VR 3135 Won't Hold Maximum Power

[jumpope]

Just wondering...is there ever a situation in which the mainspring slips and will not hold the power?

I have a VR 3185 in an ARF 116710. I have added a gen jumping hour date module, hour wheel, date jumper spring and date wheel. When I wind it manually, I can see an amplitude of 280 - 290, or more, but I never see more than 250 - 260 otherwise.

I have installed a genuine 145 winding module. Still the same. When I manually turn the winding rotor I can see that it is winding the mainspring. Additionally, the rotor is turning freely and with no interference. Thus the question. The only other denominator is the mainspring. If it had too much braking grease or not enough, might it slip enough to lose some power.

Also...sometimes when I wind it manually, it will have a high amplitude immediately, but in a few minutes it might be back down in the 240s to 250s. The watch has not been serviced.

Thanks for any consideration.

 

[Digital.]

Serviced lots of VR’s, from the factory they usually have an amplitude of 250 degrees, every so often you get one that’s around 290/300. I bet if you test it after 24hrs it’s still around 240?

If your rep is -10/+20 per day with a 40hr (approx) PR there’s nothing to worry about. The inside will more than likely be dirty though, always worth getting a VR serviced.

 

[tsyeo4]

The amplitude measures the of rotation in the swing of the balance wheel, in either direction. It also tells the mechanical power transmission from the main barrel all the way to the train gears to balance wheel which rely alot on lesser friction and aligned parts to work.

The sudden drop of the amplitude could be a factor of the train gears, escape wheel, pallet fork and main barrel to have some friction. Could be loose parts contact that is causing this.

​​​my observation from VR3185 and VR 3135 sometimes have some imperfections in the train gears or main barrel when full locked down the bridges. Tolerance is the key.

That being said one perfect way to test if your movement is delivering the power properly is to release the main spring power. Remove the pallet fork and keep the main spring, arbor, train gears and pallet fork installed. Thus your movement should technically be on free spin mode. When you use a screw driver to turn at the arbor you should see the movement spin freely.

​​​​​Give it 5 turns on the arbor. Slowly release/secure the screws that are securing the bridge at the main barrel, then the train bridge. You will find the root cause of the friction. You will know there is friction when you loosen/secure the screw and the gears move after a complete stop.

​​​my guess for your case is the tolerance of the contact between the gears have issues which at first looks normal and when the gears starts. But when it starts to normalize due to the gap between the contact ,the gears starts to build up friction which causes the drop in amplitude.

Make sure you don't have any hands installed when doing this test. The second hand will be spinning like crazy.

 

[tsyeo4]

Sorry I need to make a correction

That being said one perfect way to test if your movement is delivering the power properly is to release the main spring power. Remove the pallet fork and keep the main spring, arbor, train gears and escape wheel installed. Thus your movement should technically be on free spin mode without the locking pallet fork. When you use a screw driver to turn at the arbor you should see the movement spin freely.

 

[jumpope]

Understood. Haven’t tried the free spin test. Just one note. The amp doesn’t drop immediately but rather over a period of an few minutes to an hour. That’s why the question regarding slippage.


Sent from my iPad using RWI

 

[tsyeo4]

Watch tolerance can be a very tricky art. You have to service the movement to find out which part is the culprit. Is not as simple as a spin test. Is alot of checking and trying to get the right understanding.

In a nut shell the movement should spin freely even with a slight touch without the pallet fork.

I usually didn't face such issues with the SH3135 using gen parts. But VR3135 kinda reminds me of the old SA3135 with very similar designs that SH3135 doesn't have such as the guiding pins at the pallet fork and none adjustable balance bridge.

That is why I have mix feelings using VR3135 despite the high demand of people requesting the use of this movement.

 

[bc1221]

I would just slap a gen mainspring in it and call it a day.

It’s worth it. Pretty much every rep I’ve owned, that’s usually the first mod I do it it’s not running as well as it should. (PR being less than 30 hours or less).

If I recall, a gen Rolex mainspring assembled was roughly $80.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[unicornpad]

Since we're in this discussion on the PR of the movement, I have a VR3135 (blue spring) and the self-winding rotor seems to wind well clockwise but the gears wont move/wind when the rotor goes anti-clockwise. Hence the watch stops ticking at times when I don't move around too much (sitting on desk etc). Any idea what could be the problem?

I am currently resolving this by manually winding the watch for 30-40 turns

 

[ado213]

faulty autreverser, part No:- 3135-540

 

[ado213]

The reason the VR has generally poor amplitude is due to the pivots on the balance staff, they are very flat indeed with little or no doming. The flatter the pivot the more friction is applied to the cap jewel, hence lowering amplitude.

This has been purposely done by the manufacturer to balance dial up/down positions with crown down etc. In Short the staff and jewels are too big and flat for the balance wheel.

 

[unicornpad]

faulty autreverser, part No:- 3135-540

Can I still continue wearing the watch or would that be an issue down the line? Not looking to get it fixed/serviced anytime soon

 

[ado213]

If you want it to autowind get it fixed, if not leave it and get it serviced when you can, as there may be other faults in the autoreverser module that may impede manual winding at some point