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Sacre Bleu! Blue Nautilus PPF vs PF comparison

Akra

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Well the funny thing is that of the lot, the only one tool in "studio" or "un-natural" lighting conditions, appears to be grey

We could go on and on about that color issue, in the end, they are all close enough to me
This is actually not considered enough; not only are the lighting conditions different each time. 90% is also heavily photoshopped. Especially on instagram.
 

Ultra929

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Glaude Good points as always.

Less filter here:

VxhtJZ.jpg
 
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Ultra929

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People keep blaming Instagram and filters but when I take pics of all my watches - 20 or more why do they always look exactly the same as in real life? I have a PF and an MKF. All the pics I’ve taken look just like they are when I take them!

Ive inspected gen 5711s and this is how they look even if slightly filtered.
 

Akra

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People keep blaming Instagram and filters but when I take pics of all my watches - 20 or more why do they always look exactly the same as in real life?

That's because you are one person. And most likely account for less than 0.001% of all watch pictures on instagram.
Some people don't edit them. Most people do.
 

Ultra929

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Akra what I’m saying is it slightly changes the color but still looks very close. I’ve read thousands of threads on RWI over the years and literally the ONLY people that have ever mentioned filters “changing” the dial color is the PPF owners!

Haven’t seen the blue dial IWC guys saying anything, no blue dialed Yachtmasters said a thing! No AP 15400 guys blamed filters. They just admitted the dial colors are wrong and we all agreed.

Sorry to argue this point and we can move on. ????
 

Pope

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I can only assume Pope made a typo by saying its superior to the gen PP lol.
But the only thing the PF has got over the PPF is the case & crown. That's it.
PPF's blue dial color is better, nowhere near perfect though
PPF's datewheel is better - I highly doubt anybody can spot the difference with gen.
PPF's lume is better
Both movements are miles off so the jewel color is irrelevant.
Can't comment on the bracelet differences, but I do agree the ceramic bearing QC is unacceptable. But then again; both factories seem to have issues with marker alignment aswell so QC isn't what its supposed to be on both sides.
Both are nice reps, is the PPF worth the upgrade? Totally up to yourself.
No, I actually mean the proportions of the bezel although inaccurate look pretty good to me, I don't know if that's the case from all angles, but from the front I think it looks better than the real one. It's a mistake from PPF but a happy one.
(this an esthetic judgement, obviously the quality of the real Patek Phillipe is superior)
 
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ixnay07

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Akra what I’m saying is it slightly changes the color but still looks very close. I’ve read thousands of threads on RWI over the years and literally the ONLY people that have ever mentioned filters “changing” the dial color is the PPF owners!

Haven’t seen the blue dial IWC guys saying anything, no blue dialed Yachtmasters said a thing! No AP 15400 guys blamed filters. They just admitted the dial colors are wrong and we all agreed.

Sorry to argue this point and we can move on. ????

Agree with you on moving on. I think most of us have moved on -- recommend you move on too. Thanks! :D
 
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Ultra929

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ixnay07 what are you “recommending” that I move on from? When you say “I think most of us have moved on” who exactly are you speaking for?

I had moved on until I read your comment.

The reason I joined this forum was so experts could lead me in the direction of the best reps. I’m merely pointing out the obvious as thousands of other threads have about hundreds of other watches. These types of posts are typically considered valuable feedback and reasons to buy or not to buy a particular version. If you like the PPF so be it.

So, go tell everyone else that points out obvious flaws on the Submariner that you recommend them moving on. And my “recommendation” to you: if you have something to contribute, please do.
 

rcom440

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PPF superior to the genuine? I suppose it’s all speculative and subjective but the goal in replication of these watches by Chinese factories is accuracy. The PPF falls short in bezel proportion, crown size, datewheel font size, the blue dial is very far off, the jewels are too red and 4 members have reported the ceramic bearing on clasp popped off - so there’s quality issues. A couple members have reported the bracelet feels flimsy or cheap compared to PF.

