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Who's got the best sub?

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brian_05

Known Member
16/3/06
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"allowed in our special super secret club"




. . . . you guys have a super secret club and never told me ????







I wouldn't want to recommend a watch with an Asian movement in it to someone just starting out with reps. After reading Ziggy/Joe's posts a while back on the old RWG, and recomending that the movements be cleaned & oiled, even right off the bat, I tend to avoid any watch with one. For less than the cost of the clean/oil, you could find a number of them (Subs, SDs, GMTs, etc.) with the ETA movements. I can't think of a quicker way to turn a newbie away from reps than to have their watch bite after a short period of time, and then find out it will cost more than they paid for the watch to get a new movement, and get it installed.


B


 

THOR509

Renowned Member
12/4/06
686
1
0
Im a three day old noobie

This recomendation for a 108$ sub was exactually what I needed . Thanks , I bought one . It will act as a guide to compare others too and will be used as a daily beater . This thread made crystal clear what the noobmariner is and its exactually a perfect starting place for me. I havent recieved it yet but it cant be too awfull at that price,. after all i can get any number of very reliable chinese watches locally for <50$ or so , and if it is not of comparable quality, then theres someything horribly wrong with this whole rep thing! And I need to know that from my own expierience:) When I recieve it, based on what i get value wise, im ready to pull the trigger on 3 more in the coming months, a pam @ 250 OR SO, an omega constallation @ 300$ and a TT blue sub for 250 or so . but i would NEVER buy one of these as an introduction, no matter what advice i recieved !
 
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pugwash

Mythical Poster
30/4/07
7,211
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Re: Im a three day old noobie

THOR509 said:
This recomendation for a 108$ sub was exactually what I needed . Thanks , I bought one . It will act as a guide to compare others too and will be used as a daily beater . This thread made crystal clear what the noobmariner is and its exactually a perfect starting place for me. I havent recieved it yet but it cant be too awfull at that price,.
You will actually be surprised by the quality. I was. I bought mine as a daily beater. Something to wear while I saved up for my dream watch, as soon as I discovered what that was.

Since then, that Sub has got more wear than any of my subsequent watches. It's solid, reliable, exceedingly good quality ... apart from the pearl getting caught on something and falling out, but a replacement Bezel insert later ($10) and it's back on my wrist.

If you bought it as an intro to Replicas, then it'll hook you.

Let's hear it for the Nubmariner!

sub-2.jpg

"This is my Submariner. There are many like it, but this one is mine."
 

Hari Seldon

Active Member
22/3/06
280
1
0
The fact that we are discussing which type of watch to recommend for this question instead of simply insulting the person doing the asking (and ourselves and this site given it's intended purpose) makes me happy to spend most of my time here. There was a time when somebody asking this question would never get any constructive answer, just insults and scorn. Good for the Dark Side that we choose to rise above that!
 

pugwash

Mythical Poster
30/4/07
7,211
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Hari Seldon said:
The fact that we are discussing which type of watch to recommend for this question instead of simply insulting the person doing the asking (and ourselves and this site given it's intended purpose) makes me happy to spend most of my time here.
Well, everyone's discussing. I'm pretty much ranting feverishly. :D

I
heart.gif
my Noobmariner.
 

pugwash

Mythical Poster
30/4/07
7,211
33
0
collector said:
As the previous owner of the longest running replica watch site on the internet (9 years), I would like to reccomend this site
Really? Looks pricey to me. What's with the Japanese movements? I'm wary of unqualified site recommendations, so I'll ask you to say why you recommend it before I accuse you of hijacking my informative thread.
 

Edge

I'm Pretty Popular
15/3/06
1,049
1
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I will end the damn debat once and for all......this is the best sub.....

TD13.jpg


TD13.jpg


td8.jpg


TD6.jpg


TD5.jpg


TD3.jpg



Simple cut and dried, no if buts or mayb's......FACT!!
 

Edge

I'm Pretty Popular
15/3/06
1,049
1
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She is my pride and joy......and eaily the best sub......just ask Randy........and he is vintage rolex GOD....
 

Dutchy

Renowned Member
14/4/06
751
1
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Edge, fully understood!! I just love the way its turning out everytime you post it, veeeeeeeeery nice vintage look!
 

