Swatch Swiss ETA 2842 vs Swiss ETA 2824-2

[Ominx2]

I apologize in advance if this has been addressed already but I wasn't able to find any information. I am posting this in the general thread since it is more a question of movements rather than brand, but if a mod wants to move it feel free.

I'm looking at two watches (IWC Mark XV & XVI) and the description of one the movements is confusing to me.

They are both listed as "Swiss ETA" and besides the difference of 2842 vs 2824, one has the added description of "nickel plated original Swatch movement". Does this mean that movement is guaranteed to be an authentic Swiss? Since the other "Swiss ETA" is most likely just an Asian clone, is it recommended to go for the Swatch movement? Can the Swatch movement turn out to be an Asian clone?

Here are links to both watches:
Swatch Swiss ETA 2842: http://www.puretimewatch.com/product/mark-xv-black-on-leather-strap-eta-2842/
Swiss ETA ETA 2824: http://www.hontwatch.com/productdetails_2397.html

I do not have a preference between the Mark XV and XVI and because they are essentially the same price, I am trying to pick the one with the better movement. Not that I plan on swimming with either watch, but I have read the Swatch movement has better water resistance which leads me to believe it has better construction with less loose parts... is there any truth to this?

If anyone has any insight or recommendations I would greatly appreciate it. I have not had the best of luck with reps in the past (a defective navitimer years ago and more recently a defective noobmariner) so I would really like to try to get the most reliable movement with the best QC.

Thanks for any help.

 

[rol_man]

I'll answer as best I can... First of all, the Swatch or ETA 284X movements to my understanding are the economy models to the 2836 and 2824 ETA movements. It appears the rep manufacturers are finding New Old Stock (NOS) or rebuilt stock of these old movements and are now showing up in rep watches. They also run at a lower vph (21,600 vph although not always true) vs. 28,800 vph of the 2836/2824 (28,800 gives a smoother second hand sweep). If I were to choose, I would go with the 2824 model even though it may be the asian clone. These are proving to be more reliable as time goes by and can be serviced/repaired because these also take some of the genuine ETA parts.

By the way, no movement is water resistant! If you are asking about the watch itself, it is best to have water resistance tested by a watchsmith that is rep friendly. This will ensure seals are properly greased and everything is good to go. You can search for other posts on this forum addressing water resistance.

Hope this helped and happy repping!

 

[tommy_boy]

Well, Swatch owns the company that makes the movements that these dealers claim they are made by: ETA.

One is decorated, the other isn't. If you have reason to doubt that one is a fake and one is not, and a real "Swiss made" movement is what you want to buy, simply pick one.

I am skeptical by nature, so the Swatch signed rotor doesn't mean anything to me.

Both are trusted dealers here. If I were you, I'd but the watch that has the dial and strap that you like to look at.

You will probably not spend too much time staring at the movement, after all.

 

[Ominx2]

Thanks for the insight. As a noob it's hard to read between the lines and know exactly what one might end up getting. I share the same skepticism which is why came to you guys. I thought the 2842 Swatch movement might be better since it was most likely guaranteed to Swiss but it seems the 2824 Asian clone may be the better choice.

I've learned there are a bunch of risks with this hobby, but I appreciate the help of the community in finding trusted dealers out there that will help when a problem arises.

 

[the Man in Black]

the 284x models are made by ETA in Asia and in fact the 284X series is used in swatch watches so this rotor stamping is correct.

21 jewel 1990-2006 unfinished, low grade ETA:

2846 21.6k till 2006 (21j)

2840 21.6k semi-skeleton 21j-23j 1991-present

2841(skeleton) 21.6k 1990s-present

2842 21.6k till 90s

all are low grade movements and have plastic friction parts where as higher eco models like the 2836/2824 dont. but even the gold plated 2836 movements w/novodiac are produced in China, which is why i only buy the nickle with incabloc.

just because the picture shows a swatch movement does not necessarily mean you'll receive that movement, more likely an unbranded 2846.

last word of advice, avoid the ETA clones, I have many clone movements rotting in my parts bin. get the 284X, have it serviced AND regulated, plastic parts and all. with out regulation the 284X typically runs about +10-15secs/day

 

[Ominx2]

Thanks for the breakdown. I actually decided on a different watch but appreciate the education and advice. It's interesting that you advised against ETA clones. I haven't had good luck with the one I purchased but it seems they are typically recommended around here versus the A21j. I suppose it's because most "swiss" movements are in fact clones and not worth the premium and the A21j is too slow for some pieces.

 

[paulvillo]

This is really good info!
Been trying to find enough info to either replace the high beat A2824-2 on my AP a Diver v5.1 for a 2842 from an old Swatch resting in my drawers, or should I attemp the low beat mod using parts from the Swatch movement? Any ideas will be very appreciated

 

[Lindt]

Replace it to 2842 if you are high beat maniac

Regards

 

[Thrasher]

If it says swiss its more than likely is rebuilt/refurbished used swiss junk and you pay more (CRAZY). The only new swiss movement i trust to be real and new is from BK, otherwise buy Asian its new and it will work, if it craps out on you buy a new swiss movement 2824 or 2836 from Otto Frei, dont trust a watch maker, get your own movement and have it installed. my 2 cents.. the issue of the swiss movement has been addressed for years here.

 

[Strodda]

Just because you buy an Asian movement, doesn't mean you get a new and properly assembled movement. Most, if not all, Asian movements I have serviced were either dirty or bone dry.

