OK want to start a controversial subject, and I know Im going to get flammed over it..... but

[English Gent]

I've owned around 400 replicas, some very high end, I've sold most and have a hand full left a vintage built explorer and a Tudor Black bay red smiley face version. (I've owned 3 gens of this, but pointless when the rep is so close and doesn't get much wrist time


anyway, I read a lot about people on here not wanting to own a fake Rolex to show of, but because its a classic design. so that got me thinking. what about brands that do a VERY good job on homages, Like Ginault which we know was TC, my Ocean Rover is light years ahead of any Rolex rep, other homages haven't interested me as I'm not a huge Rolex fan being a gen collector, and now Rolex has officially become a fashion brand. I have no interest at all. but some of there designs are iconic


so to my point, after watching far too many watch youtube channels I decided to pick up a PAGANI DESIGN 2020 Stainless Steel GMT Watch in reb and black.. for £67 including shipping (took 5 days to UK)

I was expecting it to be a POS.

man was I in for a surprise, this watch is 85% as good as any expensive Rolex rep at a fraction of the cost. seriously, the bezel even has ceramic markers, the hands are better than the flat ones you get on half the factories, dial work is on point. Cyclops does what it does at extra magnification, remember this isn't a copy, but a very close homage, the bracelet is fine, especially after ultrasound bath and cape cod, the bracelet adjustment system is not as good as Rolex’s but still fine. also, it looks better than most, (I'm getting a Jubilee bracelet for it.)

The bezel is fine, and clicks into place centred over the 12, Dial print as any good rep, Rolex reps still don't get the 3d print effect, which to me and person owning it are biggest tells. I have no idea about the movement, but I've spent more money on a fine Diplimatico rum cocktail

So after a long rant, I have to ask the question, if you like the Rolex design, why not get a high quality ‘homage’ and save your pennies for real Rolex. the amount of frankens I see on here is daft, it will never be a Rolex unless made by Rolex… and has serial

As I mentioned in another thread, I’ve had 3 TC 6’s and would never wear them out, I'm a collector and so are my friends, I would be laughed at, not for the fake, but the Rolex…. so I sort of like the idea of a watch that looks like “Rolex like’ watch but without all that nasty baggage. and let's be honest here, most people don't buy £600 Rolex reps to admire the classic design… I think some people Like the flex. or surely they would go for the lovely other watches you can buy for half the price. there's JLC complications going for less than the NOOB V1984 Daytona. half the price of a Rolex Sub that people love, not realising in real life, the white gold surrounds to the indices and the hand's curve, give it away from miles, plus kids running around in daddies car ‘flexing’ might get you one lay, but she won't be happy when she wakes up in the parent's basement.

anyway some pics of PAGANI DESIGN, this watch cost £67, free delivery, Ill let that sink in

And no I dont work for them, just a watch collector for 30 plus years thats had over 1000 watches.


and I buy and sell watches and parts as a part time business.

Please, plolite converstaion. im just pointing out facts.

 

[English Gent]

PS these are 40mm not the 43mm there where selling

 

[k4jun]

Don't see any particular reason to flame you, but thb I think you got it wrong at the very early beginning..
Most people does want to own an accurate fake/franken Rolex to show of.

 

[English Gent]

Don't see any particular reason to flame you, but thb I think you got it wrong at the very early beginning..
Most people does want to own an accurate fake/franken Rolex to show of.

Why not buy gen then... instead of an illegal replica. let's be honest, look at how many watches get sold here and I get EVERY TD, it will be a Rolex, there a fashion brand that most serious watch collectors see as mid-tier watch, I'm willing to bet 85-90% of them sold are for flexing. as a JLC wouldn't do the job.

Also, they are easy to replicate, such simple design, even Rolex when they did the 6 series only added a maxi case so it looks bigger and a load of ways it can't be replicated, Lazer etched crown at 6 and Renault etc. all design decisions to stop fakers, well that didn't go well.

Rolex hasn't brought a watch to market that has complications (maybe Skydweller) and far behind the real watchmakers, thank god for there sister brand Tudor.