THOR509

Renowned Member
12/4/06
686
1
0
noobmariner revisited please read:)

well i recieved my noob mariner [ in blue tho] from andrew a few weeks ago . it took 10 days to arizona so relax noobies . if you are dealing with andrew or other reputable dealer all will be well eventually wheather you recieve the watch or not ! ive been here over a month and still cant see flaws in phots of less than good watches! that said i have compared mine with photos and useing a 2x magnifier have seen small differences but @ 108$ who the hell cares :)
To me its beautiful and for a cheapie keeps great time , 3.75 SEC a day fast over many days . i can live with that:) it does run down and stop tho but that may be that my left arm is not nearly as active as my right . I had a LITTLE stroke and it slowed down that arm , but i have almost full use of it and the hand , just less active .The watch is , to me , QUITE beautifull and i am fully satisfied, if the auto wind is working [ i dont know that its not], i cant hear or feel it . we will see:) All in all way more watch than 108$ worth . the only thing is with your first rep you know how u feel that everyone is looking at it? well my expierience is that NO ONE NOTICES IT :( dam ! LOL
IM a happy camper , its the PERFECT watch for a noob . its so cheap that even if i find flaws, im not going to feel that ive wasted any money and that imakes it perfect for the noob. A big THANKS pug and all you others :) THOR
 

ccampb1346

Horology Curious
2/11/06
20
0
0
I just recieved TTK's noobmariner in black. Although this is my first Rolex Submariner I have compared it to the gen and it is absolutely astounding how much of a value the Noobmariner is when compared to the gen.

I know the purists on this site spend a lot of money to have a "perfect replica" but for much less money 90% of the guys on here would be happy.
 

gioarmani7428

I'm Pretty Popular
2/9/06
1,399
41
48
Posted this reply to the same question on another board--thought it might be useful here as well:

Without trying to sound pretentious, I'd like to add my two cents if I could; mainly because there's a question about this almost daily. I think you'll find there's a little grey area here, but I believe this might be the simplest & best solution to your question. I've (fortunately and unfortunately) spent a bit of money in an attempt to not only sort this out for myself and others, but to also have a little fun in the process.

First (slightly off track but still relevant) I'd like to say--in the long-run--it's probably wisest to stay away from Asian movements, if you can. Good luck getting non-swiss parts and better luck getting it fixed correctly. I know a lot of people like Asian movements and might disagree with me, but you'll do best to stick with ETA (Swiss movements). They last longer, are a snap to find parts for, and are more reliable over the long-term. Now that we've segued into the ETAs, it's a bit easier to narrow your search from here.

I've ordered from almost every dealer on the boards, and then some (including watches from dealers I did not do business with directly, but instead purchased from other board members), and this is what I've come to find. Please do bear in mind I would never play favorites and I certainly wouldn't allow any relationship--business or personal--interfere with my judgement, so I'll try to be unbiased towards any particular dealer, by attempting to speak only from the fact I've personally encountered from my purchases, and the purchases I've made on behalf and/or at the request of other people.

http://www.trustytime.com/index.php?main_p...products_id=256

(link doesn't work, for some reason--it's the very first sub on his Submariner page)

In an over-all view, I believe Andrew's "relaunched" version of the Submariner (above) to be the best on the current market. This is, of course, a bit generalized but taking into account the aesthetic pros & cons of all the Subs out there, I think this one tilts the scale to it's favor.

Now, the ETA Subs from both Josh & Andrew are much better than the past generations and have better bands, crisper dial prints, and closely perfected crowns & crown-guards. EL's is also a spectacular watch, seeing as it's the same body & band that Andrew sold before replacing it with the "relaunch".

You also have the choice between vintage and non-vintage models. The vintage would probably be more fun to mod. A vintage Sub fresh from the dealers without mods tends to look so new (without, of course, said modifications) that no one will believe it's real, for its "age". And the believability factor is a heavily weighing option (if not the primary reason) for purchasing a Rolex rep; don't believe those who say they don't care about the brand, they just "like the way it looks", as opposed to simply buying the $30 Timex that looks the exact same. ;) So stick with the new design of Sub, if you don't plan on doing much of anything to it, other than wearing it to have the Rolex name on your wrist.

