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Patek Philippe Nautilus 3800 vs Patek Philippe Nautilus 5711 PPF V3 - an in-depth comparative review

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    Patek Philippe Nautilus 3800 vs Patek Philippe Nautilus 5711 PPF V3 - an in-depth comparative review

    Patek Philippe Nautilus 3800/1A-001 vs Patek Philippe Nautilus 5711 PPF V3

    - an in-depth comparative review



    So it's been a while since i've made a review. As some of you know, i've been busy "going gen" the last months and have built an almost whole new collection, which will only contain very few reps. The experience of owning reps have been great. I've gone down the rabbithole and learned a lot about watches and reps, for that i'm grateful to all the enthusiasts here. Also i've learned to know my taste. I'll still keep a few reps to be able to wear a watch without worrying about getting robbed or it getting scratched, and also if some special pieces come along that are unobtainable in the gen world or just fun to have.
    I'm grateful that i've been lucky to be able to buy a gen Patek Philippe. And not just any Patek, but a Nautilus. Even if it's just a 3800, a Nautilus it is. And before i sell my 5711, i thought i might make a review, the enthusiasts here might enjoy.

    First of all i was in doubt if this review make sense at all. Does it make sense to compare a discontinued model, with a rep of a current model? In my opinion it does make sense to explain the differences in terms of quality, finishing and most of all the feeling of having a gen vs a rep.

    Let's begin.





    Patek Philippe Nautilus


    I won't bore you all with the story we've heard a thousand times about the 70's Quartz crisis, Gerald Genta, the Royal Oak and the birth of the Nautilus. But i would say, it is very admirable that the Royal Oak and Nautilus still captivate people decades after their birth. These are designs from the 70's but still feel modern today. Such timeless are these two icons. Genta have gotten something right. Even if he according to himself designed the Nautilus on a paper napkin in a restaurant in five minutes, while looking at the Patek Philippe representatives he was going to meet! Such a feat.




    The 3800's place in history


    The 3800 was born five years after the 3700, which was the original model designed by Genta, released in 1976. The 3700 was big for it's time at 42mm, and didn't sell well initially.


    Patek therefore strategically introduced the 3800. At 37mm it was big for the time too, but became an instant success. And you can understand why. They kept the dial like the 3700 and designed it similar, but shrunk it and gave it a very slim profile. It also had the straight "ears" like the 3700 (the 5711 has curved "ears"). The result was an elegant luxury sportswatch, with very unique proportions. Till today you don't find any other sportswatch at 7,5mm thickness.

    They introduced in the 3800 an in-house selfwinding caliber 330 SC (later models have the updated 335 SC), while the 3700's calibre 28-255C was based on a Jaeger-LeCoultre calibre 920. The watch therefore could have central seconds, which has been kept in all the later Nautilus references, such as the 5711. In that sense the 3800 made way to the modern Nautilus as we know it today.


    The Patek 3800 was discontinued in 2006 and gave way to the 5711, which was bigger and had certain design differences as explained later, but cemented the evolutionary stepstone the 3800 was.






    Comparison


    In this comparison i haven't taken into account the movement. First of all it's obvious that you can't compare a decorated Miyota to a Patek movement, secondly i don't want to open my watch to take pictures of the movement.

    To clarify, i brought my watch to the local AD and got the authenticity verified by them. So every part has been scrutinized by watchmakers that a few years back used to service the PP's (now they have to send them to Geneva on Patek's orders).
    Before i got it verified i used a few days, closely comparing it to the PPF V3. I found that i could determine the authenticity of the dial, case and bracelet. Which means that there are differences that can be felt or seen.

    First i will go into detail with the elements and then i will give my answer on a question that i've been wondering about. How does it feel to own a genuine Patek?

    Also a side-note. I will only describe the differences to keep it simple (when it's not differentiable, mostly i won't mention it).


    Dial comparison

    The dial is actually the part that is most obvious to differ from a rep, when you have held a gen Nautilus. There are several differences, that can either be seen with the naked eye, and with a loupe. And after you've held a gen you won't need to be a expert to see the difference. It just is there as soon as you hold the watch. It's like the gen is much sharper and much more refined. Let me go into detail:



    Color


    The dial colour on the gen Patek 3800 (and the gen 5711) has a green tint to it, which can be seen in direct light, specially in sunlight and bright day-light.


