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"Age Before Beauty": Most Reliable Movements?

spencerswagu

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16/8/20
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Hi RWI Friends -

Recently ordered a couple Subs, including the illustrious ZZF V2 with the RXF (a new competitor, and supposed fusion between the XF and VSF factory). One of the most fascinating things reading through RXF review by Andrew from Trusty Time is this quote: "Factory says that they chose to make it with the Asian 2824 movement first, because it is a relatively more stable movement than the Asian 3135."

Wow - the RXF creators (a team specifically assembled to challenge ZZF) intentionally chose to use a movement that does not reflect Gen. For the sake of reliability. As a novice, this makes a lot of sense. What's the point of having a super clone if the actual timekeeping is sub-par.

To start the discussion, I pose two main questions:

(1) What do you think matters more: (a) having a correct 1:1 movement or (b) the movement's precision and reliability.
and
(2) Which movement do you think wins the Reliability battle?

There's an pretty good run-down here on Reddit. But I'd love your opinion. Is it the Asia ETA clones? A real Miyota movement modified? A 3135 clone after a service? Or something else? ---> assuming we're going for time-keeping as a #1 priority.


BONUS QUESTION:

Sellita - a famous swiss movement contract manufacturer - makes exact ETA movements, now that the patent has expired. They are highly accurate and indeed Sellita used to / still supplies movements and parts to the Swatch Group. For $150-something you can buy effectively a real off-patent ETA movement from Sellita.

What do you guys think of: buying Rep with A2824 asian clone, swap it for a Sellita SW200-1 --- a supposedly identical movement. In my newb opinion, this would give you the aesthetics and feel of a rep, but with real swiss timekeeping. C'mon look at that Sellita factory on youtube. Precision.



Thanks,
- Spence
 

JYK52800

Known Member
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For me, reliability is king. Whether that applies to cars, watches, electronics, etc. That's why I prefer eta movements, the good ol 2824, 2836, and 7750. I just had BK replace the movement in Noob YM with a gen 2824 and I'm planning on doing the same with my other reps as funds permit.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
 

fabbrisd

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24/12/12
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It will be interesting to see if the R-Guru's come back out for this "discussion" again-one-more-time..

There dedicated and respected enthusiasts on this forum that are Mad-Modder's that love doing their own Mad-Modding - whether dial, hands. crystals, and/or their own movement assembly/reassembly/adjustment/repair - where Modding is their main "kick".

Then there are those enthusiasts here that are Non-Modder's - where owning and/or wearing is their main "kick" and have no urge to become Mad-Modder's , although there are those Non-Modder's that may contract out a specific mod(s) from a amiable Mad-Modder.

" the good ol 2824, 2836, and 7750" - is kindof "funny" since now-a-days almost all are Asian - as the Swiss have become much more brand-specific and/or have withdrawn from the generic movement business. The Asian's are split into multitude of clone manufactuers/assemblers - I was a Director of Seagull in China for a turn.

The "ol ETA" are familair from outside-in and inside-out and in Asia easily adjusted/corrected/repaired - sortof a modern-day Ford model A.

Asian "Rolex" clones do not have anywhere the production volume of "ETA's" ..

I am a Non-Modder, by choice as I don't have the time.. to me stability is the priority on my rep choices...
 
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p0pperini

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Thanks for bringing the wisdom of Reddit to RWI. The members here will really appreciate it. Because if there’s one thing I’d say about RWI, it’s that there’s a general lack of expertise and in-depth knowledge.
 

spencerswagu

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Thanks for bringing the wisdom of Reddit to RWI. The members here will really appreciate it. Because if there’s one thing I’d say about RWI, it’s that there’s a general lack of expertise and in-depth knowledge.


Erg have to disagree with ya here p0pperini -- I feel the expertise on RWI is actually really strong.
 

spencerswagu

You're Saying I Can Sell?
16/8/20
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For me, reliability is king. Whether that applies to cars, watches, electronics, etc. That's why I prefer eta movements, the good ol 2824, 2836, and 7750. I just had BK replace the movement in Noob YM with a gen 2824 and I'm planning on doing the same with my other reps as funds permit.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Yeah I totally agree. Especially with Subs, there isn't even an open case back. How difficult was the replacement of the A2824 with Gen? Curious how much the (a) movement and (b) swap-out work actually costs.

