ZZF V2 Submariner REF 114060 vs Gen 2826 MOVEMENT (updated with user request)
Please excuse the typo in the title, I cannot edit that now....'honset' bwaaahaaa
This review is for people that keep asking the same questions and I hope it clears things up. It is evaluated with an assumed 20/20 vision or a magnifying glass. It is not evaluated under microscopic conditions where the rep would totally fall apart against a gen.
Each section receives 10 points. Full marks obviously go to the gen UNLESS there is something that is actually better on the rep in my view.
Many people wonder how close to a Gen the rep is, it will never be the same for obvious reasons. It is also not meant to be identical as it is a rep and we are not trying to sell them, or pass them off as genuine articles. We are wearing them because they are nice and remind us of something we either have and don’t want to damage, or because we just like the look of the gen but cant afford one.
For clarification, a gen is a gen, no getting around that fact. It feels different, it weighs different and is made different. There are many factors involved and this review serves only to give you a sense of owning a rep and what it feels like in real life. Furthermore it must be noted that one cannot expect to get a perfect rep from any factory, so minor flaws should be accepted to be the norm.
Sections. Max 10 points each:
SCORE: ZZF 9 GEN 10
Having both samples in hand, the ZZF does a good job on imitating the Gen. For all intent and purposes, they are difficult to tell apart on first glance even when handling them side by side or at the same time. This however changes the deeper we delve into each section. The gen is a good 5g heavier and this is attributed mainly to the fact that the Gen bracelet is 0.2mm thicker and the actual movement is heavier. 5g is not much out of 150, but with both in hand, the difference can still be felt mainly due to the fact that the gen feels top heavy. Without a reference at hand though, it would be near impossible to tell.
ZZF loses 1 point for overall fit and finish. It is, that close.
2. DIAL
SCORE: ZZF 10 GEN 10
Having a look at the dial, the ZZF does a good job for sure. Imitating the the hands dent in the center which is only visible when the light really catches it right.
Font, marker alignment, hands under normal magnification are pretty indistinguishable from the gen. Due to the fact that the Ceramic bezel is angled, only a photo from directly in the center of the watch, with no lens distortion will reveal a perfectly aligned bezel. I.e. you need to hold the watch sideways and look from the 9:00 position towards the 3:00 position to see that everything is aligned. Lume is pretty spot on now, no difference I can see in color or longevity. they both last similar throughout the night.
In my example, I could not find any distinguishing flaws on the ZZF to deduct any marks.
ZZF, no points deducted
3. CASE FRONT AND SIDES
SCORE: ZZF 9 GEN 10
The first thing I noticed is that the polishing on the gen is absolutely flawless. The rep although very good has some compound polishing marks and is sharper on the edges underneath and feels a bit unfinished compared to the gen in the hand. The brushing is pretty close though, in the same direction but not as fine as the gen. Lugs are another contentious issue and the ZZF loses a point here for the wrong radius towards the first link.
UPDATE (User request):
We can see the crown guard different shape but the crown is centered like gen. Winding out is smooth, winding is smooth and setting time is reversed of course.
ZZF looses a point for the wrong radius toward the bracelet.
ZZF looses 1 points
4. CASE REAR
SCORE: ZZF 9 GEN 10
Not going to spend to much time here and nothing much to report. SEL are well fitted and tight. Rear case back however shows that the ZZF knurling is rougher than the gen. Gen individual knurling teeth are rounded and well formed and better finished.
ZZF looses 1 point only
5. BRACELET
SCORE: ZZF 8 GEN 10
Right. Something that no one has ever discussed is the fact that the gen bracelet is 0.2mm thicker, giving it a more solid and heftier feel. In the hand it just feels solid and smooth. The gen’s individual links between the horizontal brushed and vertical polished is rounded off slightly giving it a smother feel. Brushing is near identical however. The actual construction of the bracelet between each link is spot on.
SEL in this V2 are worse than the V1 I have, which is a pity. They are not as recessed as the gen and a dead give away unfortunately. The SEL radius towards the 1[SUP]st[/SUP] link in the bracelet also suffers from the wrong radius. Link screws are not as refined as gen, but virtually not noticeable if a gen reference is not directly at hand.
ZZF looses 2 points
6. CLASP
SCORE: ZZF 10 GEN 10
In operation, the ZZF clasp feels near identical to the gen. It is crisp, solid and has a nice action. Machining is spot on as well. Under high magnification one can see that the clasp crown is not as well finished as the gen. However, it is marginal and this is not really noticeable and no points deducted for that. The glidelock functions well, just like the gen although in operation the gen is slightly smoother. Printing is slightly crisper on the gen, but not really noticeable in real life.