    In dark light it's almost black (not pitch black), but a very dark.

    In normal daylight or under spots/indoor lighting, the dial looks blue. The difference between the pre-2019 and the 2019+ Nautilus is mainly, that the newer Nautilus has a darker dial and is slightly more black.

    The rep 5711, and the PPF different versions, the 3K and several other versions have a blue coloured dial, which is too blue, or has too much silver and grey in it.


    The latter is the case for the 5711 PPF V3. The genuine Nautilus' never look silver. And don't have that much grey.




    Black-blue gradient


    The gen Nautilus has much more black-blue gradient, than the rep 5711 ppf. And the gradient is always there! That goes to both low light/artificial light situations but also in sunlight, it's visible to see against the rep. When i now hold the PPF i feel the dial looks more "tame", as it doesn't have that much gradient.






    Finishing and the sunburst
    Some of you may wonder why i talk about dial finishing and sunburst in the same sentence. Well, what i found out is, that the sunburst effect on the dial has very much to do with the finishing. The gen has a lot of sunburst compared to the rep. When looked in the loupe the reason reveals itself. The rep is coarsely finished by machine, while the gen is finished by hand and the finishing is much more fine and has a metallic appearance. That catches the light.



    I therefore don't think we can have better sunburst in the rep dials than is the case at the moment. Because they won't be hand finishing them anytime soon.
    GEN:

    PPF:



    Markers
    The markers are pretty obviously different from two reasons, both are visible without a loupe.
    1. The lume is more green in the rep, while in the gens it has a slightly more yellow appearance.
    2. The markers are machine finished in rep and more rough and angular, while the gen has more rounded and light-catching markers. This is pretty obvious also without a loupe, once you've seen the difference you can't unsee it.
    GEN:


    PPF:



    Hands


    Hands are impressive in this PPF. It's only possible to see the difference with a loupe IMO! Although i noticed that the seconds hand catches light better in the gen. When wearing it in a room with white walls it will often appear to look white. The finishing is of course much better in the gen and can be seen with a loupe. Specially the sides of the hands:
    GEN:

    PPF:
    [url=https://postimg.cc/RNxXrtyj]
    As mentioned the color of the lume is also like the markers, too green.



    Summary
    The dial is the biggest weakness of the rep. It has considerably less sunburst and blue-black gradient and also the markers and lume of the hands/markers are visibly different. Hands are pretty well made on the wrist, but not when seen with loupe.



    Case comparison

    I won't be mentioning the crown here, as it is different on the 3800 than on the 5711. We all know the protruding crown issue of the ppf.



    Dimensions
    One of the things that is something you can differentiate a gen case and a rep case from is the dimensions. It will always be hard to make a case that is exactly the same specs as the rep. Even with mods. The case of the 3800 is 37,3mm in diameter (ear to ear), 35mm in diameter (2 to 7), 39mm lug-to-lug, 42mm end-link to end-link, 7,5mm thickness.


    Bezel
    As we all know, one of the fault of the rep 5711 is the polished bevel of the bezel is too angular. The gen has a lower angle and therefore the bezel is smaller.
    When you look at it with the loupe, you can see the transition between the polished and satin finished parts on the bezel are more rounded in the gen. As they are hand finished.

    It's difficult to take a good picture of that!


    Case

    I must say i'm impressed by the finishing of the case on the PPF, it's highly similar to the gen and i would be lying to say that i could tell them apart with certainty. I think the gen looks a bit more fine in the brushing, but it's difficult! The only place where the difference in finishing is visible is on the ears. Patek have finished it curved and straight, that catches light much more than the rep.
    GEN:

    PPF:


    The case shape is hardly comparable as these are two different watches. But the polishing of the sides of the lugs is much better on the gen. When you move your finger over it you can feel the rep is more edgy and you can also see it in the loupe. The polished part is smaller in the rep also.
    GEN:

    PPF:
    [url=https://postimg.cc/grtL8bq4]
    The case feels more edgy, as goes to the lugs and bracelet.

