Well guys,
Ok, so im here to talk about and review one of my favourite watches. The PAM 320 / 329. This is the 3 day stainless black dial GMT 1950's luminor from panerai which comes with either a croc (320) or stainless (329) band. I find this a very versatile watch which is why I ended up buying the gen. You will see it with a bunch of different bands below and my humble opinion is that it looks good on them all. I will update with pictures on stainless soon. Apart from the PAM 270 which was out of my price range this is my favourite PAM.
If you don't know already the main differences between the gen and rep are:
* 24 hour GMT hand as opposed to 12 (doesn't bother me, in fact at times i prefer the 24 hours as its more useful when travelling). An AM/PM indicator like on the 270 would have changed my mind on this.
* Different movement - A7750 vs P9001.
As some of you who have dealt with me may know i've spent the last 3 months trying to get a good 329 rep. I have been through 4 watches from different manufacturers during that time evaluating each for my needs. I also have a gen 329 (latest Q series) to compare against.
I thought I would share some of my findings with you. Ok, so lets cover the stainless steel bracelet first. As of August this year I cannot find any rep 329's about. ZF had one but no longer seem to make it. I've seen some amazing pics of them and this would have been my watch of choice... but i couldnt source one. Instead I was able to find one secondhand ZF bracelet, and also purchased a rep 328 from kurvarsitwatch from an unknown manufacturer to harvest the bracelet.
So I now have two rep bracelets to try on my watches. Let's get right to the point, the SEL on the rep bracelets doesn't fit any of these great, but its much worse on the KW than the ZF. The gen is somewhere in the middle. I think the KW has slightly longer lugs which leaves quite a gap. The SEL is much smaller than the gen which is what causes this issue. They all look great on gen bracelet. If only someone copied the gen SEL properly I would be a happy man...
Ok, so first things first, i've discounted the less known manufacturer ones. I used them mainly as donor pieces (though at times they were surprisingly good!) so this review focuses on gen vs kw vs zf. Sorry for the bad picture quality I just realised how bad my lens is at macro photography....
Here is a picture of the 3 side by side at roughly arms distance away.
left to right: KW, Gen, ZF
Now yes, they are all on different bands (no photo's on stainless yet - to come). Just wanted to show you how adaptable this watch is (one of the reasons I bought it). It looks good on different bands which completely change the look.
So now some more photo's of the faces closer up:
KW:
GEN
ZF:
Not bad are they? One thing I have to say is the panerai reps are done well.
Now some photo's of the back. You are right to think both manufacturers have nicely done non inverted 7750 movements now. It was a nice surprise. My gen serial number brushed out for obvious reasons...
KW:
KW:
GEN:
GEN:
ZF:
Right, now in order to not overwhelm the thread with pics I will save the rest until later.
Now, lets start with some commentary.
The good of the KW (Brown asso strap up top and brown gator on the bottom) is that its well made. Crown guard is closest to gen, lever is close to the body, thin and lever has a really smooth action - very gen like. Flush CP but slightly rounded so looks a little odd up close. Hands also look very "shiny" not sure why. It really is a nice watch. The new version has a nice non inverted movement too. An unreported improvement.
Despite all that I can't really recommend the KW as a good PAM 321 rep though. It's a great watch, don't get me wrong but its got too many flaws on the face:
1) Minute hand is too short. It's really rather obvious and looks just 'wrong' when you look at it. Whether you have seen the gen or not. It just doesn't look correctly proportioned - what is it with KW??? this isn't their only watch I have found this on my omega seamaster as well!
2) Font is great, but the wrong colour (as is date wheel) it's too brown. Think they are reusing they PAM 438 / 359 ink here to save money. Bit disappointing.
3) The lume is excellent! However, the numbers always have a green tinge to them. It gives the face a more 351 look (as the dial takes on a brown look). I didn't like it and its the main reason I will be selling the watch.
Now for the ZF (black gator). Now I never much understood why there seems to be a KW bias here until I purchased my recent 2 ZF's. The 351 turned out fantastic and the 320 ok in the end. Note, i rejected them both 3 - 4 times due to obvious issues. QC really seems to be lacking in these pieces. I would have rejected the 320 a forth but I felt too bad for the TD. If you noticed, yes the dial is installed crooked, and the CG pin is not the whole way through the crown guard. This is the one I accepted...