Now similar to almost every other mass-manufactured good on the planet, these Swiss movements are assembled in China. The parts are manufactured in Switzerland, but simply put together elsewhere to absorb a great portion of the labor cost. Eta has their movements assembled in China for most all their buyers: Cartier, Tiffany's, Oris, Baume & Mercier, Tag Heuer, etc. Contrary to popular belief, the vast majority of Swiss movements come oiled--they don't all come dry. If they did, they'd all be dead in a matter of weeks. You most likely won't/shouldn't need to have it serviced (disassembled & oiled) for about 2-3 years of average wear. Most Swiss watch makers suggest a five-year service & cleaning. Also contrary to general consensus, these watches are more waterproof than the credit they're generally given; the sports models, mind you, not the more refined banker's watches like Vacheron Constantin, Patek, etc. It's worth the extra $20, or whatever your area watch-smiths currently charge, to have it pressure tested. I've yet to have one (of my own, or one I've tested for somebody else) that failed waterproofing, and I swim & shower in all of mine.

I'd have to say, depending on which model you're looking for--especially in the Rolex category--Andrew or Josh are your best bet for the best models (go with Davidsen for your Panerai). In true fairness to all the others, the dealers on here are all trustworthy & credible; otherwise they wouldn't be allowed to continue to ply their trade on the board. I've purchased a slew of reps over the past few months, for myself and other people (Subs, GMTs, Datejusts, Daydates, Daytonas, Omegas, Panerai, Cartier, Bulgari, mens & womens, etc...), and I've found these two gentlemen to be the most courteous, the most efficient, and to have the most consistency in their service, their expedited shipping, and their product.

http://perfect-clones.com/

http://www.trustytime.com/

If I had to pick a runner up (in the Rolex category), it would definitely be EL (Eddie Lee).


http://s39.photobucket.com/albums/e186/300thomas/

He's got a great case with almost perfect CGs, and the best dial print out there. I've reason to believe it's the same one Andrew uses in his "relaunch", and the one TTK has in his Asian model as well.

If you don't want to pay the $90 to have your Sub serviced in the next 3 years, or the $20 to pressure-test it, but do wish to swim in your Submariner, then the "perfect" Subs are a good choice for you. I have come to find however, that the "perfect" subs are either utilizing different parts (primarily the cases) that seem to possess slight irregularity's in shape that stray not only from the regular ETA Sub reps, but also the shape of the gens as well. The pearls on the bezel insert tend to be a little flat, rather than having a proper dome shape to them, and the serrated edge on the crowns tend to have more rounded edges, rather than coming to a "point" like they do on the regular Subs. Compared to my gen, the "perfects" also have a date-mag that's a bit too big. A lot of people have the notion that the date window (the white portion of the datewheel that shows through the opening in the dial, directly underneath the cyclops eye) is supposed to almost completely fill the viewing area of the entire cyclops. It's not. In fact, if you take a trip to an AD, you'll see they only fill about 3/4 of the cyclops.

From my own personal experience, I think it's more cost-effective to purchase a regular Sub (the models around $200), and if you wish, pay your smith the extra $90 to have it serviced/oiled (but definitely get it pressure-tested!). This works out much cheaper than the "perfect" Subs, and I feel you'll actually wind up with a better looking watch.

I hope this was helpful.
 

cooter

Active Member
24/2/07
220
0
0
great info

Thanks for the info i got a sub from Andrew. I'm very pleased



gioarmani7428 said:
Posted this reply to the same question on another board--thought it might be useful here as well:

Without trying to sound pretentious, I'd like to add my two cents if I could; mainly because there's a question about this almost daily. I think you'll find there's a little grey area here, but I believe this might be the simplest & best solution to your question. I've (fortunately and unfortunately) spent a bit of money in an attempt to not only sort this out for myself and others, but to also have a little fun in the process.

First (slightly off track but still relevant) I'd like to say--in the long-run--it's probably wisest to stay away from Asian movements, if you can. Good luck getting non-swiss parts and better luck getting it fixed correctly. I know a lot of people like Asian movements and might disagree with me, but you'll do best to stick with ETA (Swiss movements). They last longer, are a snap to find parts for, and are more reliable over the long-term. Now that we've segued into the ETAs, it's a bit easier to narrow your search from here.

I've ordered from almost every dealer on the boards, and then some (including watches from dealers I did not do business with directly, but instead purchased from other board members), and this is what I've come to find. Please do bear in mind I would never play favorites and I certainly wouldn't allow any relationship--business or personal--interfere with my judgement, so I'll try to be unbiased towards any particular dealer, by attempting to speak only from the fact I've personally encountered from my purchases, and the purchases I've made on behalf and/or at the request of other people.

http://www.trustytime.com/index.php?main_p...products_id=256

(link doesn't work, for some reason--it's the very first sub on his Submariner page)

In an over-all view, I believe Andrew's "relaunched" version of the Submariner (above) to be the best on the current market. This is, of course, a bit generalized but taking into account the aesthetic pros & cons of all the Subs out there, I think this one tilts the scale to it's favor.