 

[Thrasher]

Well you pay less for asian movements and out of the 24 rep watches I own all the movements that have failed have been swiss costing more, none of the asians have failed

 

[SUMIKITO]

This is an old thread here, but worth a post regarding Swiss ETA movements and the Chinese made Clones of the same movements. Some indeed admitting to be clones, and some saying they are 'Swiss' when in fact they are 'Replicas' of a Swiss movement. Yes !! A 100% replica in and out ! But there is still hope, and a good chance to get a good Replica which in all likelihood carries a Genuine Swiss Made ETA movement in it. Hmmm....... ?? So how do you find that watch ? Well, you cant be picky. You cant be 'trendy'. You cant be "what's the latest" out there kinda of guy. you go and pick out a watch that has been in the 'line-up' for a good number of years. A 'sleeper' model. One which is 'out of favor' today. A languishing model, so to speak. A model that was 'the one to have' years ago. A plain Jane model. But still a 'classic'. A good number of them are something like a Rolex DJ, DD, [in 36mm only without a rehaut engraving] Air-Kings, older Explorer II's, The early GMT II's, and so on. This are now out of favor. And languish in a factories/representatives/dealers inventory. NOS. And if made with an ETA Swiss movement then, still have that Genuine Swiss ETA inside them. They are the "I am glad this dork will finally buy this damn watch" kind of thing. I have had good luck finding some great buys in these watches, just to rest easy that it has a Swiss movement inside them. And a new movement at that !! ......... some of you guys would likely share my own thoughts about these 'finds'. And know well about what I speak of. I call them yesterdays ramp models who became nuns. And are still in the monastery waiting to be discovered. So, go ahead and hunt them down. If you have the 'knack' for something like this, "There is still some gold in them thaaar hills" !!

 

[paulvillo]

Replace it to 2842 if you are high beat maniac Regards

You mean low-beat maniac, right?

 

[paulvillo]

If it says swiss its more than likely is rebuilt/refurbished used swiss junk and you pay more (CRAZY). The only new swiss movement i trust to be real and new is from BK, otherwise buy Asian its new and it will work, if it craps out on you buy a new swiss movement 2824 or 2836 from Otto Frei, dont trust a watch maker, get your own movement and have it installed. my 2 cents.. the issue of the swiss movement has been addressed for years here.

Just because you buy an Asian movement, doesn't mean you get a new and properly assembled movement. Most, if not all, Asian movements I have serviced were either dirty or bone dry.

This is an old thread here, but worth a post regarding Swiss ETA movements and the Chinese made Clones of the same movements. Some indeed admitting to be clones, and some saying they are 'Swiss' when in fact they are 'Replicas' of a Swiss movement. Yes !! A 100% replica in and out ! But there is still hope, and a good chance to get a good Replica which in all likelihood carries a Genuine Swiss Made ETA movement in it. Hmmm....... ??

Guys, I own both the AP Diver Asian 2824-2 and an actual old Swatch I don't wear anymore with the NO-DATE Swiss 2842 @ 21,600

My actual questioning when reviving this thread was to know if it's worth or even possible to replace the Asian @28,800 for the Swiss @21,600

I found THIS thread regarding the low beat mod using the balance wheel, escape wheel and pallet fork from ETA 2846 to 2824-2 and was wondering if such mod would be possible using 2842 parts as well?

Cheers

 

[Strodda]

Ive never modded a 28xx movement, so I cant speak from experience. But Im assuming all movements work in the same basic manner, meaning you cant just swap in a different balance assembly and pallet fork to adjust the beat properly. For instance, the difference between low and high beat 6497-1/-2 is everything. The entire gear train, barrel to balance is different. This is because even if you are able to slow the movement down to 6bps, the teeth in the gear train are made for 8bps, meaning the watch will run slow now... since the teeth will now only advance 6 spaces every second, instead of the 8 they were made for.


If you want to remove the 2824-2/2836/etc and swap in a lowbeat Swiss 2824, you should be able to do that as the hands are compatible from what I have been told.

 

[paulvillo]

Ive never modded a 28xx movement, so I cant speak(...)
If you want to remove the 2824-2/2836/etc and swap in a lowbeat Swiss 2824, you should be able to do that as the hands are compatible from what I have been told.

Thanks for the thorough explanation Strodda.
I have very little experience fiddling with movements.
I've seen a fair amount of hype about the "low beat mod" that would bring the sweep closer to gen APs.

And since I have this 1994 Swatch sitting in my drawers with an ETA 2842 inside I thought I'd start a quest to give it a try.

The Swatch is a NO-DATE model whereas the AP Diver obviously has a date window.
Below you can see my actual Swatch for reference.

Thanks once again!

 

[Strodda]

First look under the swatch dial, if all the parts aren't there for the datewheel function, you won't be able to do the mod. I don't believe the parts are interchangeable. I just completed a swap from a swiss 2824 back to a -2 movement. Parts within the keyless were broken and they were not swappable. So if your swatch movement does not already have all the necessary parts for the DW, you might be out of luck.

 

[chris3007]

Maybe that help you

http://forum.replica-watch.info/vb/showthread.php?t=251050


Sent from my iPhone 6

 

[paulvillo]

First look under the swatch dial, if all the parts aren't there for the datewheel function, you won't be able to do the mod. I don't believe the parts are interchangeable. I just completed a swap from a swiss 2824 back to a -2 movement. Parts within the keyless were broken and they were not swappable. So if your swatch movement does not already have all the necessary parts for the DW, you might be out of luck.

Thanks again Strodda! I'm mainly on Tapatalk and somehow I missed your post.

I will check later and post a pic as well since its an skeleton dial sort of speak

I found THIS thread here where you'd accomplish the mod by replacing just the balance wheel, escape wheel and pallet fork.
One could change the balance wheel and spring only rather than the whole balance cock, so you would retain the timing adjustment screw.

 

[paulvillo]

Maybe that help you

http://forum.replica-watch.info/vb/showthread.php?t=251050


Sent from my iPhone 6

Amazing Chris! PM'd you Thanks!