Rolex is a fashion brand now, no doubt about it, their latest oyster precision, now in FORTY ONE mm, has to be the worst decision ever, but I get a feeling it's cheap for Rolex, and the buyer gets bigger Rolex logo...

 

[k4jun]

Well, not everyone can afford gen, those who can - does not necessary want to wait or are not willing to pay premium on the greymarket.

This is the same stuff like in luxury fragrance, knives, shoes or bags - there are people ready to pay gen price for gen quality and there are people who are happy to show of with just the logo (on reps).

I do understand the idea of homage products, but those will alway have a small part of the pie/market. Homages do not offer "the brand" and after all many of us are here cause in past we've been attracted by the brand. The big idea behind the luxury products is exclusivity, homages do not deliver it.

 

[English Gent]

Well, not everyone can afford gen, those who can - does not necessary want to wait or are not willing to pay premium on the greymarket.

This is the same stuff like in luxury fragrance, knives, shoes or bags - there are people ready to pay gen price for gen quality and there are people who are happy to show of with just the logo (on reps).

I do understand the idea of homage products, but those will alway have a small part of the pie/market. Homages do not offer "the brand" and after all many of us are here cause in past we've been attracted by the brand. The big idea behind the luxury products is exclusivity, homages do not deliver it.

So you agree if you cant afford it maybe look elsewhere? there are hundreds of great watches secondhand and new for around £600. Lets be honest, wearing a fake Rolex to show you have more cash than you have, is dishonest, and poor form, I meet a lot of people like that, they don't even know we are wearing ALS,PP JLC etc, and the way it's worn with the extra link in to show off... I get it.

Its a fashion brand to show status

according to your summary before. sine I cant afford a lambo, Ill just get a Toyota and get it made to look like a Lambo....

my main point is we are all being ripped off, the PAGANI is better in every way apart from a MM precision finishing, even teh hands have been cleaned and it cost £35 (if TD postage is £40)

people buy Rolex to flex... I know a many owners that wont wear them. really.

 

[k4jun]

We are being ripped off each time when we buy something more than $30 quartz Casio or $100 automatic Orient, everything above imo is overpriced and sometimes we agree to pay extra because in return there is so called brand recognition attached to the watch.

Me probably has some kind of next level disorders because I am not bonding with gens. Have had gen from $60 to $6000 and all are gone, no regrets.
I am bonding with frankens, ideally those which were not easy to build. Putting a money on the table in exchange for gen watch is just boring, but as I said it is just me.

Yes, Rolex, Omega, Panerai, Tag all those biggies are brands to flex. Yes wearing fakes is dishonest, and is aimed to create an impression you are doing better in life than you actually do.
So what? Look wider, not only on watches. There are many people who live beyond one's means, or are trying to create the impression they are managing better than average Joe.
Internet and social media are great boost for those behaviours. I am not digging here on morality, but I do accept it as part of XXI century reality. In fact I know only few people who do not try to show off but those are oldtimers from the previous generation.

 

[Katarsis]

I like the rep world a lot more than the gen world.
I could buy a seiko and be done with it. It's great watches and inexpensive. But that is just not me.

I love the thrill of the hunt. Finding gems on m2m, waiting for it to arrive. Finding the flaws, sourcing parts and building something very nice and getting to know awesome people from all over the world in the mean time.

I am glad you like your new watch. It looks stunning but it doesn't do it for me. I want the whole package.

 

[English Gent]

We are being ripped off each time when we buy something more than $30 quartz Casio or $100 automatic Orient, everything above imo is overpriced and sometimes we agree to pay extra because in return there is so called brand recognition attached to the watch.

Me probably has some kind of next level disorders because I am not bonding with gens. Have had gen from $60 to $6000 and all are gone, no regrets.
I am bonding with frankens, ideally those which were not easy to build. Putting a money on the table in exchange for gen watch is just boring, but as I said it is just me.

