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    Originally posted by puretime View Post
    You guys have no ideas how much efforts and time I spent with all the makers to try to help them to make their watches as perfect as possible.

    Why the reps are sill not perfect? Simply because they just CAN’T make them right. They want to make them right more than you can imagine.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    When you have time, while spending some time with the makers, ask them if they can make a 16710 with VR3185 clone movement, there is a HUGE slice of market that NO high end replica factory covers (except BP, but BP's 16710 is trash).

    Thanks
    "What's the biggest tell in a rep?"

    "You!"

    Comment


      Originally posted by puretime View Post

      Nope because it is not a big update. They updated the movement (using VR3135) and some minor things. Will post more when I have it.


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
      Wow, I have been resisting to the temptation of buying an ARF v3 and a spare vr3135 for months, now I read this...can't believe that once in a while I make a correct decision

      Comment


        Originally posted by Fab87pz View Post

        Wow, I have been resisting to the temptation of buying an ARF v3 and a spare vr3135 for months, now I read this...can't believe that once in a while I make a correct decision
        Lol good one bro

        Comment


          Don’t get Some of the hate here
          I’ll probably get ten haters or smart ass comments for saying this but Some people must have little to no idea how things are actually manufactured and how tolerances and variations factor in to the production of certain items. I’ve been in this industry for a long time I think an example of what Angus is trying to say

          factories outsource a lot of work and not always from the same vendors every time depending on availability of materials machine downtime and labour ect ect. if you think that one factory has every little part for these reps made under one roof by the same machine the same dies, the same tooling, operators and then qc’d by the same guy for every version you are naive and need to understand a few basics in process engineering. Even Rolex outsource some parts,..for instance when you buy your gen parts what do you think the company does who’s names printed on the little bits of paper that Rolex hands come mounted on?? You think they make the paper lol, no that’s the hand manufacturer Rolex outsourced to make their hands and that company makes hands for other Swiss watch companies. I couldn’t care how much if a pro some people think they are because they looked at five Rolex’s under a microscope and can say every single part in a model series is 100% identical because it’s a Rolex....you are wrong... they have variations just like all other factories that manufacture anything.

          Before people comment that there’s no variance in batches from watch companies show me the calibrated equipment you used to determine your results... unfortunately your calibrated eyeballs don’t count. Everything is manufactured in batches and things do change... and not always on purpose to fool people or to “trick the counterfeiters” There are acceptable variations to a standard in a process from PPQ to QC for everything that’s made. it’s sometimes impossible for Rolex to make a product design for ten years and make it identical through every batch. This is because over time things like base materials vendors change products or suppliers, new machines, new tooling- worn tooling over time and new proceedures From start to finish the list goes on and on.

          Because of these industry factors Even if there are CAD drawings converted to CNC programs not every factory uses the identical technology and vendors could change basically due to cost, unit vs time capability or material availability.

          we get the fact that factories like noob keep making intentional mistakes to sell their next version and keep us buying “the next best thing” but once advertised the variations from that point on may not always be intentional. Give the factories a chance and at least Angus is communicating with us through the production process.

          Plus if one factory makes the perfect replica sub then it’s over! where’s the fun in the this hobby of modding. We’d all just have the same identical fake sub. some of us miss the point of all this... it’s a hobby and we enjoy the hunt.



          Comment


            Oh and Apologies for the rant ^

            Comment


              Originally posted by mnkoshka View Post
              Oh and Apologies for the rant ^
              I completely agree with the points you make.

              Rolex can't get a Submariner consistent either - that thing we call 'period correct' is basically batch variation / fuckups.

              Edit - agree with Tobel - Thanks puretime for the insight, and a preview of the progress on this version.
              Last edited by muiramas; 07-09-20, 15:07.

              Comment


                Originally posted by mnkoshka View Post
                Oh and Apologies for the rant ^
                Please don't, I just want to say thank you. I don't understand how some people can behave this way with Angus who's been sharing so much more insights than we usually do, without any understanding of how things work. So in the midst of all of this your post is more than welcome.

                And thank you puretime for the efforts and transparency here, this is much appreciated.

                Comment


                  Let’s not kill the messenger! Fair enough to point out flaws in reps. But at least let’s talk to Angus in a sober tone and respect his help. He could choose not to do it at all. Let’s appreciate that

                  puretime thanks and much appreciated first hand insight which we normally don’t get much of here.
                  My reviews: A.L.&S. 1815 Tourbillon V2 - VC Traditionnelle Tourbillon - VC Traditionnelle - Patek 3800 gen vs Patek 5711 PPF - Patek 5070P Saatchi London Ltd. Edi - Patek 5089G Azulejos - Patek 5524G - Patek 5975R - Patek 5205G - Patek 6102R Celestial Moon Age - Richard Mille 035-02 ZF (crown rubber change).

