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3135 Movement Comparison (Gen/SA/SH/VR)

Tickleshoes

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19/8/15
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Well, occb2 beat me to this by a few hours. If I wasn't sick for the last few days I'd have gotten this out sooner :)

Anyway, I put all the time into taking the pics so here it is anyway... ANOTHER VR3135 comparison. Special thanks to timto1388 for donating this watch for dissection.

First things first, I was impressed that the VRF Max case is machined so that the movement can be mounted using just screws. This is the same as a gen watch. The movement is inserted and turned and then the screws are loosened so that the press against the inside of the case and hold the movement. normally they just use tabs/screws to hold it down.
Hebcd.jpg


HMCTF.jpg


The VR3135 (bottom right) finish is MUCH better than the SH (bottom left) but not quite a good as gen (top)
HM04I.jpg


Rotor finish is impressive.
HMgGA.jpg


HMGYK.jpg


Here the ragged finish on the SH is apparent. Again, the order is Gen / SA3135 / SH3135 / VR 3135
HMl4T.jpg


Unfortunately, the bottom plate isn't jeweled for the driving wheel. It's a sort of SA3135 solution... just have the driving wheel run loosely in that hole. Good news is an SH bottom plate does fit. I didn't try to press a jewel in, but it's possible that it would fit as well. the driving wheel will work with a jeweled plate too, so no need to swap that out.
HMXL6.jpg


HMqap.jpg


I was excited to get a look at the reversing wheels and they don't disappoint. Finish is very gen like. Not just painted either. They appear to be baked/powdercoated/anodized or something.
HMwUe.jpg


Gen / SA / SH / VR

HMYYf.jpg


Like Rob said, this movement uses old school banking pins instead of having them integrated into the pallet bridge like a genuine/SH movement this does help in case there are banking issues that need to be resolved, but I wouldnt call it an improvement.
HeJoR.jpg



HMkGo.jpg


Fully blued top plate screws. Impressive!
HeymZ.jpg


Little details like having the grooves inside the barrel! This allows the tail of the mainspring to grab as it goes around. The SH on the right doesn't have these notches and needs a lot of tension to keep from slipping early, resulting in low power reserves.
HM5cU.jpg


The tail of the mainspring that grabs the groove on the mainspring wall. The mainspring itself was kinda weak but felt the same as gen. The SH uses VERY strong springs. It's possible that an SH spring would yield more performance. After servicing, the amplitude was where I'd expected an SH, despite having better finished gear train
HeWh2.jpg


This is also very SH like in design. The gen cover mechanism on the left has a collar in the hold and a flat setting wheel. For some reason, the SH and VR have a tiered setting wheel that mimics the look when installed but prevents the parts from being interchangeable. If you swap one you need the other.
HeEWb.jpg


This is one of the upgrades Rob mentioned. A metal nub on the date finger. While the jeweled part on the SH never caused me any problems, I guess it was more brittle than metal.
HeZP3.jpg


Brand new movement - still had crud in the wheels :)
HMBa8.jpg


1:1 design on the winding bridge
HMahD.jpg


One of my gripes with the finish is that all the other finishes seem to be huge improvements, but the ratchet wheel finish is really rough. Even the SH ratchet wheel is better. Here, compared to gen.
HMdUX.jpg


Date wheel is fully painted on top. While the print isn't great, at least it doest better imitate a gen datewheel. It also accepts a gen datewheel without fit issues like the SH.
HMSKQ.jpg


Genuine sized KIF shock spring. I think this is a 3-3 size. The SA4130 uses KIF springs now as well but the top bridge spring is a size of Elastor spring that isn't a genuine size.

HM2EL.jpg


Finish is pretty good (compared to gen, right)

HMRCr.jpg


As Rob said, I also had date change issues after service, with a gen date wheel. I solved them by bending the date jumper spring, putting more force into the date change.
 

freediver

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very impressive !
good job , thank you for your effort
So VR is an improvement in many parts
 

Akonoypi

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Thanks to all! Very good. Got it saved, printed & bookmarked for future reference.
 

sfgerl

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Awesome!!! Thanks! Sounds like you think that maybe even fewer parts are necessary in this, compared to what Rob was thinking - is that true?
 

Tickleshoes

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Awesome!!! Thanks! Sounds like you think that maybe even fewer parts are necessary in this, compared to what Rob was thinking - is that true?

I was able to get the date changing good by just bending the date jumper spring and making it “stronger.” It remains to be seen how permanent a solution that ends up being.

I do think that it’s a far better base to start from vs an SH. My highlights:

- right canon/minute pinions. It sets with a smooth/tight turning and the hand stack doesn’t wobble!
- better metal finishing
- better reversing wheels,
- true KIF shock springs
- better quality train wheels
- better barrel
- uses gen 3135 stem (unlike SA3135)

Cons:
- balance bridge isn’t adjustable. Those gold nuts are just decoration.
- old school banking pins
- auto bridge isn’t jeweled on the bottom.
- date change spring is weak

If I had another one to actually keep I’d try swapping some jewels around and maybe use an SH mainplate, mainspring, date jumper spring, auto bridge bottom plate, and driving wheel for ratchet wheel. That, IMO would give you the best of the best.
 

d39918

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Curious to see the VR pics, don’t show on Tapatalk unfortunately.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

VIV54

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13/12/17
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Does the finising hugely affect the performance of a component or is it only a matter of look?