ZZF, no points deducted
7. REHAUT
SCORE: ZZF 8 GEN 10
The rehaut engraving, alignment of text to minute markers is pretty good compared to a gen. The font is still very close now, the laser etching is pretty gen like, the serial number font is way off however. The rehaut finishing is a a bit rougher vs the gen, but only if you know what to look for. It’s just not as slick looking overall
ZZF looses 1 point
8. BEZEL
SCORE: ZZF 9 GEN 10
Bezel action is very gen slightly less positive than the gen which feels greased. ZZF feels dry. not as slick. Click pitch is very similar. Backlash is near identical. I have noticed that the bezel teeth on the ZZF are cut deeper, making them rougher to the touch. Gen teeth are finished off better and this is the only reason ZZF looses a point
ZZF, 1 point deducted
9. BEZEL INSERT
SCORE: ZZF 9 GEN 10
The black color of the bezel insert under various lighting conditions is indistinguishable from the gen. The insert engraving however lets it down compared to the gen. Under high magnification the gen Platinum is smoothly applied. The ZZF is a bit little rougher but better than V1, if it is even platinum to begin with. The actual engraving on the gen is also a bit wider.
The ZZF looses 1 point only
10. PHYSICAL ATTRIBUTES
SCORE: ZZF 10 GEN 10
Handling both the gen and the ZZF there are some obvious and immediate differences. Fit and finish is mainly where the ZZF falls a bit flat. Its not bad at all, and only really noticeable when a ref is at hand at the same time. The actual weight, although marginal (5g) is certainly noticeable especially as it is concentrated on the case and internals. Without a gen as a ref, one would be hard pressed to tell them apart in the real world. For its sheer presence, resemblance and accuracy the ZZF looses no points.
ZZF looses 0 point
TOTALS:
TOTAL SCORE 92/100
FINAL THOUGHTS:
Although the ZZF is a rep, it does a good job of imitating the Gen on a day to day basis. It’s accurate to 10 sec a week (under my testing) and gives you some security knowing its only worth 400 Dollars as apposed to 8000. It has some obvious flaws, as do all reps for obvious reasons, and this is reflected in the price. These flaws however are only noticeable under intense scrutiny. Wearing a rep and wearing a gen gives the user 2 completely different feelings however. Then gen makes you a bit more aware of your surroundings whereas the ZZF wears a bit more blaze and carefree. For all intent and purposes, if you have never handled a gen and are wondering, then, according to this reviewer, you are 92% there with this ZZF V2 rep. The only real difference is really the fact that you know it’s not real or quite as slick as the gen.
Passers by however will be hard pressed to pinpoint the fact that its not the real deal, which might be a good or a bad thing…
Please excuse the typo in the title, I cannot edit that now....'honset' bwaaahaaa
This review is for people that keep asking the same questions and I hope it clears things up. It is evaluated with an assumed 20/20 vision or a magnifying glass. It is not evaluated under microscopic conditions where the rep would totally fall apart against a gen.
Each section receives 10 points. Full marks obviously go to the gen UNLESS there is something that is actually better on the rep in my view.
Many people wonder how close to a Gen the rep is, it will never be the same for obvious reasons. It is also not meant to be identical as it is a rep and we are not trying to sell them, or pass them off as genuine articles. We are wearing them because they are nice and remind us of something we either have and don’t want to damage, or because we just like the look of the gen but cant afford one.
For clarification, a gen is a gen, no getting around that fact. It feels different, it weighs different and is made different. There are many factors involved and this review serves only to give you a sense of owning a rep and what it feels like in real life. Furthermore it must be noted that one cannot expect to get a perfect rep from any factory, so minor flaws should be accepted to be the norm.
Sections. Max 10 points each:
- Overall look
- Dial
- Case front and sides
- Case rear
- Bracelet
- Clasp
- Rehaut
- Bezel
- Bezel insert
- Physical attributes
SCORE: ZZF 9 GEN 10
Having both samples in hand, the ZZF does a good job on imitating the Gen. For all intent and purposes, they are difficult to tell apart on first glance even when handling them side by side or at the same time. This however changes the deeper we delve into each section. The gen is a good 5g heavier and this is attributed mainly to the fact that the Gen bracelet is 0.2mm thicker and the actual movement is heavier. 5g is not much out of 150, but with both in hand, the difference can still be felt mainly due to the fact that the gen feels top heavy. Without a reference at hand though, it would be near impossible to tell.
ZZF loses 1 point for overall fit and finish. It is, that close.
2. DIAL
SCORE: ZZF 10 GEN 10
Having a look at the dial, the ZZF does a good job for sure. Imitating the the hands dent in the center which is only visible when the light really catches it right.
Font, marker alignment, hands under normal magnification are pretty indistinguishable from the gen. Due to the fact that the Ceramic bezel is angled, only a photo from directly in the center of the watch, with no lens distortion will reveal a perfectly aligned bezel. I.e. you need to hold the watch sideways and look from the 9:00 position towards the 3:00 position to see that everything is aligned. Lume is pretty spot on now, no difference I can see in color or longevity. they both last similar throughout the night.
In my example, I could not find any distinguishing flaws on the ZZF to deduct any marks.
