At what point is a rep no longer a rep?

[suited]

I work on armoured vehicles, and the vehicles we have are from the 1960s. So pretty much every part of them has been replaced. We just had a new lad join our unit and I was giving him the usual spiel about how these vehicles are ancient and were due an upgrade any time soon. I told him that these bad boys were from the 60s. He then asked me whether they’ve had parts replaced since then. I told him that pretty much every part has been replaced at this point with new parts from the 90’s - 2010. He then said that these aren’t really from the 60s if every part has been replaced. What was just a throwaway comment by him really got me thinking. I then realised it was the ship of Theseus paradox that I was thinking of.

This got me thinking to watches and I’ve seen some of the awesome projects you guys have gotten up to. I was wondering, firstly, is it possible that you can buy a rep watch and replace every single part with a gen part? Of course it would be pretty nonsensical to do this as you could just buy the gen watch. But I suppose in theory it must be possible. And if all pieces of the replica watch are replaced gen parts, is it still considered a rep/Franken? Or does it then become a gen piece?

Just some ramblings of a man that’s had a bit too much whiskey! Have a good night folks and best of luck with whatever you’ve got planned this week.

 

[eBoy]

 

[altspacen]

Sounds like the Theseus' paradox. Is it the same object or isn’t it. Good bit of discussion there.

As far as a rep goes - once it’s been entirely replaced with gen parts it’s technically a gen watch with mismatched serial components. Like mechanics car that was all put together in parts but has no title so good luck getting it accepted as what it is.

 

[Vincini]

I’ve seen a i think Daytona Replica in the Sales Section that was not really a Rep because all parts of it are Gen and tought the same. I mean if everything is gen but build of parts from different serial number so Diffrent watches but gen of the same model in my opinion it is an Gen but also an Franken.

 

[Alan Bourdillion Traherne]

I think Schrodinger's cat was on Theseus' boat. Besides, why is there air?

 

[ExtraExtra]

Theseus' paradox or Franken...they're the same.

 

[thefallacy]

I’ve seen a i think Daytona Replica in the Sales Section that was not really a Rep because all parts of it are Gen and tought the same. I mean if everything is gen but build of parts from different serial number so Diffrent watches but gen of the same model in my opinion it is an Gen but also an Franken.

Genuine franken!

 

[Alan Bourdillion Traherne]

Theseus' paradox or Franken...they're the same.

Al Franken? Yeah, he's a paradox alright.

 

[Teamjlf]

A fake watch is designed to fool the observer and not the wise wearer…. Regardless of how many parts have been replaced. As soon as it starts to fool the wearer then he/ she becomes the fool in his/ her own delusions.

“The fool who knows his foolishness, is wise at least so far. But a fool who thinks himself wise, he is called a fool indeed.”

 

[daytona4me]

Me personally, I think when you stop making it try to be as genuine as possible. For example, back in 2007, I had @hontwatch go to the factory rep and put a white dial pam 113 and 114 in pvd cases. I wanted my design, not the closest thing to the gen. It's easily argued that is still a rep and I respect, but I stopped pursuing the most accurate and started pursuing what I desired.
A couple years ago I asked @occb2 make me a submariner with a green ceramic bezel out if some spare parts. I honestly don't remember exactly what parts he used for it but I love it!

Hope you can follow my ramblings, just my $0.02

 

[APjumbo]

If it is a seiko it’s never a fake
Because it’s just a modified seiko.
Unless it’s an AliExpress homage with a genuine seiko movement, then it’s fake.

If it’s a Rolex, everyone gets bent out of shape.
If a person explains their rep rolex that is mostly gen is not a rep then they are just trying to “justify it”

But if someone on a gen rolex forum replaces the dial and bezel and insert and gaskets with aftermarket parts they saw on instagram then it’s not a rep.

I don’t know why, it’s just the way it is.

If you take a gen rolex and replace the movement then it’s still probably fine.
But if you put a gen movement and gen dial into a rep case it’s a rep

And if it’s all gen, except a rep case, but you post a picture of it on a rep forum then it’s a rep.

I wil never understand it.
I think it mostly depends whom you bought it from and which forum you visit most.

 

[RunningFast]

It really depends on who you ask. Like APjumbo stated, Rolex is kinda funny in this respect. RSC flips out if you changed anything. Rolex is the only brand I can think of where customizing a timepiece makes some people believe it is a rep now. I personally don't think so, but draw your own lines on this one and be prepared to back it up.

 

[W47chl0v3r]

Genuine watch is by definition a watch with pedigree and all original parts or service parts. Genstein is the word you are looking for, which on this forum and others, are watches comprised of all genuine parts but are still not genuine articles. If one part is fake it’s fake, anyone saying otherwise is fooling themselves. People make full gold Genuine movement watches worth 20k or more that are still fake by definition. Fake or genuine wear what you want how you want.