Yes, Rolex, Omega, Panerai, Tag all those biggies are brands to flex. Yes wearing fakes is dishonest, and is aimed to create an impression you are doing better in life than you actually do.
So what? Look wider, not only on watches. There are many people who live beyond one's means, or are trying to create the impression they are managing better than average Joe.
Internet and social media are great boost for those behaviours. I am not digging here on morality, but I do accept it as part of XXI century reality. In fact I know only few people who do not try to show off but those are oldtimers from the previous generation.

this is my point, look at my original post, the £36 pagina is 85% of any Rolex rep, even better finishing in parts but it doesn't have a Rolex logo on

im just trying to explain on an illegal site for fake watches, that you can shop around and get far better for your money, £600 can get you REAL watches, I recently both the new Seiko 62mas redo for £1000, and a Cocktail time or £400 .

The money spent on Franken's on here that are fake, however, you cut it, are more expensive than a Speedy, or Omega... its insane

Let's be honest, this site is for people buying fake goods, and all people buy fake goods for staus.

You only need to look at the shit show that is the sales section, if someone is $1 off a price someone has found on a website people fight

ever been on a Gen watch site, where people sell real watches, NO ONE asks what you paid for it, EVER.
they are no 10000000 rules, (they are a few obvious ones) and no one shit storms your thread.

as a buyer and seller of real watches, I notice this a lot, if I sell something for £10 the and the buyer wants to return, they want me to pay for return (against my TOS) and supply a new version for free,

controversial but the cheaper people are the tighter and more blagging they get, hence the issues with sales on here

As I said before, ive bought over 400 reps, only a few out of them where worth shit. the new microbrands are proving that.

ad bac to my £36 homage thats better than most Noobs etc.

 

[GingerBubba]

What a boring discussion.

I'm off to flex in my Folex.

 

[English Gent]

I like the rep world slot more than the gen world.
I could buy a seiko and be done with it. It's great watches and inexpensive. But that is just not me.

I love the thrill of the hunt. Finding gems on m2m, waiting for it to arrive. Finding the flaws, sourcing parts and building something very nice and getting to know awesome people from all over the world in the mean time.

I am glad you like your new watch. It looks stunning but it doesn't do it for me. I want the whole package.

Gens also have faults, spot it on mine for 20 years ago....but having gen means you have accomplished something, but most people by real Rolex to prove that, because its all they know

 

[GingerBubba]

....but having gen means you have accomplished something

What nonsense. The only thing it proves you've accomplished is that you've worked out how to purchase an item.

 

[English Gent]

What nonsense. The only thing it proves you've accomplished is that you've worked out how to purchase an item.

it means you have worked hard, and are not trying to lie to people with your near-perfect Rolex. its real simple, people that make serious money can afford a wonderful collection, none of them you have to look under a macro to work out what's best factory making make

The simple fact is REAL watches cost money. you have it our you dont.

then there's this site and I love this site with all the banter and working out what Rolex is better, not even knowing the biggest tell, is the person wearing in,

 

[Katarsis]

Gens also have faults, spot it on mine for 20 years ago....but having gen means you have accomplished something, but most people by real Rolex to prove that, because its all they know

I can live with a flaw on a rep. It's made in a dirty basement in China. It would be amazing if they were perfect. But a flaw in a gen, especially a premium brand gen would drive me insane. I'm serious. I would have to sell it and probably take an economical hit.

My first watch was an Oris Aquis. Great watch 98% as good as a Rolex but it lost 50% of its value in two years even though it was as new when I sold it. Took quite some time to sell also.

Furthermore if I had an expensive gen I would hate myself if I damaged it. I like my watches to be in good condition. I would probably let my gens stay at home where they are safe. I can rebrush/polish my reps as I see fit. A gen would lose value if I did that.

If I get a big ding I can order a new watch for a fraction of gen price and flip the damaged one in a couple of days.

Not to mention the boxes.

Where should i keep all of my boxes for my gen pieces? Sleeve, outer box and box. They take up a shit load of space and I can't sell them.

You will come to your senses buddy.