Have you tried Sellita? People in the homage watch and legit micro-brand worlds are using them a ton now.

Thanks,
 

YellowFin

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28/1/20
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But I'd love your opinion. Is it the Asia ETA clones? A real Miyota movement modified? A 3135 clone after a service? Or something else? ---> assuming we're going for time-keeping as a #1 priority.
You're on the right path with the whole A2824/ETA/Sellita thing, but: time-keeping (accuracy) is something entirely different than reliability. I honestly couldn't care less if a movement loses five second more or less per day as long as it survives 20+ years with a little maintenance.
 

spencerswagu

You're Saying I Can Sell?
16/8/20
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Getting back to the task at hand (as much as we all love dumping on Reddit).

Couple discussion topics:

Level 1: What's the most reliable Rep movement?

Level 2: What would be the best mod you could do? Seeing suggestions for A2824, then replacing with ETA or Sellita 200W

Level 3: Immediate service - what's the value here? Worth doing something like the $120 service add-on from Andrew / Trusty Time. Or better to get here in the US, then send to a watchmaker. Pros/cons?


Humbly yours,
- Spencer
 

KSolid21

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29/1/19
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I think this a great thread. Personally, I always go Asian eta. It seems that at this point the 2824 clone has done well and will offer less issues than some of the clone Rolex movements. It makes sense since this older movement has been in production for so long and so many factories have reproduced it both in Switzerland and China. I don’t service my Asian eta’s. I rather wear them into the ground and then do a movement swap with a gen eta or maybe a seagull. I have very little watch making knowledge, but that’s the route I’ve chosen.
 

Katarsis

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Erg have to disagree with ya here p0pperini -- I feel the expertise on RWI is actually really strong.

VSgBJ.jpg
 

Katarsis

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If you want to add gen parts it's a good idea to use the clone movements. The SH isn't that bad as it used to be. One of mine ran plus minus zero seconds straight from factory. If it isn't working as it should have it serviced.
ZjoCDF.jpg


When building my modded SD43 I'm going for a Swiss 2836 because I'm not going to use gen hands or dial. The ETA movement is equally cheap to buy as a service.

For my Navitimer franken I opted to service the A7753 due to the cost difference. 600€ for Swiss and 180€ for the service.

This one also run great numbers.

pQKDi.jpg
 

Alberein

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I have it clear, I am not going to buy watches with cloned machinery, I prefer A2824 or A2836 machinery, they can always be exchanged for Swiss machinery, instead I understand that cloned ones cannot be exchanged for other machinery. so my vote is for the A2824 / A2836
 

Specter1000

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My 2 cents...1) I prefer reliability...coupled with parts availability. I can't tell you how many watches I have worked on that become junk parts donors because I can't source repair parts. 2) There is nothing wrong with the clone ETA 28xx's. I have used tons of them in watches. The key is "properly serviced". There is a noticeable difference in manufacturing when looking at a gen ETA, but the clones do well when serviced and can save you a ton of money.
 
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Katarsis

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My 2 cents...1) I prefer reliability...coupled with parts availability. I can't tell you how many watches I have worked on that become junk parts donors because I can't source repair parts. 2) There is nothing wrong with the clone ETA 28xx's. I have used tons of them in watches. The key is "properly serviced". There is a noticeable difference in manufacturing when looking at a gen ETA, but the clones do well when serviced and can save you a ton of money.

Yes, but the price difference between service and a brand new ETA isn't big. I wouldn't service a 28xx.
The clones and 7750 is a different story.

​​​​​
 
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Complete

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I used to be a die hard swiss eta 2824/2836 guy.

Since then I’ve worked on a few VR and SH3135’s. New VR3135 can be had for $160. It takes genuine parts.

I much prefer working with the rolex movements compared to the ETA.

I’m heading this direction now. Especially since the swiss eta’s are getting more rare and expensive.
 
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Hinclimincli

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But you don’t need an ETA anymore. You can get a top grade Sellita SW220 for less than $250, it will outlast you and servicing will be cheap (and almost any decent watchsmith will be able to perform it).
 
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