Legit Check Request on Rolex 1603 with Service Dial and Hands - in hand photos available

[sukwonee]

I just purchased this beautiful vintage 1603 from a reputable dealer. I was originally told that all parts were original but upon inspection in hand, the lume, dial, and hands just seemed too "new" for a watch from the 60s. Serial suggests this is from 1966.

I think this has superluminova lume plots on the dial and hands. Also the hands look brand new.

I have some experience with vintage Rolex and the dial and hands look like genuine Rolex part to me. Never seen reps like this. I talked to the seller again and he confirmed that the hands and dial were service parts and he thinks they were from the mid to late 70s with matte dial and "T Swiss Made T" text.

What I am wondering is if anyone could help me authenticate the bracelet, datewheel (which seems to be a bit of silver sheen to it), and acrylic crystal.

Also if anyone knows what Rolex currently does for service parts on vintage watches? It is very odd that service parts from the 70s would have what appears to be superluminova lume.

The seller is offering me some money back for his mistakes but before I accept it, I want to see I can find out more about what could have happened to the watch and if the rest of the watch is authentic.

Cheers! Thank you so much in advance

 

[flashu]

The DW shouldn't have open 6 and 9?

 

[sukwonee]

The DW shouldn't have open 6 and 9?

So I have looked through several 1603 samples from the 60s and those did not have open 6 and 9. There were some open 6 and 9s in the 70s samples. I could be wrong.

 

[Tucker]

So I have looked through several 1603 samples from the 60s and those did not have open 6 and 9. There were some open 6 and 9s in the 70s samples. I could be wrong.

tripdog can help, but he's rather expensive.

I have a 1960s Oyster, pre-datejust watch and I have no lume on the dial or hands. In fact, the lume material on the hands is deteriorating.

 

[Itto]

Appearantly, there were some Tritium marked dials in the transitional period where Luminova was used.
(Source: trf)

BUT, i would be cautious.. i mean, this whole money back thing sounds like someone got cought and is trying to weasel his way out of that situation. My 2 cents, for what it's worth.

 

[sukwonee]

tripdog can help, but he's rather expensive.

I have a 1960s Oyster, pre-datejust watch and I have no lume on the dial or hands. In fact, the lume material on the hands is deteriorating.

It would be an honor if Tripdog could chime in haha.

Yeah I have a few 5 digit genuine T dials with little to no lume and they don't glow quite like the one I got today. Even my 1991 Speedy has almost no lume left and the the markers turned brown from deterioration over the years.

I am pretty certain (and the seller also agrees) the dial and hands were replaced with service parts from Rolex. The fact that the dial has "T Swiss Made T" text on it makes me think that maybe the lumes could have been relumed.

 

[sukwonee]

Appearantly, there were some Tritium marked dials in the transitional period where Luminova was used.
(Source: trf)

BUT, i would be cautious.. i mean, this whole money back thing sounds like someone got cought and is trying to weasel his way out of that situation. My 2 cents, for what it's worth.

oh word. Thanks for this information. I assume this "transition period" would have been early 90s then (not mid 70s as the seller thinks). Let me look up more info via TRF.

Yes the seller admitted he messed up. He mentioned that him and his supplier had a miscommunication (and the watch did come from another state - directly from his supplier - than where the seller is located).

 

[sukwonee]

One last thing to add is -

I paid $4650 for this watch which I thought was a great deal thinking all parts were original to the 60s.

The seller is offering 200 dollars back for it having service dial and hands.

I am not out here to take advantage of the situation and I really like the watch (if I didn't, it would be much easier for me to just ask for a refund).

Do you guys think $4450 (all costs inclusive including sales tax, shipping, 6 month warranty from the seller) is reasonable?

Thanks again.

 

[tripdog]

It looks all genuine to me, the bracelet is a Mexican rolled link jubilee with a Big Coronet clasp which is fairly rare. The case, crown, bezel and crystal are all in very good condition, the crystal is probably a replacement part as they don't hold up well to scuffs and scratches.
The dial and hands probably date from the mid '90's, no earlier.
$200 refund is a little on the low side - tritium DJ dials are plentiful on eBay and are not considered rare or valuable, original period DJ hands aren't really worth much unless they're in excellent condition which is rarely the case.
I'd ask him for $300 refund - item is not as described and this is entirely down to his lack of knowledge of vintage Rolex. He should be falling over himself to put it right considering he can't tell the difference between tritium lume and Superluminova.

 

[sukwonee]

It looks all genuine to me, the bracelet is a Mexican rolled link jubilee with a Big Coronet clasp which is fairly rare. The case, crown, bezel and crystal are all in very good condition, the crystal is probably a replacement part as they don't hold up well to scuffs and scratches.
The dial and hands probably date from the mid '90's, no earlier.
$200 refund is a little on the low side - tritium DJ dials are plentiful on eBay and are not considered rare or valuable, original period DJ hands aren't really worth much unless they're in excellent condition which is rarely the case.
I'd ask him for $300 refund - item is not as described and this is entirely down to his lack of knowledge of vintage Rolex. He should be falling over himself to put it right considering he can't tell the difference between tritium lume and Superluminova.

You're amazing. Thank you so much.

Seller offered me 350 and I took it.