The PF on the other hand is extremely accurate to gen proportions in bezel and case. Early on some complained the bracelet was stiff and wouldn’t fit small wrists - and most found it bent or stretched with some wear and could be easily modded. Some complained the lume was too green or the rotor made noise, then others mentioned the gen had similar lume color in light and the rotor is known to be loud on gen, and nothing a drop of oil can’t fix. The dial color is a bit off to be certain and the date font is as well but a new date wheel is available and with that mod, the PF is a very nice rep.

Post like that only confuse new members on this forum.

I will say it again PPF is BETTER rep than PF
I could list all the flaws on PF and list is way-way longer than flaws on PPF
 
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Ultra929

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Again sorry to be argumentative about this and my only goal was to help members.

How my post “confuses members” by me reading all the threads then listing known flaws is a mystery but I am now out. Enjoy your PPFs.
 
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Chaosg

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PPF superior to the genuine? I suppose it’s all speculative and subjective but the goal in replication of these watches by Chinese factories is accuracy. The PPF falls short in bezel proportion, crown size, datewheel font size, the blue dial is very far off, the jewels are too red and 4 members have reported the ceramic bearing on clasp popped off - so there’s quality issues. A couple members have reported the bracelet feels flimsy or cheap compared to PF.

The PF on the other hand is extremely accurate to gen proportions in bezel and case. Early on some complained the bracelet was stiff and wouldn’t fit small wrists - and most found it bent or stretched with some wear and could be easily modded. Some complained the lume was too green or the rotor made noise, then others mentioned the gen had similar lume color in light and the rotor is known to be loud on gen, and nothing a drop of oil can’t fix. The dial color is a bit off to be certain and the date font is as well but a new date wheel is available and with that mod, the PF is a very nice rep.

Hi guys, well, moving on is good, but having some points discussed in an objective manner is even better ;). It seems to me that some arguments here are more related to the ownership of each piece , which is understandable bc we tend to give more attention to the flaws on the others' ones, ;)

So, please let's see first a video of the new genuine 5711 white and blue, and I'll discuss the points in sequence




So, the comparison of PPF white is well known already, and recent side by side with genuine proves how good it is. Basically, the angle of bevel on bezel and the protruding crown are the evident flaws, given the fact the thinner date font is quite similar to the updated gen ( see video). I'd say that IMHO a gen dial is no longer in need for a project for white one...

For the PPF blue, the colour is really a thing that has to be improved -- it's surely off. Lots of good pics of yours guys show a good colour in certain angles, but in other angles not ( as you can see in the OP's pics - sorry OP ! ). I'd say that if we could get a side by side with gen blue would kill this doubt once and for all. But anyway if you have your PPF blue, watch the video and see how similar or not the dials are.

There's at the end of video a 5712 showing up too. And colour is quite similar to 5711's . I do know for sure that 5712 and 5711 pre 2018 are quite similar colour too, therefore I'd say that 5711's versions ( pre e pos 2018) are quite similar too. There's a pic in the beginning of video with the two versions side by side but lighting is not the best to show the subtle differences or lack thereof.


About PF's points, it seems PF got the bevel better but I cannot say about the other dimensions of case and even bezel -- I'd need to see a good comparison in order to affirm that. But as the thickness is bigger than PPF's, well some dimensions are not correct, right? I reckon that PF was an excellent first attempt for a good 5711 ( excluding the DW font , of course).

BTW, genuine 5711 has indeed a flimsy bracelet .... :)

Last, PF dial is well regarded bc for most of you guys it looks similar to genuine. Well, IMHO it's far off from truth - sorry for my frank opinion. Let's forget about the indices placement ( huge tell it's a fake watch), also forget about the stock DW :sick-1: ... , hands...., it looks like the colour would be the only good thing, correct?

I have pointed this out already, but let's do it again. See the following post


https://forum.replica-watch.info/forum/patek-philippe/7512902-pf-5711-vs-pp-5712


As you can see, the lack of grey tones makes the PF dial too much electric blue and quite off. Remember -- 5712 is similar colour to 5711, specially on pre 2018's .