    Bracelet

    The most obvious difference is the feel of the two bracelets. If you ever hold the gen, the bracelet is much softer in the edges because of the finishing is done more rounded at the edges. The rep feels more edgy, like sharp metal edges. Also the backside of the links is much rougher on the rep, while the gen feels soft. It's because the edges on the gen has been handpolished to be more rounded.
    GEN:

    PPF:

    So if you ever hand your watch to someone who has held a gen they'll know right away.
    Other than that the finishing is a little better on the gen, but again, it's very hard to tell other than when you look with the loupe on these mentioned parts and on the finishing itself.



    Summary

    Regarding the case, there are differences in dimensions, finishing and the feel is slightly different, but i must say, the differences are not big on the wrist. It's mostly when analyzed in detail. The bracelt has a pretty different feel when holding it in the hands, but on the wrist or seen from a meters distance it's not much. Where the dial i would say is hugely different, the case is pretty well-made on the rep.


    On the wrist




    Compared to many other sportswatches and to the 5711, the 3800 has a very slim profile and is exceptionally comfortable to wear. Even if 37mm sounds small, it sits very well on the wrist. It makes it eyecatching understated and appears more refined and elegant than a 5711.



    If price and rise in value etc was out of the question, i'm not sure i would trade the 3800 for a 5711. I very much like the straight ears, which gives it a slightly more masculine appearance. It's also historically more related to the original Genta design, than the 5711, which has curved ears, giving it a slightly more feminine appearance.



    When comparing the rep with the gen on wrist, i would say the biggest differences are in the dial, markers, and bezel (and protruding ppf crown of course). The dial issue is primarily that it feels more "tame" when looked at from a little difference and up close, because the sunburst is lower and the blue-black gradient as well. Also the color is very different. The PPF is too silver, grey and less blue, black and green.
    The Nautilus was nautically inspired. It all adds up when the dial is seen in that context, with it's beautiful blue, black and greenish shades like sea water.





    The case and bracelet are pretty impressive on the rep, i'd be lying if i told you they are very visible on the wrist. There of course are differences, as explained when looked at in detail or felt in the hands. And these are primarily attributed to the different production methods (machine vs hand finishing etc). But it's not the case that lets the rep down.




    The feeling of owning a Patek Philippe

    [url=https://postimg.cc/Q9CRv7B2]

    Most watchmakers get a few timepieces right through their long history. Patek somehow managed to do perfect with so many of their pieces throughout the centuries. And that’s what has made them legendary and separate them by far from the crowd. It’s not difficult to get something right once or twice. But getting it right so many times, that’s what makes legend.
    Owning a piece of that history is something special.



    When wearing this watch you really feel that. The rep 5711 is pretty impressive in it's own way. In a way it shows how much you can get for the small amount of money you are paying. When i wear the rep 5711, though, the flaws bug me - as small as they might be. And also it bugs me that it's just an imitation of the gen. Even if it's an impressive imitation. Even if i corrected the flaws by getting the crown modded, maybe bezel also and put in a gen dial, it would be pretty hard to distinguish it from the gen. But then again, it wouldn't give me that feeling. The feeling of owning a piece of proud history from a legendary watchmaker.
    Don't take me wrong, I would still wear a rep. It's just more practical to have a good rep. If you don't want to be worrying about loosing the watch or getting it damaged/scratched, a rep is a good option. But no matter how good a rep is, it can't beat the feeling of a gen. And i now can understand why people pay so much for gens.



    The Nautilus in particular is a fantastic watch. Somehow Gerald Genta got the design spot on and managed to captivate people across generations and decades apart. And i think the key lies in the simplicity and elegance of the design. And the design being amazingly balanced between curves, angles and smooth edges, it's so light on the eye. Also the dial has this fantastic subtle sunburst, beautiful black-blue gradient, both which are more subtle than in any other watch. Also the color of the dial has attributes of sea water; the way it changes and reacts with light.




    I love the details in the 3800, such as the sigma dial, which is an emblem on the dial (the sigma symbols on both sides of the SWISS), that in reality is a reminder of the tough times the mechanical watch industry went through during the quartz crisis. The symbol means that the dial contains gold (markers are made of white gold). The sigma dials weren't really caught by the collectors, so in a way it's a desperate measure that didn't succeed. But still a beautiful detail when seen today.