ZZF, no points deducted
3. CASE FRONT AND SIDES
SCORE: ZZF 9 GEN 10
The first thing I noticed is that the polishing on the gen is absolutely flawless. The rep although very good has some compound polishing marks and is sharper on the edges underneath and feels a bit unfinished compared to the gen in the hand. The brushing is pretty close though, in the same direction but not as fine as the gen. Lugs are another contentious issue and the ZZF loses a point here for the wrong radius towards the first link.
UPDATE (User request):
We can see the crown guard different shape but the crown is centered like gen. Winding out is smooth, winding is smooth and setting time is reversed of course.
ZZF looses a point for the wrong radius toward the bracelet.
ZZF looses 1 points
4. CASE REAR
SCORE: ZZF 9 GEN 10
Not going to spend to much time here and nothing much to report. SEL are well fitted and tight. Rear case back however shows that the ZZF knurling is rougher than the gen. Gen individual knurling teeth are rounded and well formed and better finished.
ZZF looses 1 point only
5. BRACELET
SCORE: ZZF 8 GEN 10
Right. Something that no one has ever discussed is the fact that the gen bracelet is 0.2mm thicker, giving it a more solid and heftier feel. In the hand it just feels solid and smooth. The gen’s individual links between the horizontal brushed and vertical polished is rounded off slightly giving it a smother feel. Brushing is near identical however. The actual construction of the bracelet between each link is spot on.
SEL in this V2 are worse than the V1 I have, which is a pity. They are not as recessed as the gen and a dead give away unfortunately. The SEL radius towards the 1[SUP]st[/SUP] link in the bracelet also suffers from the wrong radius. Link screws are not as refined as gen, but virtually not noticeable if a gen reference is not directly at hand.
ZZF looses 2 points
6. CLASP
SCORE: ZZF 10 GEN 10
In operation, the ZZF clasp feels near identical to the gen. It is crisp, solid and has a nice action. Machining is spot on as well. Under high magnification one can see that the clasp crown is not as well finished as the gen. However, it is marginal and this is not really noticeable and no points deducted for that. The glidelock functions well, just like the gen although in operation the gen is slightly smoother. Printing is slightly crisper on the gen, but not really noticeable in real life.
ZZF, no points deducted
7. REHAUT
SCORE: ZZF 8 GEN 10
The rehaut engraving, alignment of text to minute markers is pretty good compared to a gen. The font is still very close now, the laser etching is pretty gen like, the serial number font is way off however. The rehaut finishing is a a bit rougher vs the gen, but only if you know what to look for. It’s just not as slick looking overall
ZZF looses 1 point
8. BEZEL
SCORE: ZZF 9 GEN 10
Bezel action is very gen slightly less positive than the gen which feels greased. ZZF feels dry. not as slick. Click pitch is very similar. Backlash is near identical. I have noticed that the bezel teeth on the ZZF are cut deeper, making them rougher to the touch. Gen teeth are finished off better and this is the only reason ZZF looses a point
ZZF, 1 point deducted
9. BEZEL INSERT
SCORE: ZZF 9 GEN 10
The black color of the bezel insert under various lighting conditions is indistinguishable from the gen. The insert engraving however lets it down compared to the gen. Under high magnification the gen Platinum is smoothly applied. The ZZF is a bit little rougher but better than V1, if it is even platinum to begin with. The actual engraving on the gen is also a bit wider.
The ZZF looses 1 point only
10. PHYSICAL ATTRIBUTES
SCORE: ZZF 10 GEN 10
Handling both the gen and the ZZF there are some obvious and immediate differences. Fit and finish is mainly where the ZZF falls a bit flat. Its not bad at all, and only really noticeable when a ref is at hand at the same time. The actual weight, although marginal (5g) is certainly noticeable especially as it is concentrated on the case and internals. Without a gen as a ref, one would be hard pressed to tell them apart in the real world. For its sheer presence, resemblance and accuracy the ZZF looses no points.
ZZF looses 0 point
TOTALS:
- OVERALL LOOK: 9/10
- DIAL: 10/10
- CASE FRONT: 9/10
- CASE REAR: 9/10
- BRACELET: 8/10
- CLASP: 10/10
- REHAUT: 9/10
- BEZEL: 9/10
- BEZEL INSERT: 9/10
- PHYSICAL ATTRIBUTES: 10/10
TOTAL SCORE 92/100
FINAL THOUGHTS:
Although the ZZF is a rep, it does a good job of imitating the Gen on a day to day basis. It’s accurate to 10 sec a week (under my testing) and gives you some security knowing its only worth 400 Dollars as apposed to 8000. It has some obvious flaws, as do all reps for obvious reasons, and this is reflected in the price. These flaws however are only noticeable under intense scrutiny. Wearing a rep and wearing a gen gives the user 2 completely different feelings however. Then gen makes you a bit more aware of your surroundings whereas the ZZF wears a bit more blaze and carefree. For all intent and purposes, if you have never handled a gen and are wondering, then, according to this reviewer, you are 92% there with this ZZF V2 rep. The only real difference is really the fact that you know it’s not real or quite as slick as the gen.
Passers by however will be hard pressed to pinpoint the fact that its not the real deal, which might be a good or a bad thing…
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