21j which is also my first watch with that movement. Seconds hand don't stutter at all and it works perfectly with pretty good power reserve. However there is a reason why this is only 21j in my collection. I'm always scared it will die, it's not high beat and I don't believe it enough to have it in a watch that I'll wear on daily basis. I knew Ploppy won't get that much wrist time although I love the watch, so I went with 21j, otherwise I always pick a clone. 2824/2836 are great movements but if you want movement to last, I would suggest you handwind 6497 or Seagull ST-19 if you don't mind winding it every two days. I love these movements and always looking forward to get a watch with it if it's possible.

I'll add my observations and what insight I can.

First, about the stutter. That's caused by the way the second hand gearing is run. It's run indirectly by gears off the main gear train. Stutter is caused by slack in the gear train and is totally variable as to the amount of slack in assembly (QC) and wear on the movement parts. It in no way affects the actual timekeeping. I truly believe that the rep market gets ALL the movements that work but don't pass the stricter QC of the movement factories. If you want one that doesn't stutter, your best bet is to buy it from a legitimate dealer such as Cousins or O'frei.

Will they last 10 years. They absolutely can last 10 years and more. Many don't and most will. It's the luck of the draw. Often the other parts of a rep will fail long before the movement.

As for servicing, they just aren't worth it. A new one is normally much less expensive than the service so what would be the point?

And 21j is just a generic term used for all non clone Chinese movements, many of which are actually 23 or 25 jewels.

And personally I would never buy another 21j other than for a vintage rep that needed the low beat movement or possibly a DG3406B GMT movement.

Ty KBH u saved me from a long reply.
Good job

Thank you Rob.

If I'm correct about the rep industry getting the movements that fail the factory QC tests, can you imagine what they are paying for them? Probably less than $5 per movement. They'd otherwise go into the dumpster.

KBH said:

Thank you Rob.

If I'm correct about the rep industry getting the movements that fail the factory QC tests, can you imagine what they are paying for them? Probably less than $5 per movement. They'd otherwise go into the dumpster.

Click to expand...

I suspect they pay a lot, lot less than $5. Look at the price of a (gen) SOKI submariner homage, you can buy a full watch wholesale, with an automatic movement for not much more delivered from China.