A Rolex 6538 prototype learns how to fly

[matzemedia]

It was a good 2 years ago, that I decided to build an early Submariner. I am a big Tudor Black Bay fan. And tried some homages from AliExpress and tiger-concept. Anyone who has studied this watch will know that its origins date back to the 1960s, when Rolex and Tudor sold the Submariner without a crown guard.


Source: ROLEX SUBMARINER STORY 2010 from Gino Balbi

So a Rolex 6358 had to be added to the collection. As an original, this watch is often traded at over 50,000$ and is not affordable for me. As I like to build watches, I decided in a Silix case with a Raffaildial dial and ETA movement.
This build isn't one of my favourite achievements. The dial was too pale, and I made too many changes to the case. A watch that rarely made it onto my wrist.

Here two pictures of the first try:

 

[Hec]

For me it's not bad, although I would try to do several things.

I would try to make the markers stand out more, as in the "original" there is a predominance of those yellows that stand out.

I also think that the handset are very well incorporated with the markers, I'm a novice but I'm sure they can help you here.

 

[matzemedia]

As an observer of the thread "The Official Big Crown Club", I always get big eyes. Some treasures are hidden there. And that's how I came across the dials from the "Post your gilt dialled watches here!" thread. It's a technique that I am still studying and that I really like. So this autumn I decided to try another "Big Crown" project.


Build and source: Bart Cordell

Point of clarification
As I write these lines, I am already holding something similar to a reference 6538 in my hands. I'll be taking you on my journey with the project over the next few weeks in this thread - about the challenging results and my opinion of the outcome. It's also worth mentioning at this point that I wouldn't have got here without the help of this forum. Either through contributions or the exchange with other users. I will mention some of them in the course of my posts.

 

[matzemedia]

The dial
As already mentioned, I have no experience with the creation of gilt dials. At the website of rolexheaven there is a very nice image that explain the different layer of a true gilt dial.


Source: Rolexheaven Submariner 6536/8

And since you always look at the dial, it has to be perfect. I've seen in various threads that @manodeoro has used really nice dials. And so, for the first time in my projects, I ordered a component directly from this forum. @manodeoro has not only become an artist, he also was a very helpful advisor in this project. I was able to share my ideas with various PMs and get his advice. The result is impressive. In the style of the Bond watch from the film Goldfinger as a two-liner with chapter ring.

Dial and hands before lume:



Relumed dial and hands in egg colour:

 

[chrome72]

Is silix even around anymore?

 

[369mafia]

Is silix even around anymore?

no, dont think so

 

[chrome72]

Didn’t think so. It’s a shame. Liked her cases and prices.

no, dont think so

 

[Winni1611]

Watching...

 

[alligoat]

I've got the Silix case and the Helenarou dial. Even bought the Athaya 8mm crown, stem extension and tap, but can't find them now.
So I'm watching!
BTW, I haven't had any luck trying to get into Silix lately. I might have bought these parts 3-4 yrs ago.

 

[matzemedia]

I've got the Silix case and the Helenarou dial. Even bought the Athaya 8mm crown, stem extension and tap, but can't find them now.
So I'm watching!
BTW, I haven't had any luck trying to get into Silix lately. I might have bought these parts 3-4 yrs ago.

You have to search. Especially if your Silix is an older version, the crown sits more in the centre.

 

[matzemedia]

The hands
Check out the pics, and you'll see I went for gold-like minute and hour hands, paired with a snazzy white Lollipop second hand. The Lollipop second hand, courtesy of the skilled folks at Slay in the forum, comes with an extra-large luminous circle. I snagged the hands from my original setup.


Now, when you're putting together a clock with a chapter ring, nailing the hand length is key. You want those second and minute hands to be on point, perfectly lining up with the chapter ring.