The good:
ZF is a lot closer to gen in look and is a much better job at the face. Crystal seems to have a nicer colour to it too than the KW. Hands are correct length, better inscriptions on rotor, dial has right colour font (slightly too white, could be more cream but much more subtle compared to KW) though font is off - a little too thin compared to the more bold gen and kw. DW as per font. Dial numbers are also a little too "cream" compared to gen - definitely better than that perpetual fluro green on the kw though.
The bad:
1) QC just isn't up to par with the ZF. Wish they would address this. I better be able to fix that dial or I will be displeased.
2) Lume is nowhere near as good as gen or kw. On hands its a bit uneven and overall its weak.
3) CG lever is too thick and sits out a bit far. It also isn't anywhere near as smooth as gen or kw.
4) The power reserve indicator is back to front....
I have left out what I saw as QC issues on each watch as these are individual watch specific. I will however point them out here as a sign of quality of production:
* Both reps had nicks in the hands which was disappointing, but you only notice it in bright light.
* ZF CG pin wasn't installed properly (it's too short)
* KW CG had a rub mark on it from the onset
* ZF dial was crooked (still haven't had this fixed)
* ZF had marks on dial (which i hope come out)
* KW has dirty fingerprints all through movement
* ZF movement seems to be rubbish, low PR and doesn't keep good time at all.
* ZF movement cover has sloppy holes cut out of it for screw clearance. Not neatly done and could have been a lot smaller / cleaner.
* KW quick release pressure points were really stiff (one of them) at first. I had a lot of trouble with it, but it has free'd up now.
Some more observations:
* The ZF rep straps are much nicer than the KW equivalents (for croc)
* KW buckles are nicer
All in all i've decided to keep the ZF as a base to mod due to its closer to gen look. I will be asking strodda to help fix the issues (crooked dial) relume it, and do a swiss 7754 conversion which should give me a nice watch.
You have probably realised i've favoured the ZF even though there is numerous issues with both. That largely boils down to the hand length & font colour on the face. It's just a lot closer to gen. The KW case is finished nicer, and I wanted it to be the one, but until they fix these two issues I just find the ZF a better sample. If they stepped up QC this would be an amazing watch. Slightly better lume application, straight dial, a nicer running movement (its a shame because the first one with the missing "M" in luminor on the dial looked to be a great runner) and I would have loved this watch.
I'll be putting more detail into these posts and more info here soon but I have a young family and my 8 month old needs to be taken care of... so i'll leave it here for now.
Ok, so im here to talk about and review one of my favourite watches. The PAM 320 / 329. This is the 3 day stainless black dial GMT 1950's luminor from panerai which comes with either a croc (320) or stainless (329) band. I find this a very versatile watch which is why I ended up buying the gen. You will see it with a bunch of different bands below and my humble opinion is that it looks good on them all. I will update with pictures on stainless soon. Apart from the PAM 270 which was out of my price range this is my favourite PAM.
If you don't know already the main differences between the gen and rep are:
* 24 hour GMT hand as opposed to 12 (doesn't bother me, in fact at times i prefer the 24 hours as its more useful when travelling). An AM/PM indicator like on the 270 would have changed my mind on this.
* Different movement - A7750 vs P9001.
As some of you who have dealt with me may know i've spent the last 3 months trying to get a good 329 rep. I have been through 4 watches from different manufacturers during that time evaluating each for my needs. I also have a gen 329 (latest Q series) to compare against.
I thought I would share some of my findings with you. Ok, so lets cover the stainless steel bracelet first. As of August this year I cannot find any rep 329's about. ZF had one but no longer seem to make it. I've seen some amazing pics of them and this would have been my watch of choice... but i couldnt source one. Instead I was able to find one secondhand ZF bracelet, and also purchased a rep 328 from kurvarsitwatch from an unknown manufacturer to harvest the bracelet.
So I now have two rep bracelets to try on my watches. Let's get right to the point, the SEL on the rep bracelets doesn't fit any of these great, but its much worse on the KW than the ZF. The gen is somewhere in the middle. I think the KW has slightly longer lugs which leaves quite a gap. The SEL is much smaller than the gen which is what causes this issue. They all look great on gen bracelet. If only someone copied the gen SEL properly I would be a happy man...
Ok, so first things first, i've discounted the less known manufacturer ones. I used them mainly as donor pieces (though at times they were surprisingly good!) so this review focuses on gen vs kw vs zf. Sorry for the bad picture quality I just realised how bad my lens is at macro photography....
Here is a picture of the 3 side by side at roughly arms distance away.
left to right: KW, Gen, ZF
Now yes, they are all on different bands (no photo's on stainless yet - to come). Just wanted to show you how adaptable this watch is (one of the reasons I bought it). It looks good on different bands which completely change the look.
