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AP 14790 36mm genuine dial build

majwilliams0308

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I am just starting this thread to get some opinions and track progress throughout this build.



I was lucky enough to snag an old AP 14790 by BP. This was a popular Royal Oak that was 36mm x 8mm, and had a long running from the 80s through the mid 2000s. BP factory did a replica that was okay but not amazing.

It's the same width (36mm), but is 9.5mm thick, and features what appears to me to be a gen ETA 2824, or one with genuine parts.

However, due to lack of significant recent interest in this model, this is what I have to play with.


oPSxp.jpg

oPphW.jpg

oP9Ds.jpg

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Some measurements - I noticed I didn't take a pic of the width, but it is 36mm without crown.
oXRPb.jpg

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Now, onto the important part (in my opinion) - the dial. The Stern family made the dials for these watches, and I really wanted to get my hands on a genuine Stern dial that had the older style logo with all caps, but I could not find a 36mm version of the dial that had that style font and the word "Automatic" above the 6. The dials that were available during my 3 month search like that were for the AP 4100 - which was the style just prior to the 14790 and utilized the same Cal 2225 movement, but the case was 1mm smaller at 35mm.

I also settled on a white dial, as I have acquired a genuine black dial for the 15300, and blue is either impossible to find, or expensive.

There were 2 variants of the 14790 dial (edit: there were 3, but it was like the 4100 dial below) - short and long indexes, with the short index being more modern, and having an updated date font (kind of like the BP rep date wheel). That being said, I prefer the long indexes as it's a classic look, and it just looks better to me.
odpht.jpg


The 4100, however, has the more aesthetically pleasing dial (to my eyes) than even the 14790 long index. Here's a comparison:
odQRF.jpg


As much as I longed to get a 4100 dial into my 14790, I just REALLY don't think it will fit into the BP case. There are two reasons.

1. Dial size: The 4100 dial is 25.3mm. The 14790 dial is 26.5mm. The dial opening on the case is 25.6mm, so the 4100 dial would be 0.3mm smaller than the opening. Because the rep dial is 27.1mm, the only dial that could fit similarly is the 14790 dial at 26.5mm
oXv4c.jpg

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^^ Taking measurements of 0.6mm to see if the dial would look bad


2. The dial being smaller than the opening wouldn't be as big of an issue if the movement was secured in place with tabs or something similar. However, there are no tabs, the movement and everything is held in place via pressure from the caseback, the crown, and the dial. Evidence of the pressure on the dial can be seen in the pics below. I spent a lot of time trying to see if the dial could feasibly fit.
odPsE.jpg

^^ The dial under macro as it fits in the case
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^^ Some wear at the 50 mark
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^^ Finally the nail in the coffin - see the wear at 45 is really apparent where the pressure is on the dial and seemingly necessary to fit.
oP7h4.jpg

^^ Here is how the movement fits into the case. Note that there are no tabs keeping it in place.

So, I need a 14790 dial for sure.

Now, on to the date disc. There are, in my estimation, probably 4 different variants for the cal 2225 and cal 2325 that the 14790 utilized in its life, but luckily they are all the same size. I found a nice, much older vintage style date disc for a reasonable price.
oT1Aj.jpg

^^ notice the curved "4" and "7", a feature that was revised as AP progressed into the late 90s and early 2000's.
oXsH4.jpg

^^Thankfully the date disc is only 0.20mm thick. The 5402 date disc for the cal 2121 is 0.4mm thick, which is beastly. By comparison, the overlay made by Keylog and spongebob is 0.17-0.18mm thick, so this should be a fine overlay.



So, with my decisions seemingly made for me, I waited to see what kind of deals would pop up on a dial. One did. This 'dial for repair' showed up, and I bought it. It is for the 36mm Quartz movement (notice that there is no 'AUTOMATIC' above the 6). It is the same size at the 14790 dial at 26.5mm, and the date window is in the same place.

oTBJb.jpg

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^^ with the date disc test fitted.
odsQk.jpg

^^ Trying it in the case
odMWD.jpg


After consulting with legend, who graciously gave his insight and knowledge, the markers appear to be made with a brass alloy due to the corrosion, and I am not interested in plating my hands to be a brass color. So unfortunately I made the decision to keep this dial for another day. My question (to those of you still reading) - would this look okay with stainless steel hands?

So with the decision made - due to the lack of "AUTOMATIC" and the brass markers, I was going to go back to my original decision and get a white dial. eBay luckily sent me a nice 20% off coupon code so I got this dial and it is now on the way.

oTCFF.jpg


I am still debating if I pay the extra dough to have the BP Case thinned (or if it even can), or just keep it as 9.5mm is still quite thin.

Also, I am missing some links, so I've ordered a rep bracelet off of AliExpress as it's the only place that has 23mm AP bracelets. Genuine extra links are $250-350 a piece.

Also, a MAJOR shoutout to LuminorReptar who helped a ton with ideas, and encouraging this wonderful hobby/money pit/whatever you want to call it.

Anyways, please give feedback, and let me know what you think!
 
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XLR8R

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Can't wait how its going to turn out GL on your new project.

- XLR8R (Son)
 

SOLEX

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Best of luck, I am definitely going to follow this thread.
 

slaughterer62

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So many questions in such a casually seductive thread... Are you using a cal. 2225/2325 in a BP 14790 mid-case or a 2824? If the 2824, why are you buying gen DWs? Did Spongebob manufacture a vintage 2121 AP font overlay? Addendum: You are lucky to find a BP 14790 still! Once that supply dried up, I stopped doing these types of builds, although many people requested them from me. Quartz dials are cheap fun, no doubt. But that white dial is really nice: use your 20% coupon and get it.
 