 

[matzemedia]

The case
Unfortunately, it's not so easy to get a true-to-scale case for a fair price. That was probably different a few years ago when Silix, HR and Tonny each had a case. Tonny's case in particular must have been the closest to the original. Today, only Rafflesdials and MQ still have a case for sale. The cases fit more to the Ref. 5508 instead of the Ref. 6538.
Most cases have a lot of weaknesses. Here just a few of them:
1. the glass is glued in and is not pressed through the retaining ring
2. they are too big
3. the crown is not in the centre

So now that I have to accept that there is no affordable case for me to buy, I have to think of something else. So why not build a case from a newer Submariner with a crown guard? I found an AliExpress case in diameter 39 in my box of leftovers. A good basis for a prototype and an attempt to improve things.

So first I disassembled everything and put my Silix bezel on it. With some metal work the bezel fits. The wire that should hold the bezel to the case is not doing his job anymore. I will deal with this later.

What you also can see at the lathe art picture; I reduced the high of the midcase to 4.8 mm.

 

[Andy83n]

Love this thread

 

[matzemedia]

Removing the crown guard
Time to removed the crown guard: metal work at its best. I'am using a bench grinder and a file. Feels more like working on a rusty car instead of a small watch.



At first glance, it already looks like a 6538 case, doesn't it?

 

[matzemedia]

The Horns
You can already see from the pictures that I have done a lot of work on the horns. Perhaps even too much. I've removed a lot of the height in particular. But this is necessary to turn the thick Aliexpress case into a slimmer Rolex midcase.



The crown
There is something special here. Apart from the fact that the crown has a diameter of 8mm, the tube is also larger than on modern watches. In the aftermarket sector, there is one manufacturer that offers this crown with the large tube: Athaya. In order to mount the tube, a larger thread must be cut into the case. M4 x 0.35. That looks really big and now you realise that the tube is out of the middle.



Here a first look with a big crystal and the caseback from Silix: Still with a very rough surface


As you can see the crown is still not 100% in the middle of the case.

 

[DeLoMan]

The Horns
You can already see from the pictures that I have done a lot of work on the horns. Perhaps even too much. I've removed a lot of the height in particular. But this is necessary to turn the thick Aliexpress case into a slimmer Rolex midcase.



The crown
There is something special here. Apart from the fact that the crown has a diameter of 8mm, the tube is also larger than on modern watches. In the aftermarket sector, there is one manufacturer that offers this crown with the large tube: Athaya. In order to mount the tube, a larger thread must be cut into the case. M4 x 0.35. That looks really big and now you realise that the tube is out of the middle.



Here a first look with a big crystal and the caseback from Silix: Still with a very rough surface


As you can see the crown is still not 100% in the middle of the case.

Great work so far!

 

[matzemedia]

The Bezel
The original bezel of the reference 6538 from Rolex is made of nickel-plated brass and has a diameter of 38mm. Unlike modern Rolex bezels, the outer bezel is knurled.
This means that the bezel from my Aliexpress Submariner does not fit.
I still had the bezel from the Silix case. But the outer diameter of the case is too small for the bezel. I was able to compensate for this with a small tube that I machined and glued to the case opening. Now the wire can hold the bezel.

The REP cases, using a simple wire to hold the bezel, have a different system than a gen bezel. At the scribble you can see at the right a GEN and at the left a custom retaining ring that holds the REP bezel.



Here you can see how I solved it at my current 6538 case. A ring with a small slot:

 

[matzemedia]

The 6538 comes with a plexiglass dial with an outer diameter of 305mm - that is like Tropic 19 crystal (e.g. star cross XS305451). To fit this I had to widen the opening a little. The result of the prototype.

 

[matzemedia]

Polishing
After drilling out the horns to 1.3 mm and making a few adjustments to the lug, it is now time for polishing. I did this with 280, 400, 600, 1000 and 3000 grit sandpaper and the polishing block.

In the end, a prototype became an acceptable case.

 

[369mafia]

Excellent progress!!

Interesting solution to solving the bezel issue. Nice work!!