    The 3800 movement has the Geneva seal, as it's made before Patek decided to give their movements their own seal. That is also a nice part of it's story. It's a watch that has more details to it, than first meets the eye. A proud and long history, a design that has it's own story and details with their story of their own, such as the straight ears, sigma dial, geneva seal and it's uniquely slim profile and elegant proportions. This watch is really one to love!

    My reviews: A.L.&S. 1815 Tourbillon V2 - VC Traditionnelle Tourbillon - VC Traditionnelle - Patek 5070P Saatchi London Ltd. Edi - Patek 5089G Azulejos - Patek 5524G - Patek 5975R - Patek 5205G - Patek 6102R Celestial Moon Age - Richard Mille 035-02 ZF (crown rubber change).

    New review released: Patek 3800 gen vs Patek 5711 PPF

    Collection inspirational thread.

    #2
    Great review. Thank you. Enjoy it


    Sent from my iPhone using RWI

    Comment


      #3
      Excellent review as always, thanks much. The Nautilus is a superb, iconic design and the PPF is a very decent representation.

      Comment


        #4
        Great review, thank you very much for your analysis and the pictures. I've never analyzed the PPF v3 in such detail, because although the Nautilus is one of my favorite watches, I'm not sure it fits my socioeconomic level, and I only buy watches from my 'tier'. In any case, after your review, my eye will be much finer when assessing a Rep of this magnificent watch.

        Comment


          #5
          Wow, what a great effort, thank you very much.
          & gratz on the gen!

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Kitaro View Post
            Great review. Thank you. Enjoy it


            Sent from my iPhone using RWI
            Thanks buddy
            My reviews: A.L.&S. 1815 Tourbillon V2 - VC Traditionnelle Tourbillon - VC Traditionnelle - Patek 5070P Saatchi London Ltd. Edi - Patek 5089G Azulejos - Patek 5524G - Patek 5975R - Patek 5205G - Patek 6102R Celestial Moon Age - Richard Mille 035-02 ZF (crown rubber change).

            New review released: Patek 3800 gen vs Patek 5711 PPF

            Collection inspirational thread.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by rek00001 View Post
              Excellent review as always, thanks much. The Nautilus is a superb, iconic design and the PPF is a very decent representation.
              Seen in light of what you are paying and the quality you get, it is indeed a decent representation. Thanks mate.
              My reviews: A.L.&S. 1815 Tourbillon V2 - VC Traditionnelle Tourbillon - VC Traditionnelle - Patek 5070P Saatchi London Ltd. Edi - Patek 5089G Azulejos - Patek 5524G - Patek 5975R - Patek 5205G - Patek 6102R Celestial Moon Age - Richard Mille 035-02 ZF (crown rubber change).

              New review released: Patek 3800 gen vs Patek 5711 PPF

              Collection inspirational thread.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Dmage View Post
                Wow, what a great effort, thank you very much.
                & gratz on the gen!
                Glad you liked it, thanks for the kind words
                My reviews: A.L.&S. 1815 Tourbillon V2 - VC Traditionnelle Tourbillon - VC Traditionnelle - Patek 5070P Saatchi London Ltd. Edi - Patek 5089G Azulejos - Patek 5524G - Patek 5975R - Patek 5205G - Patek 6102R Celestial Moon Age - Richard Mille 035-02 ZF (crown rubber change).

                New review released: Patek 3800 gen vs Patek 5711 PPF

                Collection inspirational thread.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Adam_Smith View Post
                  Great review, thank you very much for your analysis and the pictures. I've never analyzed the PPF v3 in such detail, because although the Nautilus is one of my favorite watches, I'm not sure it fits my socioeconomic level, and I only buy watches from my 'tier'. In any case, after your review, my eye will be much finer when assessing a Rep of this magnificent watch.
                  Thanks mate.
                  You are right. There always is an aspect of giving a statement when wearing a watch. And with a rep you are signalling something even you don't intent to "flash a rep". So that is the case, even if you are only wearing it for your own pleasure because you like the watch. I've owned many reps just to enjoy them. And that's an aspect you can always consider. Most people wouldn't know how insanely priced a Nautilus is. They'll most likely associate it with a Tag Heuer - for example a Link Calibre 5 haha.
                  So you can consider buying it for use on occasions you are with people who don't know watches.
                  My reviews: A.L.&S. 1815 Tourbillon V2 - VC Traditionnelle Tourbillon - VC Traditionnelle - Patek 5070P Saatchi London Ltd. Edi - Patek 5089G Azulejos - Patek 5524G - Patek 5975R - Patek 5205G - Patek 6102R Celestial Moon Age - Richard Mille 035-02 ZF (crown rubber change).