So, if you like your PPF or PF that's the most important thing to start with. But if you want to get a piece that is the closest possible to the genuine look, well, we have to wait for those factories to try a bit harder on blue ones. I believe they can do better, for sure. On other hand, the white one V2 is amazing ..... ;)

cheers
 

Ultra929

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Chaosg Well spoken. Agreed and thanks. That’s exactly how we get to the bottom of which rep has which positive and negative attributes.
 
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ixnay07

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Hi guys, well, moving on is good, but having some points discussed in an objective manner is even better ;). It seems to me that some arguments here are more related to the ownership of each piece , which is understandable bc we tend to give more attention to the flaws on the others' ones, ;)

So, please let's see first a video of the new genuine 5711 white and blue, and I'll discuss the points in sequence




So, the comparison of PPF white is well known already, and recent side by side with genuine proves how good it is. Basically, the angle of bevel on bezel and the protruding crown are the evident flaws, given the fact the thinner date font is quite similar to the updated gen ( see video). I'd say that IMHO a gen dial is no longer in need for a project for white one...

For the PPF blue, the colour is really a thing that has to be improved -- it's surely off. Lots of good pics of yours guys show a good colour in certain angles, but in other angles not ( as you can see in the OP's pics - sorry OP ! ). I'd say that if we could get a side by side with gen blue would kill this doubt once and for all. But anyway if you have your PPF blue, watch the video and see how similar or not the dials are.

There's at the end of video a 5712 showing up too. And colour is quite similar to 5711's . I do know for sure that 5712 and 5711 pre 2018 are quite similar colour too, therefore I'd say that 5711's versions ( pre e pos 2018) are quite similar too. There's a pic in the beginning of video with the two versions side by side but lighting is not the best to show the subtle differences or lack thereof.


About PF's points, it seems PF got the bevel better but I cannot say about the other dimensions of case and even bezel -- I'd need to see a good comparison in order to affirm that. But as the thickness is bigger than PPF's, well some dimensions are not correct, right? I reckon that PF was an excellent first attempt for a good 5711 ( excluding the DW font , of course).

BTW, genuine 5711 has indeed a flimsy bracelet .... :)

Last, PF dial is well regarded bc for most of you guys it looks similar to genuine. Well, IMHO it's far off from truth - sorry for my frank opinion. Let's forget about the indices placement ( huge tell it's a fake watch), also forget about the stock DW :sick-1: ... , hands...., it looks like the colour would be the only good thing, correct?

I have pointed this out already, but let's do it again. See the following post


https://forum.replica-watch.info/forum/patek-philippe/7512902-pf-5711-vs-pp-5712


As you can see, the lack of grey tones makes the PF dial too much electric blue and quite off. Remember -- 5712 is similar colour to 5711, specially on pre 2018's .



So, if you like your PPF or PF that's the most important thing to start with. But if you want to get a piece that is the closest possible to the genuine look, well, we have to wait for those factories to try a bit harder on blue ones. I believe they can do better, for sure. On other hand, the white one V2 is amazing ..... ;)

cheers

thanks Chaosg — you have definitely demonstrated the right way to discuss pros and cons of reps in as objective a manner as possible :)


Sent from the RWI App
 

Glaude

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This is an endless debate, that's why moving on was a good thing, pretty much everything has been said about the colour of the blue dial, so unless a new version comes out, I don't think this will lead to anything but confusion, again and again.

The colour is off, evidently, it's not a gen and the colour obsession of Patek will prevent any rep to be a perfect match.

But I disagree with pretty much everything you said in your last post Chaosg about the colour comparison. I could use the same analogy by saying that in certain angle the PP look electric blue and surely there's enough natural and non-natural light photo on the web that proves it.

And this starts the endless debate that there isn't one blue dial colour, there's multiple hence why Patek serialise their dial production on this particular model. It's Patek yes, but this isn't a flagship model for them, it's a popular one, but far from their high-end stuff, variability is a thing even at Patek.

In the end, those colours are good, certainly no instant tell, as long as people like them, they have a good range of choice between MKF, PF and PPF and that's very likeable
 
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Chaosg

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This is an endless debate, that's why moving on was a good thing, pretty much everything has been said about the colour of the blue dial, so unless a new version comes out, I don't think this will lead to anything but confusion, again and again.