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SHB

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This white dial is truly awesome, can't wait to see your final build.
Btw didn't know ebay gifted discount ticket.
 

gamba66

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I always wanted to do a 14790 Franken Build but after extensive research and dead ends I gave up on it. I contacted slaughterer62 several times via PM and he was extremely polite and helpful back then, thanks again.

My main reason not to do this build was the Cartel-, or as you guys call it here, BP-Base of this watch. This was the only available replica version of this watch and it is easily identifiable by the No4206 and E-23473 on the caseback plus the two triangle indentations on inner side of the bracelet.

I had 3 main problems with this older replica which is not comparable to something modern like a JF 15400.

1. The build quality is lacking in terms of the finishing and brushing of the bracelet. Rebrushing is hardly possible due to the glued screws on the bezel.

2. The bracelet looks too stiff in my opinion, which can be seen when the watch stands on its caseside. Since I have skinny wrists a flexible bracelet is important to me. Afaik gen bracelet wont fit

3. The dimensions are very different from an actual 14790. The rep case just looks so different in form and function, when you compare pictures the replica case looks much longer and the bezel, which on the gen is nearly flush with the case, has a distance between the case and itself. I only found this rep as the "Royal Oak Classic" on TD's sites so maybe it was not meant to be an 14790 exactly?.

There is an extensive review of the BP/Cartel "Royal Oak Classic" on RWI where the pictures are still up luckily.

The only other replica I found which had the exact designation of 14790 is the Ultrarare TWBest/WM9 Royal Oak but I was only able to find a case-set which I never acquired because I wasn't sure if a gen bracelet would fit. I have found some pictures in my archive. These are from the wm9 homepage but unfortunately webarchive doesn't host them anymore. But there is another small thumbnail picture of the whitedial wm9 here. Also some more info on the wm9/twbest here. The first picture is from a member of rwg.cc and the other two are from the wm9 site (all pics are down but I saved them). This rep looks excellent and reminds me of my twbest 18239 which I sold here a while ago.
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That all said, this is definitely one of the nicest condition 14790 reps I have seen so far and I am very intrigued to find out what the end-result looks like. You seem to have an amazing collection of franken watches majwilliams0308 would be awesome to see some pictures of them.
 
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majwilliams0308

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So many questions in such a casually seductive thread... Are you using a cal. 2225/2325 in a BP 14790 mid-case or a 2824? If the 2824, why are you buying gen DWs? Did Spongebob manufacture a vintage 2121 AP font overlay? Addendum: You are lucky to find a BP 14790 still! Once that supply dried up, I stopped doing these types of builds, although many people requested them from me. Quartz dials are cheap fun, no doubt. But that white dial is really nice: use your 20% coupon and get it.

So sorry for the late response, but yes I agree very VERY lucky to find one of these! I hunted for another BP 14790 because I found a genuine blue 14790 dial as well that is coming. A user on here graciously gave me (I purchased it of course) his from his collection so I will have two builds.

As to your first question, I'm continuing to utilize the existing 2836 movement in the case, no mods there as the original caliber was a high beat 28800bph.

legend has finished all of the modifications and I am expecting the watches I had him modify come in today, I will post updates!
 
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slaughterer62

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gamba66, thanks for that detailed post. Indeed, the BP/Cartel 14790 "Royal Oak Classic" has its weaknesses: bezel screws are glued into the bezel, the bracelet is very poor, but it provides a nice starter base to mount these smaller RO dials. WM)/TWbest watches re incredibly hard to find these days, as they are long out of production. Too bad no currently operating factory devotes as much attention to the 14790 as they do the 15400s. majwilliams0308 looking forward to your photos. You sound very excited!
 
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majwilliams0308

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So it arrived!

Legend installed the dial and the date disc, but as alluded to, the glued screwed prevented them from being recessed, and thinning the watch would have thinned it maybe 0.3-0.4mm, which wasn't worth the expense for me as it already wears quite thin and that added thinness would have been unnoticeable to me.

That said, legend matched the lume color of the gen dial perfectly on the hour and minute hands.

To your point slaughterer62 , I sincerely agree that I wish there were better reps of this size, as I really think the 36mm is such a fantastic size and the vintage appeal of the watch is absolutely stunning, particularly with the long index markers.

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BIONONE

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Incredible project! From start to finish - really impressed with the outcome.

Maybe our chinese friends will look deeper into the vintage market once the vintage AP market starts to boom in china.

Otherwise there is no much room for additional compliments as it is such a terrific result - congrats!
 

slaughterer62

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Handsome dial, and the gen datewheel used as a DWO is a really nice touch. You planned this build out conscientiously and legend put it together very well. The reward is on your wrist now. Congratulations.
 

Danii

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Absolutely gorgeous build, gen dial and DW makes a worlds difference. If you're ever letting go of this, don't hesitate to let me know..
 
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majwilliams0308

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Thanks everyone! Here are some more glamour shots. The date disc definitely has been beat up (as is evidenced in the left hand side of the "2"

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^^ Here are all of the watches legend worked on for me, all have genuine dials. A good comparison of sizing. For more pics on the others, check my collection thread.
 

Jurgenk

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Beautiful watch, congrats to you and legend for a really well thought out and executed project.

I kind of like the fact that it has vintage looks with the dial, markers and hands, but with a case that is pristine— this rarely exists in nature but takes you back in time the the day when this watch or it’s doppelgänger first left the watch shop on the wrist of its first owner.
 
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oh boy this is my absoulte dream watch.
if you ever let it go i would pay good money for it :p

nevertheless absolutely beautfiul work. i´m really really jealous haha