Now, the ETA Subs from both Josh & Andrew are much better than the past generations and have better bands, crisper dial prints, and closely perfected crowns & crown-guards. EL's is also a spectacular watch, seeing as it's the same body & band that Andrew sold before replacing it with the "relaunch".

You also have the choice between vintage and non-vintage models. The vintage would probably be more fun to mod. A vintage Sub fresh from the dealers without mods tends to look so new (without, of course, said modifications) that no one will believe it's real, for its "age". And the believability factor is a heavily weighing option (if not the primary reason) for purchasing a Rolex rep; don't believe those who say they don't care about the brand, they just "like the way it looks", as opposed to simply buying the $30 Timex that looks the exact same. ;) So stick with the new design of Sub, if you don't plan on doing much of anything to it, other than wearing it to have the Rolex name on your wrist.

Now similar to almost every other mass-manufactured good on the planet, these Swiss movements are assembled in China. The parts are manufactured in Switzerland, but simply put together elsewhere to absorb a great portion of the labor cost. Eta has their movements assembled in China for most all their buyers: Cartier, Tiffany's, Oris, Baume & Mercier, Tag Heuer, etc. Contrary to popular belief, the vast majority of Swiss movements come oiled--they don't all come dry. If they did, they'd all be dead in a matter of weeks. You most likely won't/shouldn't need to have it serviced (disassembled & oiled) for about 2-3 years of average wear. Most Swiss watch makers suggest a five-year service & cleaning. Also contrary to general consensus, these watches are more waterproof than the credit they're generally given; the sports models, mind you, not the more refined banker's watches like Vacheron Constantin, Patek, etc. It's worth the extra $20, or whatever your area watch-smiths currently charge, to have it pressure tested. I've yet to have one (of my own, or one I've tested for somebody else) that failed waterproofing, and I swim & shower in all of mine.

I'd have to say, depending on which model you're looking for--especially in the Rolex category--Andrew or Josh are your best bet for the best models (go with Davidsen for your Panerai). In true fairness to all the others, the dealers on here are all trustworthy & credible; otherwise they wouldn't be allowed to continue to ply their trade on the board. I've purchased a slew of reps over the past few months, for myself and other people (Subs, GMTs, Datejusts, Daydates, Daytonas, Omegas, Panerai, Cartier, Bulgari, mens & womens, etc...), and I've found these two gentlemen to be the most courteous, the most efficient, and to have the most consistency in their service, their expedited shipping, and their product.

http://perfect-clones.com/

http://www.trustytime.com/

If I had to pick a runner up (in the Rolex category), it would definitely be EL (Eddie Lee).


http://s39.photobucket.com/albums/e186/300thomas/

He's got a great case with almost perfect CGs, and the best dial print out there. I've reason to believe it's the same one Andrew uses in his "relaunch", and the one TTK has in his Asian model as well.

If you don't want to pay the $90 to have your Sub serviced in the next 3 years, or the $20 to pressure-test it, but do wish to swim in your Submariner, then the "perfect" Subs are a good choice for you. I have come to find however, that the "perfect" subs are either utilizing different parts (primarily the cases) that seem to possess slight irregularity's in shape that stray not only from the regular ETA Sub reps, but also the shape of the gens as well. The pearls on the bezel insert tend to be a little flat, rather than having a proper dome shape to them, and the serrated edge on the crowns tend to have more rounded edges, rather than coming to a "point" like they do on the regular Subs. Compared to my gen, the "perfects" also have a date-mag that's a bit too big. A lot of people have the notion that the date window (the white portion of the datewheel that shows through the opening in the dial, directly underneath the cyclops eye) is supposed to almost completely fill the viewing area of the entire cyclops. It's not. In fact, if you take a trip to an AD, you'll see they only fill about 3/4 of the cyclops.

From my own personal experience, I think it's more cost-effective to purchase a regular Sub (the models around $200), and if you wish, pay your smith the extra $90 to have it serviced/oiled (but definitely get it pressure-tested!). This works out much cheaper than the "perfect" Subs, and I feel you'll actually wind up with a better looking watch.

I hope this was helpful.
 
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