                  FOR SALE: A. Lange & Söhne Saxonia Thin Copper Blue

                  Collection inspirational thread.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by puretime View Post

                    It’s not the first time the maker goes one step forward and two steps back?

                    The workers making the cases are different for different versions and maybe they are made in different factories. They just can’t make them consistent my friend, the cases came and they don’t know what’s wrong and they released them.

                    When the stocks are selling fast and they don’t even have time to check their cases. Sometimes they found flaws but they have to sell them as they were because if they don’t and people will buy from other makers which is in stock.

                    Usually the first batch or the second batch of a watch is the best.

                    Welcome to the rep world.


                    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
                    I like that you speak truthfully and honestly in your replies. Big respect for that!

                    If factories are changing constantly due to whatever reason then I can see the dimensions never really being the same as previous versions. In every metal finishing business, you have them outsource everything to what they call tier 1 suppliers who then write up a contract. For high volume contracts they are usually subjected to bidding from other tier 1 suppliers. Most suppliers have like 3 or 4 different stamping presses...once that contract is established the factory then needs to outsource a die that fits into their presses to make the parts and the bidding process begins again..
                    each factory has different equipment and personnel responsible for different CNC machinery, lathe cutting, EDM machine (wire burning), even the polishing jigg.... I can see it taking 6 to 8 months to come out with a new version. Maybe you can confirm that Angus?

                    its no easy process to begin with, the troubleshooting alone drives die makers insane.

                    That comment about it costing rolex 800 dollars to make a watch cant be true. They probably need teams just to operate each piece of CAD. I've seen metal finishing sites with a staff of engineers and people with PhD's. I can only imagine how many a company like Rolex staff to maintain their facilities and keep that high standard image. Has to bring a cost of atleast 1500 euros.


                    Selling Gen Daytona 116500 bezel.

                    Comment


                      Tobel thanks for the kind words mate I appreciate it.


                      I guess most of the processes in the production of Swiss watches are kept secret So The info is not readily available to the public or even to a factory that try’s to replicate them. So to create something by having to engineer your own processes, tooling and training operators From the get go is a mountain of work.

                      im sure there’s plenty of hidden costs in the production of a Rolex... depending on which model. Factoring In batch rejects, Paying staff through production changeover downtime and shit tons of dollars on advertising.

                      Pretty sure they are registered as a foundation and don’t pay to much tax so I think they do jump on the RRP just a little Hahaha.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by mari115 View Post

                        When you have time, while spending some time with the makers, ask them if they can make a 16710 with VR3185 clone movement, there is a HUGE slice of market that NO high end replica factory covers (except BP, but BP's 16710 is trash).

                        Thanks
                        It could be an instant buy for a lot of people!

                        Comment


                          tommorow is the day boys. the week is officially here

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by jm_brc_7057 View Post
                            Let’s not kill the messenger! Fair enough to point out flaws in reps. But at least let’s talk to Angus in a sober tone and respect his help. He could choose not to do it at all. Let’s appreciate that

                            puretime thanks and much appreciated first hand insight which we normally don’t get much of here.
                            well said mate.

                            puretime thanks al lot for such detailed updates and welcoming inputs from the forum

                            Comment


                              Just to clarify, does this topic include both the LN and LV models (sorry couldn’t tell from initial post). I thought this would have been a teaser for the new RXF models, since this was announced approximately the same time the RXF ones were being introduced.

                              There’s one other review post on the RXF going through their impressions on the watch and it seemed like they nailed it.


                              Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by mnkoshka View Post
                                we get the fact that factories like noob keep making intentional mistakes to sell their next version and keep us buying “the next best thing” but once advertised the variations from that point on may not always be intentional. Give the factories a chance and at least Angus is communicating with us through the production process.

                                Plus if one factory makes the perfect replica sub then it’s over! where’s the fun in the this hobby of modding. We’d all just have the same identical fake sub. some of us miss the point of all this... it’s a hobby and we enjoy the hunt.
                                I was right behind you until this last part. I always thought the 'intentional mistakes' was an urban myth or a joke. But to have it put out there in black and white is a little.....enlightening. Further, it makes me think that all these 'factories' arent so independent.....more like a family run business that has many branches under different names. Thank you for pulling back the curtain on the wizard of Oz.

                                Modding a watch isnt a hobby of mine. I just want a quality replica without intentional mistakes that keep me chasing a plastic carrot.

                                Comment

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