                  New review released: Patek 3800 gen vs Patek 5711 PPF

                  Collection inspirational thread.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Not many can do such a compartment, today the Nautilus ceased to be a sports watch to become a piece of art. Congratulations on the acquisition, you have an enviable piece for all of us.

                    The review as always was excellent, I really liked the way you describe the 3800 and at the same time compare it to the 5711, excellent work as always.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by m1994 View Post
                      Not many can do such a compartment, today the Nautilus ceased to be a sports watch to become a piece of art. Congratulations on the acquisition, you have an enviable piece for all of us.

                      The review as always was excellent, I really liked the way you describe the 3800 and at the same time compare it to the 5711, excellent work as always.
                      Thanks buddy. Thank you the kind words as always. Yeah I am very happy for it.

                      Yeah I tried to do both. The 3800 part I also did for myself haha
                      My reviews: A.L.&S. 1815 Tourbillon V2 - VC Traditionnelle Tourbillon - VC Traditionnelle - Patek 5070P Saatchi London Ltd. Edi - Patek 5089G Azulejos - Patek 5524G - Patek 5975R - Patek 5205G - Patek 6102R Celestial Moon Age - Richard Mille 035-02 ZF (crown rubber change).

                      New review released: Patek 3800 gen vs Patek 5711 PPF

                      Collection inspirational thread.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        I ran again out of words - You are absolutely right.

                        Thank you for the write up and of course the beautiful pictures. Enjoy her!

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by BIONONE View Post
                          I ran again out of words - You are absolutely right.

                          Thank you for the write up and of course the beautiful pictures. Enjoy her!
                          Thanks buddy. Nice to hear when it comes from you.
                          My reviews: A.L.&S. 1815 Tourbillon V2 - VC Traditionnelle Tourbillon - VC Traditionnelle - Patek 5070P Saatchi London Ltd. Edi - Patek 5089G Azulejos - Patek 5524G - Patek 5975R - Patek 5205G - Patek 6102R Celestial Moon Age - Richard Mille 035-02 ZF (crown rubber change).

                          New review released: Patek 3800 gen vs Patek 5711 PPF

                          Collection inspirational thread.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Incredible, thank you for this extremely detailed comparison and examination of both watches. Your review makes me really appreciate the 3800 much more and is something to consider for myself. As you did I’m hoping to make a transition to owning more gens vs reps in the not so distant future.

                            Stay safe mate!

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by LebronXiJames View Post
                              Incredible, thank you for this extremely detailed comparison and examination of both watches. Your review makes me really appreciate the 3800 much more and is something to consider for myself. As you did I’m hoping to make a transition to owning more gens vs reps in the not so distant future.

                              Stay safe mate!
                              Thanks buddy. Appreciate it. I’m glad to hear that. The 3800 is very special. The tendency is going towards smaller watches. So it’s definitely gonna get a notch upwards in popularity (and prices) within the coming years.
                              I agree. Even if this is primarily a rep forum we can’t deny that reps are pretty much related to gens and many members here have a foot in each place.
                              So therefore I find, that informing about the gens I’ve bought can be useful for members here. As many of them are watches that other members here could buy or consider Buying as well.
                              Last edited by jm_brc_7057; 06-08-20, 08:19.
                              My reviews: A.L.&S. 1815 Tourbillon V2 - VC Traditionnelle Tourbillon - VC Traditionnelle - Patek 5070P Saatchi London Ltd. Edi - Patek 5089G Azulejos - Patek 5524G - Patek 5975R - Patek 5205G - Patek 6102R Celestial Moon Age - Richard Mille 035-02 ZF (crown rubber change).

                              New review released: Patek 3800 gen vs Patek 5711 PPF

                              Collection inspirational thread.

                              Comment

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