The colour is off, evidently, it's not a gen and the colour obsession of Patek will prevent any rep to be a perfect match.

But I disagree with pretty much everything you said in your last post Chaosg about the colour comparison. I could use the same analogy by saying that in certain angle the PP look electric blue and surely there's enough natural and non-natural light photo on the web that proves it.

And this starts the endless debate that there isn't one blue dial colour, there's multiple hence why Patek serialise their dial production on this particular model. It's Patek yes, but this isn't a flagship model for them, it's a popular one, but far from their high-end stuff, variability is a thing even at Patek.

In the end, those colours are good, certainly no instant tell, as long as people like them, they have a good range of choice between MKF, PF and PPF and that's very likeable

Merci, monsieur :)

I was not intending to create or fuel a debate, as a matter of fact.

I do agree that you can achieve certain shades depending on the light source, either for gen or reps


What I am intending in fact is to show side by side comparisons , where there is no doubt and both pieces would react to the same light source. I did post on other thread a comparison I've done few years back between my gen and the SW200, and IMHO the later is much closer colourwise to gen than the PF's or PPF's.

This is not intended for creating any further heated discussion because, I hope, the images could speak by themselves. It's only for the sake of information.

cheers
 
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Ultra929

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This is how the forum members have created the NWBIG list, by social interaction and research.

A thread on repgeek had gen owner post pics in same light with his PF. And his comments below. I do agree the dial color, datewheel, and marker placement is off. Personally, I wish a factory would come up with an NWBIG 5711. But I’m not going to pretend that it’s happened.

Just wanted to contribute the pics of both side by side as you mentioned Chaosg

V2HMXX.png

V2HnJf.jpg
 
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Glaude

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the NWBIG list

:rolleyes:

by social interaction and research.

Not denying or refusing that, but everything has been said so far about the current release, no need to come back again and again and again on it.
People forget too fast what it's like to be a noob here, looking for informations, due to this endless back and forth about the same things, good and documented posts are lost, and people are too !
It's a bloody nightmare to find a reliable information because of that
 
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Ultra929

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Always has been a nightmare doing the research Glaude. Need to hear all info. Part of the hobby. I actually enjoy it. That’s why memebers are always telling new members to “do a search and read the thread on it.”

The info i posted above is from a gen 5711 owner comparing a PF. How is that confusing? I’d consider it reliable info.

By the way I loved your web page review on the MKF V5.
 

Glaude

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The info i posted above is from a gen 5711 owner comparing a PF. How is that confusing? I’d consider it reliable info.

And as you see, I didn't dis it or even made a single comment about it ! No problem with that, I don't find this post confusing. It's a great info, and go well with what I've been saying : blue colour way off ? Get you eyes checked ! Blue colour not exactly the same ? Of course it's not.

Always has been a nightmare doing the research Glaude

And that's exactly why I'm enforcing a stricter policy regarding comments in highly commented release. There's absolutely no need nor reason that research should be a nightmare.

Of course opposing opinions are a good thing, people can make their mind on which point bother them or not, discussion and debate are welcomed, as long as they follow what should be the ultimate rule on a forum : share with documentation, sources or factual content, or put the necessary quote on what you said (you as in the one posting, not you in particular).

We perfectly know how to decode information, because we are used to either the people commenting or the subject, or both. But I think each contribution should always be made with the future noob reader in mind.

Doing research is a thing, being more confused after the research than before isn't really needed.

People like to go over and over the same subject because other people can't digest the fact that their rep isn't perfect. I perfectly know the flaw of my reps, I perfectly know that other rep can be better, and if you read my review, you see that I'm only factual and when I emit an opinion, I take all the precautions necessary to ensure that the reader only see it as an opinion.

I encourage debate and I'm happy to see that some of the most annoying personas aren't around as much as before, the PPF release thread was at a moment, a pure mess, each new thread about the nautilus has been very good since.

And to be clear, there's no censorship in here, I will never censor anything said even if I don't like it, however everyone should expect some snarky remarks for other users when it's done :lol:
 
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Ultra929

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Right on Glaude. Appreciate your comments. ;-)