 

[English Gent]

I can live with a flaw on a rep. It's made in a dirty basement in China. It would be amazing if they were perfect. But a flaw in a gen, especially a premium brand gen would drive me insane. I'm serious. I would have to sell it and probably take an economical hit.

My first watch was an Oris Aquis. Great watch 98% as good as a Rolex but it lost 50% of its value in two years even though it was as new when I sold it. Took quite some time to sell also.

Furthermore if I had an expensive gen I would hate myself if I damaged it. I like my watches to be in good condition. I would probably let my gens stay at home where they are safe. I can rebrush/polish my reps as I see fit. A gen would lose value if I did that.

If I get a big ding I can order a new watch for a fraction of gen price and flip the damaged one in a couple of days.

Not to mention the boxes.

Where should i keep all of my boxes for my gen pieces? Sleeve, outer box and box. They take up a shit load of space and I can't sell them.

You will come to your senses buddy.

SO you dont wear your gens? Ive been collecting fr 30 plus years, I take pride in what I wear, a fake watch on my arm is not pride, its I'm fake

 

[GingerBubba]

it means you have worked hard

Again, utter nonsense. Do you really think General Ismael Bin Whatever his name is, who's never had a real job in his life (yet constantly flexes his RMs etc in Instagram) works harder than a $1 a day rubbish dump scavenger in sub Saharan Africa? Because he doesn't!

What is more, there are many many people on here that are total addicts and have 50/100/hundreds of reps - the total cost of which easily puts them in Gen watch owning territory - they just choose not to.

To consider owning a Gen a measure of accomplishment just proves you've bought into the BS marketing that your Gen money has mostly been spent on.

 

[Katarsis]

SO you dont wear your gens? Ive been collecting fr 30 plus years, I take pride in what I wear, a fake watch on my arm is not pride, its I'm fake

What I wear doesn't define me. I do alot of stuff that define who I am. I am a great father and I have renovated two homes for my family. That is the stuff I'm made of. A watch is just a watch, gen or rep. Nobody cares what I wear on my wrist.

A car on the other hand is most of the time fake. People buy luxury cars with money they loaned from a bank to impress people. That is fake in my eyes and most people do it. Nobody cares.

The watch I'm wearing right now (rep) is worth more than my car.

 

[M_Hall]

You take an excellent photograph sir.

Enjoy your new watch.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[English Gent]

What I wear doesn't define me. I do alot of stuff that define who I am. I am a great father and I have renovated two homes for my family. That is the stuff I'm made of. A watch is just a watch, gen or rep. Nobody cares what I wear on my wrist.

A car on the other hand is most of the time fake. People buy luxury cars with money they paned from a bank to impress people. That is fake in my eyes and most people do it. Nobody cares.

The watch I'm wearing right now (rep) is worth more than my car.

BUT its saying what you want to be, see the original start to thread, it does say I want be seen as successful , but its a lie (watch wish)

I Started this thread out as the £36 watch is in every way as good as one with a logo

PS your rep isnt worth more than your car, maybe if it was real...

theres a satisfaction owning the real thing and not worrying if you will be called out

tell me know If I offered you a real AP or a dodgy AP, what would you wear

 

[p0pperini]

I don’t see watch ownership as being a reflection of what I’ve achieved.

The main reason I have enjoyed buying reps, and Frankens, is as much about the community - and the skills displayed by members of the community - as it is about the actual watches. The modding aspect to it makes rep collecting feel more of a proper hobby. There’s a great collection of characters, skilled craftsmen and artists gathered on the forums, which makes it a fun community to be part of.

Of course, there is a bit of over-diligence and passion on display at times - but this also further demonstrates the level of deep understanding of the subject that’s gathered together on the rep forums.

AFAIC, a Franken is entirely worth the money. On some, everything I’m looking at is gen, except the case and movement. To me, that’s as near as dammit the real thing, it’s been beautifully made, and I don’t see why I should pay 4 or 5 times as much for the gen.

I don’t think I’d have got anything like the same enjoyment out of collecting gen watches. Nor would I have been able to afford the sheer number of watches I’ve now got, thanks to the affordability of reps.