So now some more photo's of the faces closer up:
KW:
GEN
ZF:
Not bad are they? One thing I have to say is the panerai reps are done well.
Now some photo's of the back. You are right to think both manufacturers have nicely done non inverted 7750 movements now. It was a nice surprise. My gen serial number brushed out for obvious reasons...
KW:
KW:
GEN:
GEN:
ZF:
Right, now in order to not overwhelm the thread with pics I will save the rest until later.
Now, lets start with some commentary.
The good of the KW (Brown asso strap up top and brown gator on the bottom) is that its well made. Crown guard is closest to gen, lever is close to the body, thin and lever has a really smooth action - very gen like. Flush CP but slightly rounded so looks a little odd up close. Hands also look very "shiny" not sure why. It really is a nice watch. The new version has a nice non inverted movement too. An unreported improvement.
Despite all that I can't really recommend the KW as a good PAM 321 rep though. It's a great watch, don't get me wrong but its got too many flaws on the face:
1) Minute hand is too short. It's really rather obvious and looks just 'wrong' when you look at it. Whether you have seen the gen or not. It just doesn't look correctly proportioned - what is it with KW??? this isn't their only watch I have found this on my omega seamaster as well!
2) Font is great, but the wrong colour (as is date wheel) it's too brown. Think they are reusing they PAM 438 / 359 ink here to save money. Bit disappointing.
3) The lume is excellent! However, the numbers always have a green tinge to them. It gives the face a more 351 look (as the dial takes on a brown look). I didn't like it and its the main reason I will be selling the watch.
Now for the ZF (black gator). Now I never much understood why there seems to be a KW bias here until I purchased my recent 2 ZF's. The 351 turned out fantastic and the 320 ok in the end. Note, i rejected them both 3 - 4 times due to obvious issues. QC really seems to be lacking in these pieces. I would have rejected the 320 a forth but I felt too bad for the TD. If you noticed, yes the dial is installed crooked, and the CG pin is not the whole way through the crown guard. This is the one I accepted...
The good:
ZF is a lot closer to gen in look and is a much better job at the face. Crystal seems to have a nicer colour to it too than the KW. Hands are correct length, better inscriptions on rotor, dial has right colour font (slightly too white, could be more cream but much more subtle compared to KW) though font is off - a little too thin compared to the more bold gen and kw. DW as per font. Dial numbers are also a little too "cream" compared to gen - definitely better than that perpetual fluro green on the kw though.
The bad:
1) QC just isn't up to par with the ZF. Wish they would address this. I better be able to fix that dial or I will be displeased.
2) Lume is nowhere near as good as gen or kw. On hands its a bit uneven and overall its weak.
3) CG lever is too thick and sits out a bit far. It also isn't anywhere near as smooth as gen or kw.
4) The power reserve indicator is back to front....
I have left out what I saw as QC issues on each watch as these are individual watch specific. I will however point them out here as a sign of quality of production:
* Both reps had nicks in the hands which was disappointing, but you only notice it in bright light.
* ZF CG pin wasn't installed properly (it's too short)
* KW CG had a rub mark on it from the onset
* ZF dial was crooked (still haven't had this fixed)
* ZF had marks on dial (which i hope come out)
* KW has dirty fingerprints all through movement
* ZF movement seems to be rubbish, low PR and doesn't keep good time at all.
* ZF movement cover has sloppy holes cut out of it for screw clearance. Not neatly done and could have been a lot smaller / cleaner.
* KW quick release pressure points were really stiff (one of them) at first. I had a lot of trouble with it, but it has free'd up now.
Some more observations:
* The ZF rep straps are much nicer than the KW equivalents (for croc)
* KW buckles are nicer
All in all i've decided to keep the ZF as a base to mod due to its closer to gen look. I will be asking strodda to help fix the issues (crooked dial) relume it, and do a swiss 7754 conversion which should give me a nice watch.
You have probably realised i've favoured the ZF even though there is numerous issues with both. That largely boils down to the hand length & font colour on the face. It's just a lot closer to gen. The KW case is finished nicer, and I wanted it to be the one, but until they fix these two issues I just find the ZF a better sample. If they stepped up QC this would be an amazing watch. Slightly better lume application, straight dial, a nicer running movement (its a shame because the first one with the missing "M" in luminor on the dial looked to be a great runner) and I would have loved this watch.
I'll be putting more detail into these posts and more info here soon but I have a young family and my 8 month old needs to be taken care of... so i'll leave it here for now.
